I very much like this match-up. There is absolutely no mystique about Miami. This is a team we should play well against
Quote from: valpotx on March 11, 2012, 08:06:12 PM
I very much like this match-up. There is absolutely no mystique about Miami. This is a team we should play well against
it's very much a winnable game. especially if we can get good performances out of kevin and rowdy.
60 RPI. Tied for 4th in the ACC at 9-7. 19-12 overall. 13-3 at home. Knocked out in the second round of the ACC tournament by #17 Florida State. They beat Florida State in Miami, and also won at Duke.
Worst loss? At Maryland? No really bad losses. Maryland is RPI 105. Worst home loss? NC State?
Not going to be an easy game.
Quote from: agibson on March 11, 2012, 08:13:24 PM
60 RPI. Tied for 4th in the ACC at 9-7. 19-12 overall. 13-3 at home. Knocked out in the second round of the ACC tournament by #17 Florida State. They beat Florida State in Miami, and also won at Duke.
Worst loss? At Maryland? No really bad losses. Maryland is RPI 105. Worst home loss? NC State?
Not going to be an easy game.
easy? not likely. but that doesn't mean we can't win it. but we're going to have to play more like we did against butler than against detroit if that's the goal.
the winner gets the winner of la salle/minnesota - another potentially good game.
Looking at our bracket, depending on the wins, it could be a rather inexpensive travel plan compared to other teams. The most expensive travel brackets look to be the Washington or Arizona brackets. The most uncertain playouts in brackets have to be Seton Hall and Tennessee brackets. I feel the Washington bracket could be Dayton's, and the Seton Hall bracket will probably go to Drexel. The Tennessee bracket, if we can't go deep, I see either Tennessee or Miami doing something in our bracket.
The players certainly cannot be too disappointed with this trip to Miami during spring break! ;)
I'm glad that we got a matchup with a major conference opponent. This will be good preparation for everyone on the team for next season.
Yes, Miami has some good wins and no really bad losses. However, in each of the past seasons where we have made the postseason, it always seemed like we were placed against a team that had more than just their solid players working for them. Boston College, Arizona, Maryland, Michigan State, Kentucky, and Gonzaga each had/have programs at the elite level at the time we were playing them. This added an intimidation factor that can be daunting if you get behind a team early. This match-up is more like our wins against Ole Miss, Florida State, Washington, and losses to Iowa/Rhode Island/Houston/Iona. Yes, it is a major conference opponent, but one that will just be a match-up between their respective players, rather than our players versus theirs, along with the strong history of their program. As a player, the history of the program can add the mystique I originally mentioned, which can add the extra nerves. Hopefully this makes sense...lol
Miami looks like a team of "high variability". They only shoot 43% from the floor and have about a 1:1 assist to turnover ratio, but they beat Duke (AT DUKE) and beat Florida State. It seems pretty questionable which Miami team will show up - but Valpo needs to be prepared for a team looking to prove something.
Doubtful there will be many in attendance - Miami drew 7,000 for North Carolina in February and their last home game had 3700.
The disappointment in not making the NCAA tournament is much more evident in this video from the U of M Hurricanes website than the talk about the NIT tournament. There isn't much mention of Valpo except the mispronunciation of Valpara-I-so and saying that the Crusaders won their league. No mention of beating Butler 3 times. Their coach, Larranaga, mentions that Valpo is a three point shooting team and is different from the teams that the Canes usually play.
Coach Larranaga and Malcolm Grant talk about the NIT (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4b-9oCB8aY#ws)
From the beat writers today, Edwards' family hasn't been to see him play this season?
I think I could pretty easily get behind some sort of (modest?) stipend for family travel. I mean, it might be for non-financial reasons that they haven't been able to make a trip to Valpo. But...
Quote from: historyman on March 12, 2012, 08:24:18 AMTheir coach, Larranaga, mentions that Valpo is a three point shooting team and is different from the teams that the Canes usually play.
Yeah, that's about what we got on the NIT selection show too. I mean, for _some_ games we're a three point shooting team. It really felt like it was a minority. A couple of memorable games late in the conference season.
I don't suppose they'll overlook KVW, after they have time to do some scouting.
Wish I could feel good about this match up. This could be a loss by a wide margin comparable to some of our first round exits in the NCAA tournament. Hopefully, as someone pointed out, it will be a valuable lesson as preparation begins for next year.
Having gone to both schools, this is one hell of a match up for me as a fan. Miami is a good team, but if Valpo plays their "A" game, they can win. The intangible IMO is the Durand Scott situation. If he stays ineligible (improper benefits), and we bring our "A" game, I like our chances. I think we can win, but a "C" or even "B" game probably won't do it.
There's something to be said, mystique or no mystique, about an opponent pounding away against ACC teams on a game by game basis. The ACC is a lot of bigs banging a lot of the time. So, ya got to have more than just KVW to match playing styles. But having said that, you can already sense that Miami is dismissing Valpar-eye-zo as road kill on the way to the next game. Not wise.
It might sound ridiculous, but I consider this game an early start to next season. If we think we're going to be a better team next year, then we need to prove that we can beat the big boys now. A run deep into the NIT might do wonders for this team next season.
Not ridiculous at all. Precisely how Brad Stevens is viewing Butler in the CBI.
Early Vegas odds favor Miami by a dozen points.
I say that the disappointment of not making the NCAA tournament really affects Miami at the beginning of the game (like our reaction to the CIT last year). How we respond to their slow start will determine the outcome. We didn't take advantage of Detroit's terrible first half like we could have, and it bit us in the end. I think we don't make that mistake again:
Valpo 71
Miami 68
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1101333-nit-2012-bracket-breaking-down-sleeper-teams-in-each-region (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1101333-nit-2012-bracket-breaking-down-sleeper-teams-in-each-region)
Quote
Top-Left Region
Valparaiso Crusaders
The best attribute for Valpo is its ability to shoot the ball. The Crusaders are the best shooting team in this field, hitting over 47 percent of their shots.
Despite their high-percentage shooting, the Crusaders don't have great athletes. That is why they have to play a slower style in order to win. When they are forced to run, they lose energy early and make mistakes late in games.
They are in an easy bracket; all the Crusaders have to worry about is getting past a hot-and-cold Miami team in the first round. If they do that, they should cruise into the Final Four.
Hopefully he didn't _just_ compare shooting percentages. But, nice to see someone likes us to make a run.... if we can get past Miami.
odds makers don't seem to like us Miami is a 12 point favorite the biggist spread of the first round games, and make Valpo 100 to 1 odds to win the NIT the 4Th longest of the 32 teams.
gota be upset time!
Valpo 69
Miami 67
Paul Oren is tweeting a couple illnesses. This is not looking good. Harris and Kenney, I believe. Not out by any means, but not flying until tomorrow.
Looking like Valpo will be the walking wounded at this game. Rowdy, Kenney, and now Jay all sick. Lovely.
Quote from: StlVUFan on March 13, 2012, 11:54:33 AM
Paul Oren is tweeting a couple illnesses. This is not looking good. Harris and Kenney, I believe. Not out by any means, but not flying until tomorrow.
Not looking good if two players are under the weather, at best. We need everyone at 100%, and bringing their 'A' game. We really need a great shooting night, and keeping Miami off the boards.
Quote from: VULB#62 on March 12, 2012, 04:15:28 PM
mystique or no mystique,
Thank god it's not a football game. :)
Quote from: Valpo89 on March 13, 2012, 03:23:54 PM
Quote from: VULB#62 on March 12, 2012, 04:15:28 PM
mystique or no mystique,
Thank god it's not a football game. :)
Now that's a scary thought. Has there ever been a game where one team scored on every possession?
three sick? not good ...
try Miami 78 Valpo 61 :o
Wasn't Rowdy sick a week ago? What does he have!? I wish I had confidence in this game...but I fear it could get ugly fast if the shots don't fall.
Quote from: govalpogo on March 14, 2012, 08:59:47 AM
Wasn't Rowdy sick a week ago? What does he have!? I wish I has confidence in this game...but I fear it could get ugly fast if the shots don't fall.
Rowdy had an undisclosed "stomach bug" which caused him to lose 3-4 lbs. The paper this morning said he had gained it back and had been getting IVs at the hospital. He says he'll be fine. Matt has flu like symptoms but made the trip while Jay also has flu like symptoms and didn't go but still might fly down today. Kevin has pain but will go. It will be a tough matchup regardless.
If Valpo is not 100% or near 100%, we have no shot IMO unless Miami plays very very average. The best that we can hope for if we are not at full strength is that Durand Scott remains ineligible and that we catch them on an off night and steal one away. That is a possibility as Miami is kind of an up and down team. My guess is that there will only be a few thousand at the game tonight (maybe less) so the home court really won't be a big factor. It'll probably be the same environment as it was at Iowa when we played them in the NIT a few years ago, so stealing one away is possible. The question is whether we have the horses to do so if Miami comes out flat.
Quote from: crusaderjoe on March 14, 2012, 09:57:39 AM
If Valpo is not 100% or near 100%, we have no shot IMO unless Miami plays very very average. The best that we can hope for if we are not at full strength is that Durand Scott remains ineligible and that we catch them on an off night and steal one away. That is a possibility as Miami is kind of an up and down team. My guess is that there will only be a few thousand at the game tonight (maybe less) so the home court really won't be a big factor. It'll probably be the same environment as it was at Iowa when we played them in the NIT a few years ago, so stealing one away is possible. The question is whether we have the horses to do so if Miami comes out flat.
Unfortunately, we have to also hope that WE don't come out flat. That has been a problem for us on the road both last year and this, resulting in some blowout losses to teams we should have handled. Usually you can see the signs within the first 4-5 minutes - hesitant at both ends, letting the other team set the tempo, careless turnovers, etc. It's a weird thing. It almost looks like all 5 guys are trying to get the kinks out and everyone is "waiting for the game to come to them," as the expression goes. We definitely have to have a couple of guys step up on the offensive end right from the opening tip. We also have to hope Kevin can stay in the game and work through his pain. If not, we're probably DOA.
Quote from: agibson on March 12, 2012, 08:35:47 AM
From the beat writers today, Edwards' family hasn't been to see him play this season?
I think I could pretty easily get behind some sort of (modest?) stipend for family travel. I mean, it might be for non-financial reasons that they haven't been able to make a trip to Valpo. But...
The missus has to work today and tomorrow, but I just got home and off tomorrow (my boss is a big basketball fan!). Heading off in a few minutes after working all night. A friend is driving down so I can get some sleep.
Thanks for the thought!
John Edwards
If the Valpo team that beat Cleveland State 59-41 and Butler the last two games at home shows up, it will be close or even a VU win.
If the team that sucked it up at Youngstown and against Detroit shows up, it's lights out for the Crusaders.
Quote from: MattCarter on March 13, 2012, 01:20:17 PM
Looking like Valpo will be the walking wounded at this game. Rowdy, Kenney, and now Jay all sick. Lovely.
Just noticed the health update by combing the thread and seeing NWI's gameday preview... What is going on? Three guys with the "sick bug" plus Kevin's leg issues? How are we getting this rash of health issues and how are we going to compete tonight if so many key people might not be 100%? This is tough...
Just heard that Miami Jr. G Durand Scott has to SIT OUT 6 GAMES starting with tonight's NIT matchup against Valpo. Does this change anyone's thoughts on the game outcome, or will you wait until we know about the three flu bugs that we are uncertain about?
We usually fall flat against big name schools, but I'm no pessimist! Go valpo! :thumbsup:
2-18 from 3 point so far. Maddening.
Last year Valpo wore out, had sicknesses and injuries during the end of the regular season. This year they made it to the tournament championship before wearing down, suffering illness and injury. Here is hoping that adding a couple of big men next year will help the Crusaders stay strong through the league tournament and into post-season play.
abysmal perimeter shooting. while the usually awful perimeter-shooting canes manage to shoot the lights out of the building. not having kenney and jay coming off the bench really wore on the guys, and it was evident in the last five minutes.
Almost glad this happened in the NIT rather than against a 2 or 3 seed in the NCAA. Hard to play anybody with only 6 guys. Would have been a much better game is just Matt could have played.
Six guys available to play tonight. That's a page out of Freeman's book - 6 players.Great excuse for losing: "Hell, I only had six players to work with." Give me a break. Something's wrong in Mudville cause the "mighty" Crusaders have again struck out. >:( I'm ready for some FOOTBALL!
Great effort by the Gang of 6, but as I texted my son -- just hate when you know you could have won that game if you had even 1 more healthy guard. I also wish Boggs and Bogan could have found their shots as the 3-point looks were OPEN. Ryan looked gassed as did most of them, but Rowdy and Richie (ANZConnection) had terrific games. Hopefully, they learned they can play with and know that they can win games like this. Understand they didn't finish, but even down 12 and Paul Oren calling them done on his twitter, they cut it to 3 before the wagon hit the wall. All in all, the program is on the right path, Bryce did a wonderful job this year, and we have the core back plus Bobby and Fernandez. Should be fun next Fall.
I just couldn't believe the change of events when Edwards went for the dunk, missed it and Miami answered with two 3-pointers. I called the game at that point simply because if those types of plays are happening, it's not your night. Valiant effort. One more guard, either Kenney or Harris, and this game is different. If Bogan's 3-pointer goes down at 54-50, different outcome in my mind.
Quote from: Pgmado on March 14, 2012, 11:07:41 PM
One more guard, either Kenney or Harris, and this game is different.
This begs the question that should have been answered by now and needs to be addressed before next year: What is the deal with Kurth?
Yes, that swing of Richie missing the dunk, to the other end of the court getting 6 quick points could have been a dagger. I was very impressed that we got it back to 4 with 4:30 left, we just didn't have anything left in the tank. As I mentioned on the chat, we need some of our guards to really work on their passing this offseason. Jumping in the air without knowing where you might be able to pass is a terrible basketball move, and all too common for us this season. It will be interesting to see how Bryce manages playing time next year, but it is dependent on who comes back. I can't see anyone from the rotation leaving for another program at this point in their careers, but I have been surprised before. What about Kurth and Vucic though? Are they ok to be a Phil Wille and Jason Hawkins?
So what is up with the attendance? 1227?? If Miami had come to the ARC the place would be packed or close to it. I understand the higher seeds getting the home game but perhaps an attendance requirement? Say, 2000??
Quote from: vu72 on March 15, 2012, 09:46:27 AMIf Miami had come to the ARC the place would be packed or close to it.
How was the place for Iona last year? A quality mid-major?
Butler's home crowd for Delaware was the lowest in... more than 5 years?
Heck of a tough game to win with only six players. Amazingly close, considering that. You were left wondering, "Why do we keep taking these threes?", and "Can't we put somebody in, just anybody, to give these guys a break?" But, presumably that's why Bryce gets paid the big bucks. Would Edwards have been smashed down low, if we'd tried to develop a more aggressive inside game? Maybe. Would Vucic and Shelton have had their lunch handed to them? Maybe.
It would be nice to win one of these games sometime! But, a quality season. A lot more than anyone expected. Looking forward to next year, for sure.
Now, the league's down to Butler and Detroit, for 2012.
Quote from: agibson on March 15, 2012, 10:20:54 AM
Quote from: vu72 on March 15, 2012, 09:46:27 AMIf Miami had come to the ARC the place would be packed or close to it.
How was the place for Iona last year? A quality mid-major?
Butler's home crowd for Delaware was the lowest in... more than 5 years?
Heck of a tough game to win with only six players. Amazingly close, considering that. You were left wondering, "Why do we keep taking these threes?", and "Can't we put somebody in, just anybody, to give these guys a break?" But, presumably that's why Bryce gets paid the big bucks. Would Edwards have been smashed down low, if we'd tried to develop a more aggressive inside game? Maybe. Would Vucic and Shelton have had their lunch handed to them? Maybe.
It would be nice to win one of these games sometime! But, a quality season. A lot more than anyone expected. Looking forward to next year, for sure.
Now, the league's down to Butler and Detroit, for 2012.
See Washington in the CBI a few years back, where Bouchie dominated an NBA-bound Brockman ;)
Quote from: agibson on March 15, 2012, 10:20:54 AM
Quote from: vu72 on March 15, 2012, 09:46:27 AMIf Miami had come to the ARC the place would be packed or close to it.
How was the place for Iona last year? A quality mid-major?
Butler's home crowd for Delaware was the lowest in... more than 5 years?
Heck of a tough game to win with only six players. Amazingly close, considering that. You were left wondering, "Why do we keep taking these threes?", and "Can't we put somebody in, just anybody, to give these guys a break?" But, presumably that's why Bryce gets paid the big bucks. Would Edwards have been smashed down low, if we'd tried to develop a more aggressive inside game? Maybe. Would Vucic and Shelton have had their lunch handed to them? Maybe.
It would be nice to win one of these games sometime! But, a quality season. A lot more than anyone expected. Looking forward to next year, for sure.
Now, the league's down to Butler and Detroit, for 2012.
The box score shows attendance at the Iona game was 1482. But, that was Iona, a good mid-major but hardly a household name in NW Indiana. I think getting an ACC team to the ARC, regardless of the tournament, would certainly draw more, I'm guessing at least 3500. Oh well...
I never did check how he did: but yeah, 2nd round of the draft, playing ~10 minutes a game for the Kings now the Bucks. Not bad.
And, indeed, that was a heck of a game. Followed by defeat at... was it Houston?
Maybe if KVW had been healthy. There Johnson character was pretty beefy... but it was good fun to watch him chase Edwards on the perimeter.
So, yeah, I should have said that it would be "nice to win one of these games once in a while!". Once a decade is a little on the light side.
Guys, the truth is, no one really wants to come to these NIT or CBI or whatever-it-is-they-are-called games. Last night Drake here in Des Moines drew less than 2,000 fans for the CBI game against North Dakota or somebody. UNI played at an A-10 school, I can't even remember who it was, and the crowd was around 2,000. LaSalle played Minny last night (and by the way, their gym looks no better than ours on TV, and I actually thought our gym looks better) and drew around 3,000. People just don't care to come see these games. I would not have gone to the ARC to see us play Miami. Sorry, but I just wouldn't have gone. To me, the season is over now except for the NCAA tourney, which, let's face it, is the only one people care about.
There are way too many teams going to these postseason tournaments now. It's kind of like getting a participation ribbon at school. Everybody gets one.
Paul
Quote from: 78crusader on March 15, 2012, 11:47:16 AM
Guys, the truth is, no one really wants to come to these NIT or CBI or whatever-it-is-they-are-called games. Last night Drake here in Des Moines drew less than 2,000 fans for the CBI game against North Dakota or somebody. UNI played at an A-10 school, I can't even remember who it was, and the crowd was around 2,000. LaSalle played Minny last night (and by the way, their gym looks no better than ours on TV, and I actually thought our gym looks better) and drew around 3,000. People just don't care to come see these games. I would not have gone to the ARC to see us play Miami. Sorry, but I just wouldn't have gone. To me, the season is over now except for the NCAA tourney, which, let's face it, is the only one people care about.
There are way too many teams going to these postseason tournaments now. It's kind of like getting a participation ribbon at school. Everybody gets one.
Paul
i partially agree, and partially disagree. for the cit and cbi, sure - they're still really new, and still trying to establish themselves. but for the nit, there are still plenty of people that would go. it's an established, respectable postseason appearance. there are plenty of places that would fill up an nit game if they got the chance. and honestly, i think valpo would be one, if the students weren't on spring break. hell, some from chicago may even have driven back just for the game if we had hosted. but spring break is a legitimate attendance problem during the month of march.
Quote from: 78crusader on March 15, 2012, 11:47:16 AM
Guys, the truth is, no one really wants to come to these NIT or CBI or whatever-it-is-they-are-called games. Last night Drake here in Des Moines drew less than 2,000 fans for the CBI game against North Dakota or somebody. UNI played at an A-10 school, I can't even remember who it was, and the crowd was around 2,000. LaSalle played Minny last night (and by the way, their gym looks no better than ours on TV, and I actually thought our gym looks better) and drew around 3,000. People just don't care to come see these games. I would not have gone to the ARC to see us play Miami. Sorry, but I just wouldn't have gone. To me, the season is over now except for the NCAA tourney, which, let's face it, is the only one people care about.
There are way too many teams going to these postseason tournaments now. It's kind of like getting a participation ribbon at school. Everybody gets one.
Paul
If you think about it, there are now over 350 D-1 teams out there, and 140 make the postseason. For American sports, that is the worst percentage of teams making the postseason...
Hm? The 2010 numbers are the ones I have handy. There 70 of 120 FBS played in bowl games.
I think he's saying lowest percentage of all sports. For instance over half the teams in the NHL and NBA make the playoffs.
Ah, you might have a point. Now I'm not sure if TX was agreeing, or disagreeing, with Paul!
In MLB, even in the new format for next year, it's only 10 of 30 teams that make it to the post-season.
NCAA basketball begins to seem... sort of middle of the pack? Or, indeed, as Chef suggests, maybe a bit on the low side? In terms of post-season participation among American sports.
I was disagreeing, sorry. I think that college basketball is fine with the number of teams that make the postseason currently.
If you look at NCAA baseball, it is 64 of 300+ teams, with the same for softball, I believe. Around half make it in the NBA, NHL, and MLS. I think it is only fair other teams are rewarded for their seasons, as otherwise, Mid-Majors would not be able to be rewarded as much.