Butler-Gardner Webb

valpo84 · November 24, 2011, 01:24:59 AM

We better take advantage of Butler now. They struggled to a close win (again) over a team they should have handled tonight, Gardner-Webb. They were down big at the half. Stigell finally knocked down some shots and Chrishawn carried them. Their offensive flow is really rough especially starting games, and their defense is keeping them in games late, but that's been against directional and hyphenated schools. We need to jump out early and then put the pedal down. Stevens will get them playing 40 minutes, but they're having some tough games. UIC clipped Evansville tonight. But what is even better is the Butler Nation is not even talking about us but worried about X, IU and Purdue.

vuweathernerd · November 24, 2011, 08:54:17 AM

interesting. uic beat evansville who beat butler. and uic was picked to spend another year around the basement. but 84 is right. we definitely need to come out strong and keep it going. the problem with a team playing to about the level of their competition is how much harder it is to get a good idea of where they stand as a team. definitely gonna make for an interesting game next weekend.

sectionee · November 24, 2011, 08:59:46 AM

I wish I could go back to my preseason prediction because I would make us the winners in this match up. I'm liking our odds next weekend. I see we have a week to prepare for them while they will have just a couple of days, probably not that big of a deal. But after playing us they have X, Gonzaga, Purdue, and Stanford over the next few weeks. No reason we can't go into this hostile environment and set the tone early for the conference.

bbtds · November 25, 2011, 08:23:36 AM

I know Butler has struggled but I don't think you should ever think they won't give you the game of your life. Remember last year they lost to Youngstown at YSU and still made it to the National championship game in a little under 2 months span. Never, never, never take Butler lightly. They have some very explosive talent on that team.

IrishDawg · November 28, 2011, 01:02:53 PM

Quote from: sectionee on November 24, 2011, 08:59:46 AM
I wish I could go back to my preseason prediction because I would make us the winners in this match up. I'm liking our odds next weekend. I see we have a week to prepare for them while they will have just a couple of days, probably not that big of a deal. But after playing us they have X, Gonzaga, Purdue, and Stanford over the next few weeks. No reason we can't go into this hostile environment and set the tone early for the conference.

Trust me, the majority of their time (if not all), will be working on their own game and prepping for Valpo. Their game tomorrow night is against a D2 program in Oakland City, so I doubt there's going to be a ton of actual game prep going into that one.

Not saying Valpo can't go there and win, because unfortunately this team (Butler) has been really bad at a lot of the little things that has made them tough to beat (turnovers, FT shooting, etc.) in the past. Having said that, I think that it's going to be a very close game, and the way things have looked in the OOC schedule, pretty much every conference game is going to be a must-win type of situation with Butler. Just hope that once they finally do get into the heart of the conference schedule that they have it together. Next season will bring in some great shooters in Dunham and Clarke, and hopefully all these young guys can become the studs a lot of people have been advertising them to be. IF that happens, then Butler is going to be scary good again next season and pretty deep with talent at the 1-4 spots.

vu72 · November 28, 2011, 01:17:29 PM

Nor saying you won't be "scary good", as any Brad Stevens coached team has the potential. I just think that your current guys will need to step it up to reach the scary good level as relying on freshman very seldom works. You lose three starters (from the starters last night) if I'm not mistaken, although you have a pretty deep rotation. Still, if freshman are to fill those holes then other problems can arise.

Now, Valpo is the team that will be "scary good" and that isn't just me looking through the brown and gold glasses. Consider that we will have everyone back and add two highly regarded freshman (neither of whom are currently eligible) as well as an IU transfer and a Va. Tech transfer. Deep, deep, deep.

Coogles · November 28, 2011, 01:44:05 PM

Quote from: vu72 on November 28, 2011, 01:17:29 PM
Nor saying you won't be "scary good", as any Brad Stevens coached team has the potential. I just think that your current guys will need to step it up to reach the scary good level as relying on freshman very seldom works. You lose three starters (from the starters last night) if I'm not mistaken, although you have a pretty deep rotation.

You are mistaken; Nored and Butcher are the only seniors on the team. Butcher hardly plays and Aldridge is significantly more talented than Nored is, he just needs to get some confidence. Rotnei Clarke (5th year transfer) will be a first-teamer; he was second team all-SEC last year. This team won't be relying on freshmen really at all next year. Dunham will have his chance because of how well he shoots the basketball and Morgan may get some run in some spot defensive situations, but that will probably be about it.

The only questionable spot next year will be center, but Smith is still better than most 5's in the Horizon. Enjoy the "down" year while you can.

vu72 · November 28, 2011, 01:58:29 PM

Sorry, thought Stigall was a senior. As for Butlcher hardly playing, my comment was to the fact that he started last night and played 14 minutes. Starting generally doesn't equate to "hardly playing". I also forgot that clarke was a transfer not an incoming freshman. As for Aldridge, can he play defense like Nored? I doubt it. Last night he played 19 minutes and scored 3 points. Maybe it is his defense that will make him good! We'll just have to wait and see.

We may enjoy this "down" year, but next year we will be the favorites. How does second sound??

valpotx · November 28, 2011, 02:11:33 PM

Not too worried about Butler this year or next year compared to our team. In not losing anyone (except walk-ons), and hopefully getting people eligible, we will be very deep. Just think if Fernandez/Vucic combine at the 5, KVW can play his natural PF position, where he should do well against other HL 4's.

Coogles · November 28, 2011, 02:44:20 PM

Quote from: vu72 on November 28, 2011, 01:58:29 PM
Sorry, thought Stigall was a senior. As for Butlcher hardly playing, my comment was to the fact that he started last night and played 14 minutes. Starting generally doesn't equate to "hardly playing". I also forgot that clarke was a transfer not an incoming freshman. As for Aldridge, can he play defense like Nored? I doubt it. Last night he played 19 minutes and scored 3 points. Maybe it is his defense that will make him good! We'll just have to wait and see.

We may enjoy this "down" year, but next year we will be the favorites. How does second sound??

It sounds like you're optimistic like any fan should be.

As for Butcher, yes...he barely plays. He's averaging 9.5 minutes this year and only started because Stevens wanted to send a message to Marshall about his effort in the last game. He has terrible knees and isn't counted upon for any meaningful production. He does tough things and is a great leader, but his presence on the court won't be missed next year.

With regard to Aldridge; I watch the game with my eyes, not with the box score. He's not playing with a ton of confidence yet, but he's a significantly better player than Nored is.

As for the Vucic/Fernandez comment...Vucic isn't good and Fernandez hasn't played a single minute of D1 basketball yet. Maybe Vashil is great, but excuse me if I don't get excited just because he has a big wingspan. Kameron Woods must be the next Jarvis Varnado with his 7-3 wingspan.

vu72 · November 28, 2011, 03:44:36 PM

I agree that Vucic isn't good--yet, but, he is improving. For the season he is playing 11.9 minutes per game but most recently he played 16 against Ohio State and scored 7 points with 3 boards and zero turnovers. This is a BIG improvement from last year and there are signs of continued improvement. He is only a sophomore eligibility wise.

The consensus is that Fernandez will be better and in particular on the defensive side with terrific shot blocking ability. So, as others have said, if, next year Vucic and Fernandez can handle the 5 that allows Kevin to move to the 4 coupled with Bobby Capobianco at 6'9" 250 lbs.

Anyway you cut it, our depth will be as good or better than anyone in the Horizon. This year we're playing with 9 scholarship players. Next year we will have 13, 7 of whom will be seniors with 4 juniors.

valpotx · November 28, 2011, 03:49:10 PM

The key words I used were 'just think,' which I meant to be taken as 'if they can handle the 5.' Vucic has shown remarkable improvement over last year when he was completely lost on the court. If they are able to handle the 5, Capobianco/KVW mixed in at the 4 with Edwards, we have some depth we have not had in quite awhile. The last time we had this many bigs with outside shooting support was in 2001-2002 & 2002-2003. Those teams did pretty well overall...