One of the great challenges of coaching is putting a decent spin on a bad result.
Here is the article on last night's game from the Quad Cities paper. Interesting spin from their coach!
Voiles shines in Augie loss to Div. I Valpo
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By Tom Johnston, tjohnston@qconline.com
The Augustana College men's basketball team may not have shocked the world here Thursday night with a huge upset, but they came away with exactly what they wanted from the exhibition game against NCAA Div. I Valparaiso.The NCAA Div. III Vikings stood toe-to-toe with the Crusaders, cutting a huge second-half deficit with the final 15 points of the game in a 74-65 setback in the Athletics and Recreation Center on the Indiana school's campus.There were a number of bright spots for the Vikings, who have been ranked as high as No. 2 in the preseason polls. One of the biggest was Bryant Voiles. The 6-foot-9 senior wingman popped for a game-high 25 points and also added six rebounds and six steals.
"He was the best player on the floor,'' said Augie coach Grey Giovanine. "He's certainly a go-to guy. Every good team has somebody who steps up and makes plays and he's certainly able to be that guy. Scoring 25 points against a Division I team, on the road, with the stats he had, is pretty significant.''
For Voiles, though, it was just another game – albeit one in a much different setting than what the Vikings will face much of the season.
"I just went out there and tried to be aggressive, tried to play within our system and try to make shots when I had the opportunity,'' said Voiles, who was 8-of-14 from the field. "There were definitely a little bit of nerves in the beginning, but I think we set that aside and kept playing and kept coming.
"It didn't turn out like we wanted, but we'll take what we can learn from it and move forward.''
Troy Rorer finished with 10 rebounds and eight points and Brandon Kunz chipped in 10 points and four rebounds off the bench for the Vikings who were without senior sharpshooter Chris Anderson. He was nursing a hamstring injury.
While the Vikings struggled in a few areas – 22 turnovers among them – it was exactly what the Vikings needed.
"It's a great experience and we hung in there until the buzzer, outscoring them (38-36) in the second half,'' said Giovanine. "They just shot the 3 so well. We played the percentages on some of those guys and a couple who don't typically shoot it well, did.''
Valpo was 5-of-22 in its first exhibition game (a 73-71 scare vs. Hillsdale), but was 11-of-25 vs. Augie from beyond the arc as it placed four players in double-digit scoring.
"You had to give something up and we were going to try to keep them from getting to the rim and did that OK,'' said Giovanine, "but they shot it very well.''
On the bright side, the Vikings had 16 offensive rebounds en route to a 37-30 edge on the glass and forced Valpo into 20 turnovers.
One big area of concern was exploited Thursday. When senior point guard Brian DeSimone had to sit with his fourth foul, the Crusaders were able to convert turnovers by a young backcourt into points to blow open a 48-32 lead. Valpo's biggest margin in the second half was 67-43 with 7:59 remaining before Augie scored the final 15 points in the last 5:39.
"It wasn't a game of great rhythm and it wasn't a game of great precision,'' said Giovanine. "It was a hard-fought game and a great experience for us.''
I would hope that the GSU coach won't be abl;e to make the same claims next Friday. Four of us VU grads(one of whom played for Bartow) are considering going to Statesville for the game. About a two hour drive for us. If we go, I hope to get coach Nepo's autograph and rlh's too (if he is there). We expect a Valpo win by 10+ pts., but after a 15 pt. or more loss at Az. we might be worn down. Go Valpo!
Quote from: setshot on November 04, 2011, 09:47:22 AM
I would hope that the GSU coach won't be abl;e to make the same claims next Friday. Four of us VU grads(one of whom played for Bartow) are considering going to Statesville for the game. About a two hour drive for us. If we go, I hope to get coach Nepo's autograph and rlh's too (if he is there). We expect a Valpo win by 10+ pts., but after a 15 pt. or more loss at Az. we might be worn down. Go Valpo!
As much as I'd enjoy meeting you after all the years of banter back and forth, I no longer travel with the team....so I guess it's have to wait until you can come here sometime.
I don't know if Voiles was "the best player on the floor," since I would give that to Ryan. However, I was very impressed by his play and remarked at the game that it was puzzling he was at a Div. III school: he would likely be in the starting lineup on a Valpo team.
Geez, definitely quite a spin by the paper. They were down by 21 with 2:30 or so left, and at that point we had all of our main rotation off the floor (Shelton played the last 4 minutes). That would be like us saying we played tooth-and-nail with a top team in losing by 10, but we outscore their last rotation with our starters 25-10 over the last 5 minutes when we were losing by 25...
Quote from: valpopal on November 04, 2011, 10:26:14 AM
I don't know if Voiles was "the best player on the floor," since I would give that to Ryan. However, I was very impressed by his play and remarked at the game that it was puzzling he was at a Div. III school: he would likely be in the starting lineup on a Valpo team.
I also remarked that it was hard to believe that Voiles was not in a D1 program. Players like that show what an inexact science recruiting really is. Very hard to look at a 15-18 year old kid and predict what kind of player he might become.
This is the one I liked the most from their coach:
It's a great experience and we hung in there until the buzzer, outscoring them (38-36) in the second half
Well, sort of!! As for the best player on the floor Their kid had 25 and 6 boards in 32 minutes while Kevin had 9 points and 7 boards in 12! He would have gone for 25 and 15 in 32. as would have Rowdy. Good player no doubt and certainly would be a nice player on our team. It's hard to get a 6'9" perimeter player.
Quote from: vu72 on November 04, 2011, 11:23:32 AM
This is the one I liked the most from their coach:
It's a great experience and we hung in there until the buzzer, outscoring them (38-36) in the second half
Well, sort of!! As for the best player on the floor Their kid had 25 and 6 boards in 32 minutes while Kevin had 9 points and 7 boards in 12! He would have gone for 25 and 15 in 32. as would have Rowdy. Good player no doubt and certainly would be a nice player on our team. It's hard to get a 6'9" perimeter player.
You also have to give extra credit and take into account that Voiles was playing against a Div. I defense that could focus on him as the only real scoring threat, while our guys were playing against a Div. III defense that could not afford to focus on a single player.
The Augustana coach was proud of his guys and tried to emphasize the positives ... just like every coach does. Nothing wrong with being proud of your team for not giving up after being down 24 in the 2nd half and coming back to lose by only 9. He didn't say anything negative about Valpo, that I could see.
As I recall, Coach Drew was very proud of Valpo for doing the same thing a few years ago at UNC ... cutting a 24 point deficit to 9, before losing by 11. http://www.valpoathletics.com/mbasketball/news/2009-10/9366/valpo-rallies-late-before-falling-to-64-north-carolina/ (http://www.valpoathletics.com/mbasketball/news/2009-10/9366/valpo-rallies-late-before-falling-to-64-north-carolina/) A lot of the comments from Coach Drew are pretty similar to those from Augustana's coach, IMO.
Quote from: FWalum on November 04, 2011, 11:03:38 AM
Quote from: valpopal on November 04, 2011, 10:26:14 AM
I don't know if Voiles was "the best player on the floor," since I would give that to Ryan. However, I was very impressed by his play and remarked at the game that it was puzzling he was at a Div. III school: he would likely be in the starting lineup on a Valpo team.
I also remarked that it was hard to believe that Voiles was not in a D1 program. Players like that show what an inexact science recruiting really is. Very hard to look at a 15-18 year old kid and predict what kind of player he might become.
He might have grown late in HS or after HS. If you're 6'7", someone at the Division I level will give you a chance. How many tall players are sitting on every team bench?
I am told that Voiles was just under 6' coming out of high school....kind of like David Robinson if you remember that story. Some kids just mature nad grow later....by the way, we were sitting with a Bulls scout last night.....he was there to see Voiles
Quote from: zvillehaze on November 04, 2011, 04:40:15 PM
The Augustana coach was proud of his guys and tried to emphasize the positives ... just like every coach does. Nothing wrong with being proud of your team for not giving up after being down 24 in the 2nd half and coming back to lose by only 9. He didn't say anything negative about Valpo, that I could see.
As I recall, Coach Drew was very proud of Valpo for doing the same thing a few years ago at UNC ... cutting a 24 point deficit to 9, before losing by 11. http://www.valpoathletics.com/mbasketball/news/2009-10/9366/valpo-rallies-late-before-falling-to-64-north-carolina/ (http://www.valpoathletics.com/mbasketball/news/2009-10/9366/valpo-rallies-late-before-falling-to-64-north-carolina/) A lot of the comments from Coach Drew are pretty similar to those from Augustana's coach, IMO.
I understand what you are saying here, but in that specific game we were only down by 12 with 7:30 left. This was 21 with 3:00 left, and our reserves playing against their starters.
This one is a riot! The quotes from the Kokomo coach are priceless. "Our starters held their own against their starters" :o
But the worst part was the writer of the article who said: "Valpo only won by 31" and "Even though the Crusaders played many players who usually don't see very much floor time, the fact remains those players are on an NCAA Division 1 scholarship" :crazy:
Wow! great journalistic research and even greater spin!!
http://indianasportsjournal.com/2011/11/23/cougars-go-big-time/ (http://indianasportsjournal.com/2011/11/23/cougars-go-big-time/)
Quote from: vu72 on November 23, 2011, 02:10:36 PMBut the worst part was the writer of the article who said: "Valpo only won by 31" and "Even though the Crusaders played many players who usually don't see very much floor time, the fact remains those players are on an NCAA Division 1 scholarship"
Did he know that we added the walk-ons before they got to the ARC for the game?
no idea, but I presume he should have known that no all players on a D1 team are on scholarship. He makes it seem like they played solid and only lost by 31 when in fact they could have lost by 100. No knock on the players as they were all freshman, but the slant on the story is pretty funny.
It is the biggest mismatch I have ever seen at the ARC.
---We have had more lopsided scores, but to my knowledge we have never had a game where that many walk-ons played that much time and scored that much.
---Had KVW played, they were too short to stop the lob over the top. He would have scored at will.
---They were stuck on 12 points forever until Bryce switched from man to zone. You could almost hear the sigh of relief from their players, who had been hounded unmercifully up to that point. Finally they were in a position to throw up some lightly contested 3's and hit a few.
I know others disagree, but I think mis-matches like this are of little value to anyone involved. It can even be detrimental. It reminds me of home run derby at MLB All-Star weekend. The best sluggers in the game belt watermelon pitches 450', then go 1-12 in their first 3 games following against real pitching. I just hope some OSU fan doesn't post this same message on Friday night. ;)
not much you can say after that type of loss... If everything you say is going to be fiction, might as well make it good!
I guess any way they can feel good about getting worked over by a bunch of intramural players :-)
Quote from: wh on November 23, 2011, 03:41:22 PMI know others disagree, but I think mis-matches like this are of little value to anyone involved. It can even be detrimental.
I don't know if the scheduling details ever came out - whether mids pulled out of the tournament late, or what. But, I don't think this was Valpo's plan A. It sounds like the Kokomo coach was eager, about like our scheduling UNC, Ohio State, etc. I hope his guys did get something out of it. And, the rest surely helped is against Duquesne.
Quote from: vu72 on November 23, 2011, 02:10:36 PMThis one is a riot! The quotes from the Kokomo coach are priceless. "Our starters held their own against their starters."
I don't get the journalists insisting their players were technically walk-ons while ours were D1 scholarship players. But, for the starters line, he might have the narrowest of points.
Quote"We learned a lot of things. Our starters held their own against theirs, so we have to get deeper and that is something I will have to work on in recruiting," said Thompson, who noted that Valpo was up 9-8 when IUK made its first substitutions.
He had nice things to say about telling his guys to learn from the hussle shown by D1 players, etc.
There was some hyperbole for sure. But, overall, I thought it was a nice piece.
Quote from: agibson on November 24, 2011, 01:51:19 PM
Quote from: wh on November 23, 2011, 03:41:22 PMI know others disagree, but I think mis-matches like this are of little value to anyone involved. It can even be detrimental.
I don't know if the scheduling details ever came out - whether mids pulled out of the tournament late, or what. But, I don't think this was Valpo's plan A. It sounds like the Kokomo coach as eager, about like our scheduling UNC, Ohio State, etc. I hope his guys did get something out of it. And, the rest surely helped is against Duquesne.
i believe that's exactly what happened - one team pulled out last minute, and was replaced by iu-k and udc.
Quote from: vuweathernerd on November 24, 2011, 07:03:51 PM
Quote from: agibson on November 24, 2011, 01:51:19 PM
Quote from: wh on November 23, 2011, 03:41:22 PMI know others disagree, but I think mis-matches like this are of little value to anyone involved. It can even be detrimental.
I don't know if the scheduling details ever came out - whether mids pulled out of the tournament late, or what. But, I don't think this was Valpo's plan A. It sounds like the Kokomo coach as eager, about like our scheduling UNC, Ohio State, etc. I hope his guys did get something out of it. And, the rest surely helped is against Duquesne.
i believe that's exactly what happened - one team pulled out last minute, and was replaced by iu-k and udc.
I heard it was Lehigh that dropped out and chose to play elsewhere.
Quote from: valpopal on November 24, 2011, 11:31:20 PM
Quote from: vuweathernerd on November 24, 2011, 07:03:51 PM
Quote from: agibson on November 24, 2011, 01:51:19 PM
Quote from: wh on November 23, 2011, 03:41:22 PMI know others disagree, but I think mis-matches like this are of little value to anyone involved. It can even be detrimental.
I don't know if the scheduling details ever came out - whether mids pulled out of the tournament late, or what. But, I don't think this was Valpo's plan A. It sounds like the Kokomo coach as eager, about like our scheduling UNC, Ohio State, etc. I hope his guys did get something out of it. And, the rest surely helped is against Duquesne.
i believe that's exactly what happened - one team pulled out last minute, and was replaced by iu-k and udc.
I heard it was Lehigh that dropped out and chose to play elsewhere.
what i'm currently curious about is why one school dropped out and we added a pair.
Quote from: vuweathernerd on November 24, 2011, 11:46:23 PM
Quote from: valpopal on November 24, 2011, 11:31:20 PM
Quote from: vuweathernerd on November 24, 2011, 07:03:51 PM
Quote from: agibson on November 24, 2011, 01:51:19 PM
Quote from: wh on November 23, 2011, 03:41:22 PMI know others disagree, but I think mis-matches like this are of little value to anyone involved. It can even be detrimental.
I don't know if the scheduling details ever came out - whether mids pulled out of the tournament late, or what. But, I don't think this was Valpo's plan A. It sounds like the Kokomo coach as eager, about like our scheduling UNC, Ohio State, etc. I hope his guys did get something out of it. And, the rest surely helped is against Duquesne.
i believe that's exactly what happened - one team pulled out last minute, and was replaced by iu-k and udc.
I heard it was Lehigh that dropped out and chose to play elsewhere.
what i'm currently curious about is why one school dropped out and we added a pair.
Because Duquesne didn't want to play IU-K they wanted to play a more difficult team.
Quote from: valpofan56 on November 25, 2011, 01:04:52 AM
Quote from: vuweathernerd on November 24, 2011, 11:46:23 PM
what i'm currently curious about is why one school dropped out and we added a pair.
Because Duquesne didn't want to play IU-K they wanted to play a more difficult team.
Interesting--and then some of their fans used that very excuse, having to play a tougher opponent, in UDC, as to why the Dukes lost to Valpo.
So Akron only played Duquesne and Valpo and did not play either IUK or UDC?
That means Valpo & Duquesne played 3 games while Akron, IUK and UDC only played 2 games each?
Quote from: historyman on November 25, 2011, 06:10:40 AM
Quote from: valpofan56 on November 25, 2011, 01:04:52 AM
Quote from: vuweathernerd on November 24, 2011, 11:46:23 PM
what i'm currently curious about is why one school dropped out and we added a pair.
Because Duquesne didn't want to play IU-K they wanted to play a more difficult team.
Interesting--and then some of their fans used that very excuse, having to play a tougher opponent, in UDC, as to why the Dukes lost to Valpo.
So Akron only played Duquesne and Valpo and did not play either IUK or UDC?
That means Valpo & Duquesne played 3 games while Akron, IUK and UDC only played 2 games each?
Correct.
Akron's fourth game in the 2K classic was a home game against Hiram on 11-12.
Also, Lehigh did not drop out ... they played in the other "subregional".
Quote from: zvillehaze on November 25, 2011, 09:24:52 AM
Akron's fourth game in the 2K classic was a home game against Hiram on 11-12.
Also, Lehigh did not drop out ... they played in the other "subregional".
What I was told is that Lehigh dropped out of our subregional to select the other subregional instead, which was closer to their home. That was what I meant when I said they "chose to play elsewhere."
According to their athletics website Lehigh played William & Mary 82-57, Liberty 90-80 and Eastern Kentucky 76-51 at Lynchburg, VA and won all three games. They lost to St.John's 78-73 in Queens, NY for their other 2K Sports Classic game. On 11/12/11 Lehigh played Iowa State in Ames, IA and lost 86-77.
http://www.lehighsports.com/sports/mbball/schedules/default.aspx (http://www.lehighsports.com/sports/mbball/schedules/default.aspx)
Lehigh would have been an outstanding opponent for VU. Great school in a great conference (Patriot).
lowposter
Quote from: historyman on November 25, 2011, 10:06:26 AM
According to their athletics website Lehigh played William & Mary 82-57, Liberty 90-80 and Eastern Kentucky 76-51 at Lynchburg, VA and won all three games. They lost to St.John's 78-73 in Queens, NY for their other 2K Sports Classic game. On 11/12/11 Lehigh played Iowa State in Ames, IA and lost 86-77.
http://www.lehighsports.com/sports/mbball/schedules/default.aspx (http://www.lehighsports.com/sports/mbball/schedules/default.aspx)
Did Lehigh think they were in the Big East? Seriously, the subregional we had was certainly not cupcake. They would have faired well at the Valpo subregional, maybe even challenged for the title. I guess they just didn't want a difficult route to a subregional title?
Quote from: valporun on November 25, 2011, 04:35:23 PM
Quote from: historyman on November 25, 2011, 10:06:26 AM
According to their athletics website Lehigh played William & Mary 82-57, Liberty 90-80 and Eastern Kentucky 76-51 at Lynchburg, VA and won all three games. They lost to St.John's 78-73 in Queens, NY for their other 2K Sports Classic game. On 11/12/11 Lehigh played Iowa State in Ames, IA and lost 86-77.
http://www.lehighsports.com/sports/mbball/schedules/default.aspx (http://www.lehighsports.com/sports/mbball/schedules/default.aspx)
Did Lehigh think they were in the Big East? Seriously, the subregional we had was certainly not cupcake. They would have faired well at the Valpo subregional, maybe even challenged for the title. I guess they just didn't want a difficult route to a subregional title?
To be fair, the very notion of a "sub" regional is beyond insulting. These teams are glorified sparring partners for the big boys who aren't supposed to win. It's hard to take seriously something that is euphemistically called a tournament or a classic but where the "winners" are predetermined.
I wouldn't be too hard on them. I mean, teams need to rise above that and take these games seriously and so forth, but it's not like the system is encouraging them to do so.
The whole thing is a joke, if you ask me.
Quote from: valporun on November 25, 2011, 04:35:23 PM
Quote from: historyman on November 25, 2011, 10:06:26 AM
According to their athletics website Lehigh played William & Mary 82-57, Liberty 90-80 and Eastern Kentucky 76-51 at Lynchburg, VA and won all three games. They lost to St.John's 78-73 in Queens, NY for their other 2K Sports Classic game. On 11/12/11 Lehigh played Iowa State in Ames, IA and lost 86-77.
http://www.lehighsports.com/sports/mbball/schedules/default.aspx (http://www.lehighsports.com/sports/mbball/schedules/default.aspx)
Did Lehigh think they were in the Big East? Seriously, the subregional we had was certainly not cupcake. They would have faired well at the Valpo subregional, maybe even challenged for the title. I guess they just didn't want a difficult route to a subregional title?
My understanding is that their decision was based solely upon geography and demographics. They felt the university and their fans would be better served by playing in Virginia and New York City.