OK. How will this team respond after the loss to WIU? Will they correct the mistakes that led to big plays or will they think that after playing a scholarship FCS team sort of respectably (lowest FCS loss margin in 11 years), they can just throw their cleats on the field and beat a D-II team? Will they emerge from the tunnel a different team from the past 4 years or will they come out the same as in the past? I will be there to see what the answers are.
One thing I noticed is that St Joe is playing their first game next Saturday. In the past I believe the Pumas had played an exhibition game or a first game before playing Valpo. I do believe this will help Valpo quite a bit if VU can solve some of the big issues at QB and on defense.
Valpo by 20 points
31-21 Saders
I think this one will be close, as it has been the last few years.
Valpo - 33
St Joe - 31
We control the ball and limit our turnovers and come out with a win!
I miss Milan's analysis of our games as he was (IMO) a realist. So, to keep the record straight and honest I'll pick St. Joe by 7. Hell our "D" still stinks we miss Hoffman and therefore our "O" stalls(where are you Leslie). Should we beat St.Joe -yeah. Will we beat St. Joe - hell no! >:(
Quote from: covufan on August 29, 2014, 05:57:20 PM
I think this one will be close, as it has been the last few years.
Valpo - 33
St Joe - 31
We control the ball and limit our turnovers and come out with a win!
Finally some realism! If not slightly optimistic. Brandon Hall could very well be a good reason for that slight optimism. It is also extremely critical that the defense and QB situations improve enough to not let the game slip away. I agree it will be close, I hope.
St Joe 44
Valpo 39
EDIT: Even setshot is so much more real and yet has a degree of optimism that I haven't seen from him in previous years. That actually is a great sign.
Basically, with the exception of Eric at QB and Derbak at LB, this is the same team that lost to SJC last year 34-31 and the year before that 36-34. So the big variable is not the players, it's the new staff. Have they had enough time to change the loser mindset and implement a better set of O and D schemes to make a difference?
If you believe that they have -- we win. If you are not convinced -- we lose. I've talked with the guy (Coach Cecchini) and tried to think like a player, and if I were playing this year I'd be busting my butt to win. With Dale there was a bit of a player/coach barrier, and I do not think the players bought into playing for him. I think Cecchini is a player's coach and they will try their best to live up to his demands. Therefore, I see a close game with the final: Valpo 31 SJC 27.
Valpo 31
St. Joe 24
If the defense tackles better and Green blitzes more, Hutsons knee tweak was no big deal, and QB Stahl get a chance to bring the O to life, then Valpo 35-St Joe 14.
The team has some extra days to prepare which is good. The added time for film study will help to correct basic problems. The tackling issue was mentioned by Coach Cecchini in his post game and Ernest Moore (DC) stated the same. You can be sure that they will be working on that this week as well. The non-conference schedule, to an extent, is the place to experiment with personnel. Nothing improves play and builds confidence like game experience. For that reason, I would like to see Scott Staal get the lion's share of the snaps this game and try to establish a rhythm so we can really see what he can bring to game. Eight passes against WIU is not a fair indicator. I would also like to see Bastin get a few more carries to see what he can do and we have got to find Gladney more often-- yikes, he had zero catches against WIU.
On D, I'd like to see our D-Line involved in more tackles at, near or behind the LOS. Against WIU, who went 6-2, 300 --> 6-2, 290 --> 6-2, 290 --> 6-7 320 --> 6-9, 340 --> 6-5 310 Tackle to tackle our down four (6-3, 245, 6-1, 245, 6-2, 275 and 6-4, 240) had all they could do just to hold their ground. They should be seeing guys more their size against St. Joe's. Looks like freshman Kye Hall is pressing for more snaps at LB
Checking the SJC Football site it looks like they lost their #1 QB to graduation but their #2 is back and he has some game experience. Both the #1 and #2 running backs, who accounted for over 2000 yards of rushing, are back. The #2 and #3 of last year's three leading receivers return as well. There is also a lot of OL size (>280 lbs.) on the roster.
Every year we underestimate the Pumas, and every year, it seems, they have our number. St. Joe knows that we view them as a beatable opponent and that only makes them more determined to knock us off. I think defeating them will be a difficult task. We better bring it or they will hang another L on us.
Paul
Yep. Spot on, Paul!
You can call them ham & eggers all you want but since the Adams era Valpo has never gone into this game being better than St Joe. Valpo fans just have this certain feeling that they should be but the Crusaders certainly have not been better in any category.
This series against St Joe used to remind me of the Valpo MBB vs IPFW but even in that series the Crusaders are better but not playing up to expectations. In football VU hasn't had the superior talent or the belief in themselves to beat St Joe recently.
The record speaks for itself:
First Meeting: 1921
Last Meeting: 2013
Record Vs. St. Joe's: 28-35-2
Last Valpo Win: 2001, 24-7
St. Joe picked to finish third in GLVC.
http://athletics.saintjoe.edu/news/2014/7/29/FB_0729142838.aspx (http://athletics.saintjoe.edu/news/2014/7/29/FB_0729142838.aspx)
Saint Joseph's College garnered the third spot in the preseason poll with 50 points while picking-up the final first-place vote. Cory Sanders is in his third year in Rensselaer, Indiana and welcomes back a Pumas squad that is coming off an 8-3 campaign that included a 5-2 record in league action, good for second place. First-team All-GLVC honorees Braxton Shelton (RB), Tyler Callaghan (HB), Jakob Styla (OL) and Gary Yeoman (LB) return for the Pumas.
SJC also rushed for 224.1 yards per game and a GLVC best 23 touchdowns last season. Braxton Shelton became the fifth back in SJC history to rush for over 1,000 yards last season as he accumulated over 100 yards in a game five times, including a 200 yards, two touchdown performance in a 36-24 victory over Quincy. Kobi Cook will also be in the back-field as he rushed for 827 yards and six touchdowns last season. Both backs with have the luxury of an expereinced offensive line and tight-end corp to open holes at the line of scrimmage.
UIndy was picked first in the GLVC by a big margin
The Greyhounds enter their third campaign as a football-playing member in the GLVC with an undefeated 15-0 conference mark. UIndy finished the 2013 season 10-2 overall and earned its second consecutive NCAA Divison II Playoff appearance. The Hounds received eight of the nine first-place votes only because conference bylaws do not permit a school to vote for itself.
So UIndy voted for SJC because they couldn't vote for themselves--thereby giving the Pumas a distant 2nd place in the Greyhound thinking.
If Valpo is going to advance and be a competitive team, they need to beat teams like St. Joe. It should be expected that they win a game like this.
Drove through Rensselaer this afternoon and saw the Pumas practicing. I'm sorry I couldn't tell Coach Cecchini which defense SJC is going to play.
Two things I learned is that the Purdue football team drove up to Rensselaer last week before their opening game and practiced at one of SJC's open fields in a totally surprise move. I think Darrel Hazell just put the team in a bus and drove up the road to wherever he could find to simulate a road trip.
The other is that Jensen Nowakoski, who was an outstanding athlete in many sports at Lutheran HS in Indy is a defensive coach at St Joe. I tried my hardest to get him to tell me their defensive scheme but unfortunately he knew well that I was a die-hard Valpo guy.
Jensen was real excited about the Saints beating the Ritter Raiders so handily this week. He said he thought Ritter must have gone into the game way over confident and that Lutheran didn't lose many seniors.
Can you imagine, Purdue sneeks into town but I get found out by one of the defensive coaches.
There are quite a few Indy guys from both the catholic and public high schools at St Joe.
Wheeler and Boone Grove have a couple of guys representing their schools on the SJC team and are excited to play in Valpo.
Here's the Dave Cecchini SJC preview interview. This SJC team may be better than their 8-3 team of last year.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2gjJd5zSC0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2gjJd5zSC0)
To refresh our memories:
Thursday, August 30, 2012
Valparaiso entered the fourth quarter of its season opener at Brown Field on Thursday night with a 34-27 lead, but Saint Joseph's (Ind.) scored twice in the final 15 minutes, including a six-yard touchdown run with 24 seconds to play, to down the Crusaders, 36-34.
Saturday, September 07, 2013
The Valparaiso football team entered the fourth quarter at Saint Joseph's (Ind.) with a 23-18 advantage on Saturday, but the Pumas were able to put up 16 points in the quarter, including the eventual game-winning field goal with 4:51 to play, and a late Crusader fourth-down attempt came up short as Valpo fell by a 34-31 final.
Whenever the St. Joe's game comes around every year, I think back to being in the 2001 pre-game defensive meeting and experiencing what was, perhaps, the greatest coaching pep-talk ever. Bernardi had a cut-up put together of a bunch of cheap chop blocks by St. Joe's O-Linmen from prior years and at the end of it took the VHS tape out of the VCR and threw it across the room shattering it into pieces. That game was a 24-7 win. I know very little about the current team but hopefully they can have similar results this weekend.
Thanks for adding that perspective. Always good to hear about personal experiences associated with any athletic event, but even better when it involves throwing things ;D.
In my three years we only won once - 41-8. The rest were close loses -- 7-14 and 14-15. Hated SJC and Butler the most on our schedule back then. I don't think this group of players has developed any rivalry/hatred mindset yet -- heck, they are just trying to win any football game against anyone. But those two close loses in 12 and 13 (and especially the way we let wins get away from us in the 4th qtr) should be a motivating factor for this team because it is within the frame of memory of all but the new freshmen.
The coach's video comments make me feel like I over estimated the points we will score.
CLIPPED FROM THE ST JOE'S FB WEBSITE:
RENSSELAER, Ind. – The Saint Joseph's College football team has been patiently waiting for the opening of the 2014 season. SJC is coming off an 8-3 season, including a three point loss to the University of Indianapolis for the Great Lakes Valley Conference title. The 2014 season will open at Valparaiso University, one of SJC's oldest foes.
The Pumas are addressing the needs at quarterback and receiver offensively. Billy VandeMerkt and Julian Walker graduated, but the remainder of the offense returns for Saturday's opener against Valparaiso University. Tate Borlik, who has seen significant action the past three years, is ready for his opportunity. Borlik played in six games last season, throwing for 646 yards and four touchdowns. He also led the Pumas to an overtime and comeback victory over William Jewell to end the 2013 campaign. This year Borlik will have the luxury of an experience offensive line and one of the best running games in the nation.
SJC finished 28th in the NCAA Division II with 224.1 rushing yards per game last season. Braxton Shelton rushed for over 1,000 yards last season while Kobi Cook added over 800 yards. Anchoring the offensive line is Trent Hall and Jakob Styla who received All-GLVC honors last season.
Defensively the Pumas feature a host of experienced and skilled players ready to add onto the impressive numbers of 2013. SJC allowed a slim 85.2 rushing yards per game, which ranked seventh in the nation. The Pumas also placed 14th in the country in sacks and tackles for loss.
Led by Gary Yeoman and Joel Wimbley the Pumas again feature two the GLVC's best linebackers. Yeoman finished 17th in the NCAA with 18.5 tackles for loss and 30th in sacks. Wimbley was 23rd in the nation with 16.5 tackles for loss. Cody French aids in the development of the defensive line as he finished 2013 with 55 tackles.
Head Coach Cory Sanders has a host of defensive backs that have matured over the past 18 months. SJC allowed 220 passing yards per game last season while making 13 interceptions. Both Yeoman and Wimbley made three interceptions last season.
Saturday's matchup will be the final contest between the Pumas and Valparaiso for the foreseeable future. The Crusaders (0-1) are coming off a 45-6 loss to Western Illinois last Thursday. VU will be guided by Ben Lehman who has taken the offensive controls after the graduation of Eric Hoffman. Lehman threw for 151 yards last week. Brandon Hall rushed for 66 yards on 14 carries while the team recorded 115 yards on the ground. Last season Valpo averaged 280 yards passing and 72 yards rushing.
The past two matchups have seen the Pumas edge the Crusaders. In 2012 SJC picked-up a 36-34 victory while last season the Pumas won a 34-31 contest at Alumni Stadium.
Kyle Hall led the defense with 10 tackles last week, including one for a loss. Melvin Graham III collected nine tackles in the loss to Western Illinois. Hall is a freshman linebacker from New Smyrna Beach, Florida while Graham has played in 20 games in his Crusader career. Graham recorded 45 tackles and two interceptions last season.
Interesting that this is the last match up with St. Joe ' for the "foreseeable" future. Are we trying to change the level of competition?
Quote from: vu72 on September 04, 2014, 12:27:02 PM
Interesting that this is the last match up with St. Joe ' for the "foreseeable" future. Are we trying to change the level of competition?
I asked Cecchini about his OOC scheduling plans at the alumni event in Cleveland earlier this year. He said that his hope was to begin scheduling more games against the other non-scholarship and limited-scholarship programs in DI, hopefully with return dates in Valpo.
It seems pretty ambitious. Hopefully Cecchini is going to start with the likes of Georgetown and Columbia as opposed to Lehigh, Lafayette, Harvard, or Princeton.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
That makes sense -- NEC, Patriot and Ivy are good matchups. USD and Butler played Harvard and Dartmouth in 2012 and look at the games this year: USD-Princeton, JU - Penn). Still think we will see at least one MVFC or Big Sky opponent each year.
Affirmative...he also said that the guarantee games are going nowhere.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Actually, I think it's a good thing to face opponents in similar situations.
It is good to face opponents in the same situation as us. We should only face scholarship programs in years where we need a challenge for a very veteran/experienced team. Too often we've faced the guarantee games with a young, inexperienced team. That gets a lot of players time on the field, but not a good experience at seeing how good they can play, or keep the opponent out of the end zone.
Looks like we are already facing injury issues. Jake is out for the St. Joe game.
Notes: St. Joseph's leads the all-time series 35-28-2. Butler (72) is the only program Valparaiso has faced more on the gridiron. ... Valparaiso starting running back Jake Hutson is expected to be sidelined with a knee injury while top reserves Brandon Hall (ankle) and Grayson Bastin (illness) are both questionable. ... The Crusaders are 48-43-2 all-time in home openers. Valparaiso's last home opening win was on Sept. 13, 2008 when it beat Concordia (Wis.) 34-10. -- Paul Oren
Oddly, that is the position (RB) that Coach C cited going into the season as the one with the greatest depth. That hurts as Lehman and Staal need a strong running attack to open up their passing game. We may see some true freshmen lining up in the backfield. I hope we don't have to rely totally on the passing game or we will lose. Say what you will about Hoffman's singular dimension, he had the skills to operate a pass-heavy offense. I don't think Ben or Scott are at that level yet.
If the running game isn't there, we better figure out how to consistently throw more than the short dump passes. WIU figured out they could lay back and keep the ball in front of them--the same thing every opponent has done for the past few years.
Quote from: VULB#62 on September 05, 2014, 10:29:48 AMSay what you will about Hoffman's singular dimension, he had the skills to operate a pass-heavy offense. I don't think Ben or Scott are at that level yet.
Ah haaaa! So at least you agree that Hoffman had a definite skill we could have used this year and one we have not replaced. Yet!
I better change my score prediction from 44-39 to 44-26.
Quote from: historyman on September 05, 2014, 01:56:41 PM
Ah haaaa! So at least you agree that Hoffman had a definite skill we could have used this year and one we have not replaced. Yet!
Whoa, Historyman. I think you have me confused with another poster. Pure passing ? -- never questioned that (except for inopportune TOs, maybe, but all passers have that as a monkey). I don't think I ever posted a critical comment about him specifically in three years. I
was critical of the offensive system he was playing in and wanted a better rushing attack that was not predicable and created more of a balanced attack. Aside from that, I think we can all agree that Ben and Scott do not have the years of passing experience that Eric developed in his three years. But they are also in a new system, and who knows, maybe Eric would struggle at first as well. What we don't see as fans is what the offensive system demands in terms of reads and progressions or the new route trees that have been put in place by the new staff. This is
one of the things that the OOC schedule is for -- shaking out who will be the starters once we enter the PFL season. BTW, based only on what i've heard on this forum, Scott is reported to have the arm and velocity to fill that pure passer role. So time (and game situation) will tell.
But the war on Saturday must be won in the trenches. If our front 7 can contain the SJC running attack and our secondary can keep balls in front of them we stand a chance. And if our OL can help us run the ball enough to give our
inexperienced QBs a chance to connect on some passes without throwing pics, we stand an even better chance.
GO VALPO!
It looks like this game is one of 4 that I get to watch on the HLN!
Quote from: valpotx on September 06, 2014, 12:51:12 AM
It looks like this game is one of 4 that I get to watch on the HLN!
Cool. I think I'd rather stay at home and flip around the channels while watching the game on the computer just in case SJC/Valpo doesn't turn out to be as exciting as the other college football games that will be on at the same time.
What other games are on this afternoon? :-) Do tell.
Quote from: usc4valpo on September 06, 2014, 10:06:18 AM
What other games are on this afternoon? :-) Do tell.
Lots of college football games this afternoon but that's not what I meant. St.Joe plays at Valpo at 7:00 p.m. CT tonight. Which game would you want to watch?
forecast show zero rain, high 60's and light winds. Should be perfect for football!!
My God. Goes on 4th and 5 then goes on 4th and 7 but doesn't go on 4th and 2. Still some issues but you can tell this is no Dale Carlson team.
Oh well, at least they got points.
Somebody tell that entrepreneur that if he wants to sell pretzels on Lincolnway that the first thing he should do is learn to pronounce the name of the town you're trying to sell pretzels in!!!!!!!!!!!
You knew SJC was going to improve their offense and respond to the Crusaders emotional first drive.
Valpo needs to really stiffen up the run defense.
So far VU has a lot of egg on their face from this ham and egger game.
I have a feeling Valpo will get blown out in the 3rd quarter by the Pumas. They didn't make good adjustments against Western Illinois and their defense was susceptible often in the 3rd quarter of that game.
It may just be me but there doesn't seem to be much enthusiasm on the VU sideline during this big 3rd quarter drive.
EDIT: Big score on the running of Bastin and receiving of Kuramata. Good arm by Lehman. Hope we can make a comeback. That would be great to see. Please make me look stupid. I wanna beat St Joe so bad!
Cripe, disappointing. How do we keep losing to teams like this?
I hope these guys refresh from their 2 week layoff and get ready to win in KC.
It starts with Todd and I'm sure we'll see plenty of excuses from this board but the bottom line is Valpo had very close games with SJC the last 2 years and now the Crusaders get beat by 21 to a once rivalry team. The season is certainly not over but unless a big turn around is made this year then this team is most likely to end up winless.
This team is now off to a worse start then any Dale Carlson team ever started. That's a fact.
Yes, but Carlson left Cecchini with this mess too. I know it is Cecchini's mess now, and it will certainly take time to fix this. We do not have a lot of talent, and by watching the game, it seems to me that we are a rather petite team.
Todd was concerned about senior attitude with this mess. I hope they give this guy a chance. Again, I thought 4 wins would exceed expectations, and for once I may be correct.
Hope the coach is willing to make changes. Without some big ones, the team will remain stuck. A very winnable game was lost.
Quote from: usc4valpo on September 06, 2014, 10:21:45 PMYes, but Carlson left Cecchini with this mess too.
Did not Carlson inherit a mess from Adams?
Just because Adams didn't use Joel Osteen quotes does not mean the situation was not the same or worse.
I really didn't think it would be you, usc, that would start with the excuses. It's all these excuses that lets the coach off the hook. Valpo fans have to keep someone accountable for the losses that just keep piling up.
Sounds like historyman needs to take a step back from the ledge.
Quote from: Pgmado on September 07, 2014, 03:10:55 AM
Sounds like historyman needs to take a step back from the ledge.
You probably got some great excuses for this Valpo football team also.
Help me get off the ledge. What positives can VU fans take from this 21 point loss to St Joe that will give me any hope that this Valpo team is moving in any way in a positive direction.
So far, looks a lot like last year's offense--little from rushing, big numbers from short passes, great yards between our 20 and their 40, no points so who cares, and an easy team to defend against because plays happen in front of the defense. And our defense? I'm at a loss...
Quote from: VUDad on September 06, 2014, 11:54:06 PM
Hope the coach is willing to make changes. Without some big ones, the team will remain stuck. A very winnable game was lost.
OK, don't leave us hanging. What changes did you have in mind?
historyman,
Please forgive me for the excuses. That is not my style, but this dude has coached for 2 games. If you are going to give Carlson 4 years to win 3 games, I will give Cecchini at least a year to adjust. Again people predicting this team can win 5 or 6 games were falsely optimistic.
This team at a talent level is currently below par - you could say the same for Carlson. I am disappointed and a little surprised of the outcome last night - I don't care if you are non-scholarship, you should beat St. Joe if you are Division 1.
Cecchini has a huge challenge getting this team back to form.
Quote from: usc4valpo on September 07, 2014, 07:56:07 AM
historyman,
Please forgive me for the excuses. That is not my style, but this dude has coached for 2 games. If you are going to give Carlson 4 years to win 3 games, I will give Cecchini at least a year to adjust. Again people predicting this team can win 5 or 6 games were falsely optimistic.
This team at a talent level is currently below par - you could say the same for Carlson. I am disappointed and a little surprised of the outcome last night - I don't care if you are non-scholarship, you should beat St. Joe if you are Division 1.
Cecchini has a huge challenge getting this team back to form.
This is the issue none of us understand. St. Joes is a tiny (less than 1200 students) college, with limited academic programs (27 majors) and limited academic reputation (28th in Midwest in regional "colleges" by US News).
We regularly schedule them as "meat for the grinder" games in other sports, as well they should be given the facts listed above. Yet, for some reason, we haven't won in football for 8 years and even before, in our long history, we had battled them to an even record. 62 admitted that while in school his teams only beat them once.
So what gives here?? Apparently athletic scholarships make the difference right? Not the answer. Years ago Valpo also gave athletic scholarships but we still struggled against them. They must have lower academic standards. Possibly part of the answer. Who knows. What I saw last night was a lot of speed from them and from us? Not so much. Football culture? Might be getting closer to the answer. Football, for these local small schools is the end all be all. My guess is that St. Joes might draw a couple of hundred folks for a home basketball game (last year when they played #5 ranked Bethel at home, they drew 298). Their football team however, regularly draws over 2000 to their games.
Quite the opposite at Valpo. Despite drawing over 3000 last night, for most of our history, football has been categorized as "something to do until basketball season starts". Unless and until that attitude changes we are destined to remain where we are. Can we win some games? Sure. Can we get beyond the level of St. Joes and others? It may be very difficult.
We are starting to get a better attitude and culture in this regard. The new weight room and improvements to the playing field etc. are steps in the right direction. Changing the schedule to attract different athletes will also help but we have played a national schedule for years now. Our [players get on planes to go to games. St. Joe's kids get on buses. There is still something big missing. It won't be easy to change and may never happen. :(
I think some of you need to get real when talking about our football program. With an admittedly dismal recent past, we hire a potentially good coach. At least give him a chance. For crying out loud he hasn't even been on campus a year and we have played TWO games! He doesn't have a full compliment of HIS OWN recruits, only some from a few months on the job plus installing an entirely new offense and defense. And now some are calling his efforts a failure, with some even calling for us to drop the program???? Are you serious??!!!
By the way, did anyone realize that St J has a pretty darn good club for their level of play? Heck St. Francis in Ft. Wayne could probably beat a number of teams in the PFL and they may not have as many students as St J and I believe their NAIA.
Let's cool our heels and give Coach C a chance. This constant ripping of our program isn't helping anyone. The negativity is getting old as far as I'm concerned, especially some of the "cheap shots" that have been espressed.
GO VALPO!
Better times are ahead...let's start accentuating the positives
The sense of disappointment and frustration among the players was very obvious last night. This team was genuinely surprised by the way the game progressed. Speaking to a few beforehand, they clearly felt they had a good chance of winning. Unfortunately, the early drive that had a first down on the one-yard line and failed seemed to be a metaphor for the whole night. In fact, it hinted at the problem of losing the battle on the line of scrimmage that continued through the game.
Afterwards, it was refreshing to see no excuses given by the players or the coach. I also appreciated a sense of anger rather than acceptance on the part of the players I saw after the game. In addition, I would guess an opportunity to build support for the team was lost since the stands were full at the start of the game, and a win would have created a bit of momentum among fans for future games.
There were a couple of bright spots. The team seemed disciplined and only committed one turnover, which came near the end of the game and didn't influence the outcome. The receivers also displayed their talent, and would have done even better if a few more passes got into their hands. Kuramata had a personal best of 14 receptions, and Cassara caught a pass for the lone touchdown, as seen here:
(http://i62.tinypic.com/2ihrvcm.jpg)
72 - that was an excellent post and perspective. In reality, it was one of the best posts I have seen!
64 - I agree with your posts, we need to give Cecchini a chance. But is who is saying something negative or who is ripping people? You are what your record says you are - and Valpo is 0-2 this year, and 4 and 51 before that. That is not good, that is poor, and that is not a negative statement - that is a fact. Face the facts here gang, deal with the truth like Marie Osmond in the Nutrisystem commercial. I mentioned that a 4 win season would be a tremendous accomplishment, and that is not a negative, ripping the team apart statement. You do not go from 4-51 to a 6-to-7 win season in one year. You have to change the culture.
I think fundamentally Valpo looks better. They are making less mistakes. An issue is the talent level and a long stench of bad defeat the team has had to endure.
Quote from: historyman on September 06, 2014, 09:59:48 PM
This team is now off to a worse start then any Dale Carlson team ever started. That's a fact.
I guess we can call you fact man. You might want to actually check your facts first. I think Carlson's first year was worse for the first 2 games. Oh and game 3 was a 50-7 loss to St. Joe. Other than that you nailed it.
Quote from: IndyValpo on September 07, 2014, 03:26:57 PMQuote from: historyman on September 06, 2014, 09:59:48 PMThis team is now off to a worse start then any Dale Carlson team ever started. That's a fact.
I guess we can call you fact man. You might want to actually checks your facts first. I think Carlson's first year was worse for the first 2 games. Oh and game 3 was a 50-7 loss to St. Joe. Other than that you nailed it.
You are absolutely correct. I had forgotten that Carlson started out worse. I apologize for my egregious error.
I hope that your victory over me in the record area makes the loss last night easier to swallow.
Hey, Factman you been dishing it out.....was curious if you could handle a little return action. Honestly, not surprised by your response. For the record or fact as you like to point out, I made no prediction, made no excuses.
After reading your response, I do feel a little better.....thanks!
We're getting a little edgy after only two games. I agree with those posters who are willing to let this play out a bit. I encourage you all to watch the post game press conference.
http://www.valpoathletics.com/football/news/2014-15/13865/valpo-football-postgame-press-conference---saint-josephs/#.VAz1v0sXKgE (http://www.valpoathletics.com/football/news/2014-15/13865/valpo-football-postgame-press-conference---saint-josephs/#.VAz1v0sXKgE)
As ValpoPal pointed out - there were no excuses. We lost it in the trenches on both sides of the ball and Coach C says that straight out. It was something I pointed to prior to the game. "But the war on Saturday must be won in the trenches. If our front 7 can contain the SJC running attack [we couldn't] and our secondary can keep balls in front of them [they actually did a pretty good job] we stand a chance. And if our OL can help us run the ball enough to give our inexperienced QBs a chance to connect on some passes [they couldn't] without throwing pics [no INTs and only 1 sack], we stand an even better chance." You'll also hear the reason for the FG rather than the attempt at the TD and the admission that by being denied that first TD, it set the whole tone of the game (the old past mindset was reawakened -- it will be hard to change that, but it can be done).
I was there. I know ValpoPal was there -- his picture proved it. ;) My assessment at the time, and it is born out by the post game comments, is that we could not set the defensive edge and that gave their running game great opportunities to eat up yards and chew up the clock on sustained drives. Why did that happen despite Coach C saying they prepared for the rushing attack?
Point (not excuse) #1: Their "H" back (actually a move tight end) was 6-4, 248. He lined up in the backfield and then was continually over-matched, via shifts, on our OLBs (none taller than 6-1 and none heavier than 210). He continually neutralized our guys and created a log jam at the edge that prevented our MLBs from pursuing to the LOS allowing the SJC RBs to reach the LOS before any defensive threat could be mounted. Our CBs came up to take on lead blockers, but there was little pursuit because it was bottled up inside.
Point (not excuse) #2: Their two RBs, especially Braxton Shelton (5-11, 225), were big enough to move the pile and also fast enough to go outside. This was no fineness offense.
Point (not excuse) #3: Our DL was outweighed by their seasoned (all returnees) OL by a good 40# per man.
SUMMARY POINT (not excuse): Plain and simple, we got beat by a better team.
So why has that happened pretty consistently vs. SJC over the years? Maybe it is because, as was mentioned by ValpoPal and 64 and 72 below, St Joe's is a FB-only kind of school with 25 full FB scholarships to hand out versus our diverse larger athletic program that is, overall, much more successful in many more D-I sports and hands out NO FB scholarships. And, BTW, that SJC FB culture was reflected in the fact that the visitor side of field was almost filled last night (and USC, they were tail gating over across the way and I bet there was some adult beverages flowing!).
But these things are also true about SJC (at least according to Wiki):
Ranking: #27 Regional College Midwest (2012)
Undergraduates: 1,033 (2010)
Acceptance rate: 60% (2010)
Tuition: $26,330 USD (2011)
All of which point to easier admission into a more affordable school that also offers FB scholarship aid. So even the players who don't get a FB scholarship have less of a financial burden. But as ValpoPal points out, the rest of their athletic programs are undistinguished. If we were an FCS scholarship program, I'd be worried, but we are more realistically D-III than D-I at this point. And speaking of DIII, Butler only beat Wittenberg 22-16.
Here are the other PFL scores with some notations that, perhaps, for those of you who keep mistakenly thinking that St. Joe's is a ham and egger FB team, indicate how we compare to the rest of our league in playing "ham and egg" D-II, NAIA and D-III teams:
Dayton 23 - G'Town (Patriot)14
Bucknell (Patriot) 22 - Marist 0
Appalachian State (FBS- Southern Conference) 66 Campbell 0
Morehead State 49 - Pikeville (NAIA) 36
Florida Tech (D-II) 54 - Stetson 12
Catawba (D-II) 35 - Davidson 7
Drake 13 - Truman (D-II) 7 OT
Butler 22 - Wittenberg (D-III) 16
USD 23 - Western NM (D-II) 17
There is a reason, people, why the PFL, as a conference, and it's teams are rated at the bottom of all of D-I. Simply, we do not have the reputation and prestige associated with the Ivy League, on top of which we don't award FB scholarships.
Good defensive game summary, 62, and thanks for posting the post game video. After hearing the coach describe the complexity of the offense and his expectation that it will take two years (spring + fall season + spring) for players to fully engage it, I humbly retract my earlier statements about the offense and will give them the benefit of the doubt as they learn. Especially the QBs. Should be interesting to see what happens in all the position battles he mentions in the video.
OMG - beer consumption on Valpo grounds before a football game? Oh the immorality of this! Those fans with the Bud Lights in their hands need to be arrested with no chance for parole!
so are you telling me that a visiting team outtailgates us on our home turf? That is not right. We need to find a way to make tailgating a culture we look forward to. It can be a great social gathering experience. At Drake games, they tailgate, it is under control, and there are university approved "get-togethers" before the game. What is wrong about some bean bag tossing and the smell of BBQ in the air before a game? This creates a positive, active, enthusiastic fan culture before a game.
I think the admin would be ok with it provided you served "near-beer" and prefaced the afternoon's symposium with a reading from the Collected Speechifications of OP Kretzmann
Outstanding reply Apostle
I felt better watching our defense than in prior years. We only gave up 1 long TD in this game, when we have typically given up 3+ in each game during the Carlson years. I would much rather give up a sustained drive facing a huge RB, than a one and done long TD. Our offense did not help the defense at all, and hopefully Jake can get healthy and running like he did two seasons ago. Our D was solid for giving up 31 points, they gave our Offense a chance to do something until it just got to be too much time on the field for them...
As I was sorting through my photos, I came across a couple with images from perspectives most might have missed watching the game. The first is a shot of the full moon over Brown field that also shows the good crowd on the home side of the field. The second is also a kind of moon shot. The St Joe player who made the tackle on the goal line to keep the first-quarter Valpo drive from scoring a touchdown did so while being de-pantsed by Crusader lineman Tom Ehrlich. :-[
(http://i59.tinypic.com/jj4l8l,jpg)
(http://i58.tinypic.com/19uhia.jpg)
Quote from: valpopal on September 08, 2014, 01:06:32 AM
As I was sorting through my photos, I came across a couple with images from perspectives most might have missed watching the game. The first is a shot of the full moon over Brown field that also shows the good crowd on the home side of the field. The second is also a kind of moon shot. The St Joe player who made the tackle on the goal line to keep the first-quarter Valpo drive from scoring a touchdown did so while being de-pantsed by Crusader lineman Tom Ehrlich. :-[
(http://i59.tinypic.com/jj4l8l,jpg)
(http://i58.tinypic.com/19uhia.jpg)
This pic will always remind me of the astronaut Gene Cernan.
He was the last person to stop a moon drive.
Gene was known as being the last astronaut to drive the LRV during the Apollo missions on the moon.
Our offense sure did try everything to score. Coach C sure did bring a lot to the table when he came to Valpo. I don't think he meant to actually "knock their jocks off."
Pal, that second moon shot is hilarious. If that gets out it'll go viral. What do they say? Any publicity is good publicity........ :-X
From the looks of him, I'd say that guy already has a viral
Quote from: VUDad on September 07, 2014, 09:36:05 PM
Good defensive game summary, 62, and thanks for posting the post game video. After hearing the coach describe the complexity of the offense and his expectation that it will take two years (spring + fall season + spring) for players to fully engage it, I humbly retract my earlier statements about the offense and will give them the benefit of the doubt as they learn. Especially the QBs. Should be interesting to see what happens in all the position battles he mentions in the video.
I read a very good article in USAToday last week about how the Stanford OL is used in controlling the ball on the ground. It's called
Ogres, Elephants and Monsters.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/pac12/2014/09/02/college-football-stanford-cardinal-offensive-line/14979515/ (http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/pac12/2014/09/02/college-football-stanford-cardinal-offensive-line/14979515/)
Long story short, they bring in the big O-linemen in jumbo packages (as many as 7-8 huge linemen on a play) to run the ball down people's throats. And not just on the goal line, but anywhere on the field. I sent the link to Vinny Giacalone, the OL coach. He said they might try it except they don't have the depth to really make it work. I don't know about that. Going jumbo for short yardage or just 1 & 10, makes so much sense to me especially after seeing what the big St. Joe's H Back was able to do in sealing the off-tackle edge against us. We had no answer. I'd love to see Valpo bring in Colm Flaherty (6-4, 285) and Sam Maternach (6-4, 265) and/or perhaps #90 John Guilford (6-4, 240 [I know he's DL but...,], go unbalanced (or not), tighten their gaps to stop any penetration and cave in the left or right side of a defense. One set might look like this.... or you could go two TEs. The possibilities are numerous.
X T G C G T Y
Q T T
R Teams generally would not have sub packages ready to compensate for this sort of random attack. And if, after a few such plays, an opponent overcompensates, a whole series of counters and passes off that would be killer. Add a shift or two or a little motion and whoa! A package like this would only need 4-5 plays. Stanford's OL coach says that this has added benefits in that it gives many more O-linemen game experience and creates better quality depth.
We have encountered, in the last two games, D-lines who were able to neutralize our OL push at the snap. This additional package helps to get the advantage back. And against PFL front 7s that are more in line with ours, it will have a damaging impact (IMO). But I'm not the coach, just a dreamer of sorts :crazy:
Quote from: valpo64 on September 07, 2014, 11:04:06 AMHeck St. Francis in Ft. Wayne could probably beat a number of teams in the PFL and they may not have as many students as St J and I believe their NAIA.
Actually they would probably be one of the top teams in the PFL. In 2000 when we were Co-Champions of the PFL we lost to St Francis 34-30, this was only the third season of football for St Francis and since that time their record is 138-24. They have been in the NAIA top ten ten times in the last 11 years and played in the NAIA national championship game 3 times. They have never lost to Butler.
Quote from: VULB#62 on September 08, 2014, 10:43:45 AMTeams generally would not have sub packages ready to compensate for this sort of random attack.
Michigan tried tackle-over last year. It worked for precisely one game, and then it was on film, and everyone else was ready for it.
And this is with two tackles who were gone in the first 100 picks of the draft.
I am not familiar with UM tackle over. If it was just an unbalanced line with tandem tackles, that's a piece of cake to defend - still 5 O-linemen. I am familiar with jumbo sets (7-8 O-linemen) with multiple linemen in the backfield and a variety of plays off that set. Just because you are ready doesn't necessarily mean you can successfully defend it. Valpo was ready for the SJC running attack and couldn't defeat it. To compensate for the elephants in the backfield (i.e., being ready for it) opens holes elsewhere in the defense that are easily leveraged. Load up against the jumbo side? Check off to a stretch counter to the weak side pulling one of the jumbos or the jumbo side guard back across. Roll up DB's into the box? Check off to 1-on-1 coverage to wide-outs, run bootlegs off play action or hit TEs in the flat vacated by the DBs. Whatever they do to combat it, there is an answer that takes advantage of the new exposed weakness. But keep in mind that this is more a shock measure that is employed occasionally, not an entire offensive system. By doing this, it takes away the defense's ability to dictate the game, forces them to react and keeps them honest. It also forces teams to devote additional practice time to address this unique set only for Valpo. And if it just causes the opponent to waste a time-out to adjust, it wins some currency.
Coach C: Son what were you doing to help your running back get into the end zone?
Player: I pulled down the lineman's pants and yanked his jock off!!
Coach C: Uhh, well, how did the offensive line become exposed?
Player: Exactly!!
It interesting to me that these kids wear no hip pads. When I played (admittedly, a long time ago), there was a lot more padding and pants cinched tightly, which would have made such exposure next to impossible! :o
Not to mention leather helmets without face masks. :rotfl:
I have now posted a gallery of 30 photos from Saturday's home opener, including the one below, at the following: enjoy! https://www.flickr.com/photos/96208998@N05/sets/72157646955601458/ (https://www.flickr.com/photos/96208998@N05/sets/72157646955601458/)
(http://i61.tinypic.com/o8z48x.jpg)
And moon shot #2 made the cut. ;D
Thought I'd add one final comment regarding program turnarounds in their first year.
I was astonished with the Texas BYU result this past weekend. Here was one of the premier FBS programs in terms of incredible resources and long-time prestige. They hired a strong, tough-minded coach to replace a more laid-back Mack Brown. In preseason he weeded out players who wouldn't make what he thought was the necessary commitment. Yet, in game #2, a game that most thought would be won by the Longhorns, they were BLOWN OUT 41-6 in an apparently explosive 3rd quarter.
From ESPN
This was a perfect storm in all three phases of the game.
BYU handed Texas' Charlie Strong the worst quarter of his coaching career.
In 26 plays, the Cougars' offense collected 199 yards, including 138 on the ground. They racked up 13 first downs and faced third down just twice. Their quarterback, Taysom Hill, accounted for 129 total yards and three scores for a near-perfect single-quarter QBR of 99.3. A 6-0 nailbiter turned into a 34-0 thrashing in less than 11 game minutes.
Most believe that Charlie Strong's teams will be in the national playoff picture sooner than later. However, it will take time, and everyone understands that -- now. While we cannot draw parallels with Texas, I think the same axiom applies. This week the Crusaders are totally focusing on themselves and looking themselves in a mirror. They'll wait till next week to address Wm. Jewel. It's part of the growth process that needs to be addressed. I wish the players the best at coming to grips with how to establish a consistent winning attitude.
I have no idea whether Cassara caught this pass or not but isn't it interesting where his eyes are focused?
https://www.flickr.com/photos/96208998@N05/14989232449/in/set-72157646955601458/ (https://www.flickr.com/photos/96208998@N05/14989232449/in/set-72157646955601458/)