2017 Men's/Women's Cross Country Schedule???

[VULB#62]

How come CC only has 4 meets spread out over nine (9) weeks prior to the MVC Championships?  Are distance runners that delicate that they need two weeks between meets to recover from a 10K (men) and a 6K (women) race?  To me, that's a lot of time practicing for little in the way of competition.  Just wondering.  Valporun?

[valporun]

To answer this question, yes. Distance runners do require a lot more recovery time from an 8K or 5-6K. It isn't so much that we're delicate, but have a lot of different muscles to recover over a period of time, compared to sprinters who run for less than a minute at a time in races. The small schedule is due to the number of meets available to the travel budget and time getting to the meets. Coach Straubel doesn't have a huge travel budget to include overnights for meets in September, plus depending on the number of athletes going to meets, he would need a lot of rooms. If you look across all of NCAA Cross Country, most teams only run 4-5 meets before their conference meet. Looks like a really short season, but with all the practice time and time to recover from meets that aren't all run on flat courses, the recovery time is crucial, so yes, we seem delicate, but it takes time to recover from a race, compared to what your everyday runner feels they need.

[VU2624]

How come CC only has 4 meets spread out over nine (9) weeks prior to the MVC Championships?  Are distance runners that delicate that they need two weeks between meets to recover from a 10K (men) and a 6K (women) race?  To me, that's a lot of time practicing for little in the way of competition.  Just wondering.  Valporun?

Normal scheduling for XC. Some major schools don't even run their top athletes in all 4 of those meets. I think your understanding of how much a 10,000m race run at a competitive effort (not participatory as most people do) takes out of a body isn't very good. For any extended length of time, you wouldn't want to run an 8k or 10k race even every other week.

The University of Oregon Ducks have been a power in NCAA Cross Country for longer than I've been on this earth. They will run 3 meets prior to the conference meet and, chances are, their best runners will run in only 2 of the 3 meets and some may only run in the Pre Nationals meet.

[valpotx]

At least we are not the worst in Men's CC!  We finished in 8th place, out of the 9 teams that compete.  Let's see how the women do!

I don't believe that I have ever watched a CC event via video until today.  Did the HL ever stream these meets?

[valporun]

No, the Horizon didn't stream cross country, but they did stream the indoor and outdoor track and field championships.

I'm hoping that our recruiting really picks up, so we aren't always a young, inexperienced, or limited program. We haven't had a season to be excited about in a long time, and it's time for some recruiting changes to be made in XC.

[VULB#62]

No, the Horizon didn't stream cross country, but they did stream the indoor and outdoor track and field championships.

I'm hoping that our recruiting really picks up, so we aren't always a young, inexperienced, or limited program. We haven't had a season to be excited about in a long time, and it's time for some recruiting changes to be made in XC.

I don't know, Run, if you share this opinion, but the Valpo profile (top level academics, small college enrollment size and atmosphere but with multiple areas of academic challenges, coupled with a D-I designation) should be super attractive to long distance runners. I am sterotyping this type of athlete, of course, but I think it generally holds. So, in closing, I agree that alot more needs to be put into the recruiting process.

[vu72]

No, the Horizon didn't stream cross country, but they did stream the indoor and outdoor track and field championships.

I'm hoping that our recruiting really picks up, so we aren't always a young, inexperienced, or limited program. We haven't had a season to be excited about in a long time, and it's time for some recruiting changes to be made in XC.

I don't know, Run, if you share this opinion, but the Valpo profile (top level academics, small college enrollment size and atmosphere but with multiple areas of academic challenges, coupled with a D-I designation, should be super attractive to long distance runners. I am sterotyping this type of athlete, of course, but I think it generally holds. So, in closing, I agree that alot more needs to be put into the recruiting process.

The coach, who is obviously a part timer, has been in charge for many years.  Is it a "hey, anybody want to do this?" situation or does he actually have time to coach and recruit?  He is a full time law professor,who also runs a sports clinic, for those who don't know.

[VULB#62]

Back in the day (1960s) Valpo was fortunate to have an assistant FB coach, Darrell Zimmerman, who doubled as the CC and T&F coach (we did not have a formal indoor program in those days, otherwise he would have done that too).  He would run CC practices and then go over to the FB field to coach the linemen -- incredible energy). He made Valpo into an ICC power in the few short years he was on campus  and moved to the University of the Pacific after the 1965 season to be the OC at UofP and their CC/T&F coach. We have a number of VU HoFers as a result.  Coach Zim  was intense and a motivator.  He recruited well for those times but also relentlessly recruited on campus.  I was just one example - came to play FB and wound up throwing the javelin and setting schoool records and placing 6th in the NCAAs in 1966.  I bring this up because there is some T&F talent walking around campus but not competing. 

Here is an example:

ELIAS EARLY :  A four-year letter winner for the Patriots...was named the 2014 Carrollwood Day School Male Athlete of the Year...earned team's Special Teams MVP Award in 2014 and Offensive Player of the Year honors in 2015...selected Second Team All-State and First Team All-Bay Conference in 2014...chosen Hillsborough County Honorable Mention...finished his high school career with 3,179 all-purpose yards and 24 touchdowns...also lettered four times in track and field...holds the school record for the 400-meter with 50.45 seconds, set in 2014...was a Florida Track and Field State Finalist, a regional champion, district champion and earned First Team All-Bay Conference distinction in 2014 and 2015 while running the 200 and 400 meter...member of National Honor Society...maintained a GPA of over 3.5 all four years whilst enrolled in the International Baccalaureate Program.

I can't imagine Coach Cecchini preventing Elias from competing in track as long as he does not miss Spring ball.  Weight training anand running are complementary.  If I was teh T&F coach I'd be after guys like Elias.

We also have some big, strong OLs and DLs -- obvious candidates for the throws.  And the explosiveness needed for these events is complementary to  football as well.  Just saying.

Getting back to recruiting off campus (and not just distance runners), recruiting takes TIME and a $budget$.  Hopefully both can be increased.

[FieldGoodie05]

Back in the day (1960s) Valpo was fortunate to have an assistant FB coach, Darrell Zimmerman, who doubled as the CC and T&F coach (we did not have a formal indoor program in those days, otherwise he would have done that too).  He would run CC practices and then go over to the FB field to coach the linemen -- incredible energy). He made Valpo into an ICC power in the few short years he was on campus  and moved to the University of the Pacific after the 1965 season to be the OC at UofP and their CC/T&F coach. We have a number of VU HoFers as a result.  Coach Zim  was intense and a motivator.  He recruited well for those times but also relentlessly recruited on campus.  I was just one example - came to play FB and wound up throwing the javelin and setting schoool records and placing 6th in the NCAAs in 1966.  I bring this up because there is some T&F talent walking around campus but not competing. 

Here is an example:

ELIAS EARLY :  A four-year letter winner for the Patriots...was named the 2014 Carrollwood Day School Male Athlete of the Year...earned team's Special Teams MVP Award in 2014 and Offensive Player of the Year honors in 2015...selected Second Team All-State and First Team All-Bay Conference in 2014...chosen Hillsborough County Honorable Mention...finished his high school career with 3,179 all-purpose yards and 24 touchdowns...also lettered four times in track and field...holds the school record for the 400-meter with 50.45 seconds, set in 2014...was a Florida Track and Field State Finalist, a regional champion, district champion and earned First Team All-Bay Conference distinction in 2014 and 2015 while running the 200 and 400 meter...member of National Honor Society...maintained a GPA of over 3.5 all four years whilst enrolled in the International Baccalaureate Program.

I can't imagine Coach Cecchini preventing Elias from competing in track as long as he does not miss Spring ball.  Weight training anand running are complementary.  If I was teh T&F coach I'd be after guys like Elias.

We also have some big, strong OLs and DLs -- obvious candidates for the throws.  And the explosiveness needed for these events is complementary to  football as well.  Just saying.

Getting back to recruiting off campus (and not just distance runners), recruiting takes TIME and a $budget$.  Hopefully both can be increased.

You'd be amazed at how closed minded football coaches can be.  I went to VU to play football and nearly had to quit the football team to compete in T&F.  This was common in my time.  Eventually the ONLY T&F members who competed were ones that had to choose T&F over Football.  Different time, yes.

Another example is the walk-on from Valpo High (Helms)...strong runner at VHS and would do well on T&F.  Not hearing we have successfully gotten him into a 2-sport athlete.  Still early though.

[JD24]

Back in the day (1960s) Valpo was fortunate to have an assistant FB coach, Darrell Zimmerman, who doubled as the CC and T&F coach (we did not have a formal indoor program in those days, otherwise he would have done that too).  He would run CC practices and then go over to the FB field to coach the linemen -- incredible energy). He made Valpo into an ICC power in the few short years he was on campus  and moved to the University of the Pacific after the 1965 season to be the OC at UofP and their CC/T&F coach. We have a number of VU HoFers as a result.  Coach Zim  was intense and a motivator.  He recruited well for those times but also relentlessly recruited on campus.  I was just one example - came to play FB and wound up throwing the javelin and setting schoool records and placing 6th in the NCAAs in 1966.  I bring this up because there is some T&F talent walking around campus but not competing. Here is an example: ELIAS EARLY :  A four-year letter winner for the Patriots...was named the 2014 Carrollwood Day School Male Athlete of the Year...earned team's Special Teams MVP Award in 2014 and Offensive Player of the Year honors in 2015...selected Second Team All-State and First Team All-Bay Conference in 2014...chosen Hillsborough County Honorable Mention...finished his high school career with 3,179 all-purpose yards and 24 touchdowns...also lettered four times in track and field...holds the school record for the 400-meter with 50.45 seconds, set in 2014...was a Florida Track and Field State Finalist, a regional champion, district champion and earned First Team All-Bay Conference distinction in 2014 and 2015 while running the 200 and 400 meter...member of National Honor Society...maintained a GPA of over 3.5 all four years whilst enrolled in the International Baccalaureate Program. I can't imagine Coach Cecchini preventing Elias from competing in track as long as he does not miss Spring ball.  Weight training anand running are complementary.  If I was teh T&F coach I'd be after guys like Elias. We also have some big, strong OLs and DLs -- obvious candidates for the throws.  And the explosiveness needed for these events is complementary to  football as well.  Just saying. Getting back to recruiting off campus (and not just distance runners), recruiting takes TIME and a $budget$.  Hopefully both can be increased.

There were a number of others on the football roster who were high level competitors in track and field in HS. Gessinger as an example. Brandon Riley has been competing on the track team.

[VULB#62]

Granted, this is a CC string but that relates to T&F in general.  Being a good student, while at the same time being involved in D-I level athletic teams, is a tough load to carry and I understand that.  However, if there are two sports that are complementary and help each other in building speed and strength, it's FB and track.  I would hope that the benefits of competing in both would be recognized by both head coaches -- as long as the primary sport, in this case FB, is not short-changed along the way.

[vu72]

Back in the day (1960s) Valpo was fortunate to have an assistant FB coach, Darrell Zimmerman, who doubled as the CC and T&F coach (we did not have a formal indoor program in those days, otherwise he would have done that too).  He would run CC practices and then go over to the FB field to coach the linemen -- incredible energy). He made Valpo into an ICC power in the few short years he was on campus  and moved to the University of the Pacific after the 1965 season to be the OC at UofP and their CC/T&F coach. We have a number of VU HoFers as a result.  Coach Zim  was intense and a motivator.  He recruited well for those times but also relentlessly recruited on campus.  I was just one example - came to play FB and wound up throwing the javelin and setting schoool records and placing 6th in the NCAAs in 1966. I bring this up because there is some T&F talent walking around campus but not competing. 

Here is an example:

ELIAS EARLY :  A four-year letter winner for the Patriots...was named the 2014 Carrollwood Day School Male Athlete of the Year...earned team's Special Teams MVP Award in 2014 and Offensive Player of the Year honors in 2015...selected Second Team All-State and First Team All-Bay Conference in 2014...chosen Hillsborough County Honorable Mention...finished his high school career with 3,179 all-purpose yards and 24 touchdowns...also lettered four times in track and field...holds the school record for the 400-meter with 50.45 seconds, set in 2014...was a Florida Track and Field State Finalist, a regional champion, district champion and earned First Team All-Bay Conference distinction in 2014 and 2015 while running the 200 and 400 meter...member of National Honor Society...maintained a GPA of over 3.5 all four years whilst enrolled in the International Baccalaureate Program.

I can't imagine Coach Cecchini preventing Elias from competing in track as long as he does not miss Spring ball.  Weight training anand running are complementary.  If I was teh T&F coach I'd be after guys like Elias.

We also have some big, strong OLs and DLs -- obvious candidates for the throws.  And the explosiveness needed for these events is complementary to  football as well.  Just saying.

Getting back to recruiting off campus (and not just distance runners), recruiting takes TIME and a $budget$.  Hopefully both can be increased.

Apparently he could if he wanted to as has someone else mentioned. Brandon Riley (a football starter) is on the track team and currently is second all time in the 400 meter indoors at 49.23.

Hey 62, you are still on the books!  What is difference between "Pre-Modern" and "Modern" records? 

[JD24]

Apparently he could if he wanted to as has someone else mentioned. Brandon Riley (a football starter) is on the track team and currently is second all time in the 400 meter indoors at 49.23. Hey 62, you are still on the books!  What is difference between "Pre-Modern" and "Modern" records?

The implement was changed in 1986 essentially because, in a certain sense, it was being thrown too far for the stadiums to safely hold the event at the top level internationally. I can't remember if this was immediately put into place at the collegiate level although I'm sure it was either at the time or shortly thereafter.

[VULB#62]

Hey 62, you are still on the books!  What is difference between "Pre-Modern" and "Modern" records?

The most radical change to javelins was in the wake of Uwe Hohn's throw of 104.80 meters in 1984. Because the risk to spectators from throws of this magnitude became very real, the IAAF made a decision in 1986 to move the center of gravity back 10 centimeters. This altered flight characteristics and the new javelin resulted in throws 10 to 15 meters shorter and made the javelin more prone to stick in the ground.

For perspective, 104.80 meters converts to 343.83 feet.  In concrete terms, a throw released at the back line of the west endzone of the Brown Field football field would travel the entire length of the playing surface and stick in the ground about 10' into the opposite endzone.  The pre-modern javelin also had a tendency to land flat and skid for yards before coming to a halt -- very dangerous.

It is kinda nice to know that my distance is still on the list after 51 years. I suspect my converted 1966 distance today would likely still make the top 3 modern distances.  That would be particularly true given all the advances in modern weight training techniques, resistance training and throwing technique development afforded the modern throwers like Valpo's Jeremy Getz. He also had the benefit of being trained by Tom Pukstys, a 2-time US olympian in the event and the American record holder in 1993.  Back in the day, my basic training tool was an old javelin with a bungy cord tied to the tail and a clip on the end that I attached to a fence or anything solid.  Then I'd do multiple reps.  I also did basic curls and shoulder shruggs and stuff like that, but it wasn't emphasized due to fear of losng flexibility and snap.  Most of it was made up as I went along -- no one knew how to coach it back then.

Here's a quick note on Pukstys.  The coaches listed for track & field do NOT include him anymore, although when you Google him he is listed as being on the staff for 2017-18.

[JD24]

Conversion from old to new is around 6%. So only Getz would have passed you.

[VULB#62]

Conversion from old to new is around 6%. So only Getz would have passed you.

So would Jim Maryanski (218-4).          But it took him 10 years