12/29, 2:00 p.m. Valpo @ Murray State Game Thread

[LaPorteAveApostle]

And how many times have you predicted a win for Valpo and it didn't happen? What's your actual  prediction winning percentage?

And how many times have you predicted a loss for Valpo and it didn't happen?  What's your actual prediction losing percentage?

[HC]

Unmm, so since neither of you had any part in winning this game and since noone else cares who predicted what as long as we win, perhaps you can finish this conversation in pm's?

[grad66]

It's really nice to see the guys come off a week layoff, fresh legs and focused to win a big one.  From what I saw down in Texas, their sports writers were a bit surprised to see the #5 ranked Mid Major get knocked-off at HOME!!!
Well done Crusaders!  Now for the conference season, keep those W's coming!

[agibson]

So, this is our best non-conference win since... ? 

Any ideas?  For a good long while,  I should think.

Best in general terms?  Best in RPI?

By RPI, we may have to wait until the end-of-season RPI for an easy comparison with earlier seasons.  But, Murray State was 18 before the game, and 31 after.

Looking back over the last four years, anyway, the only RPI top-50 wins were in the 2010-2011 season.  All at home.  Butler finished 19, CSU 43, Missouri State 39.  We'll see if Murray State ends up finishing as high as the likes of those.

[Smj]

Should be an interesting conference opener against ramblers....   Both of us coming off big wins.

[EddieCabot]

Great win for the Crusaders and the Horizon League!  Murray has an outside shot to stay in the RPI top-50, but it will be tough with the OVC schedule upcoming.  They should get a little boost with a good BracketBuster game.

Since Murray has been mentioned as a Horizon League expansion target, I wonder if any Horizon League officials (LeCrone?) made this trip.  Would be a good opportunity to make some introductions.

With expansion in mind, that brings a couple of questions to mind:
1.  Does the fact that Valpo beat Murray in their building help or hurt the cause of getting Murray to the Horizon?  I guess that depends whether Murray is looking for a step up on competition, or if they like being a big fish in a small OVC pond.
2.  Any word on how the travel was to Murray?  Anyone know if Valpo bussed, flew commercial (out of Nashville?) or chartered?  I'm just curious because it seems like the travel might be a concern for both Murray and Belmont in terms of joining the Horizon.

[justducky]

Great win for the Crusaders and the Horizon League!  Murray has an outside shot to stay in the RPI top-50, but it will be tough with the OVC schedule upcoming.  They should get a little boost with a good BracketBuster game.

Because of the Oakland loss our at-large potential remains near zero despite the win at Murray, but just for fun let me run a hypothetical.

Imagine that Murray St gets it back into gear, dominates conference and bracketbuster play but somehow manages to drop one regular season conference game to somebody not named Belmont. Imagine further that they then lose the OVC championship tournament game to the #2 seed (most likely Belmont) giving them a 5 loss season.

Now imagine that Valpo somehow slowly puts it all together with multiple narrow victories resulting in a table run, except they also drop the Horizon championship game to the 2 seed. That would leave Murray and Valpo both on the bubble with 5 loses. Who would have the better case for tournament inclusion and could this result in a both in or both out situation? Yeah-I must have too much time on my hands to have dreamed this all up, so try to humor me. 

[Smj]

....... could this result in a both in or both out situation? Yeah-I must have too much time on my hands to have dreamed this all up, so try to humor me. 

I come up with these scenarios and bring them up with my wife ... Just to drive her crazy ...  She hates it when I think of these hypotheticals.

However, here on fan zone you can pose these crazy situations and will likely find someone else who likes thinking of these.    I can't remember exact situations but I am betting they have solved the bubble by saying both in, both out and who won when they played each other.    I was first thinking it would be neat to see but really I just want another run at the tourney.

Watching some of our conference play games so far - quite a few could get hot at any point and surprise a "better" opponent.   I actually think out first conference game will be VERY interesting.   We are both coming off of big wins.

[LaPorteAveApostle]

There has never been a mid-major with a record of 28-5 (or better) consigned to the NIT. (A low-major at 28-6 was.)

So if we run the table in conference (+BB) we're in even if we lose the tourney final.

[crusadermoe]

Winning the Horizon bid is the ball game and you want the the #1 or #2 seed as a tool to get there. 
Forget the at-large bid.    We will do very well to pick up fewer than 4 HL losses even tho we beat Murray St.    Last year we beat Butler in Indy and still lost 4.   Nothing so far this year proves we are any better.   Just on par.

[justducky]

There has never been a mid-major with a record of 28-5 (or better) consigned to the NIT.

Winning the Horizon bid is the ball game and you want the the #1 or #2 seed as a tool to get there. 
Forget the at-large bid.

I just hate going out on a lake and coming home with an empty stringer, so let me reel in, change bait, move the boat, and  make my cast from a slightly different direction. 

We could imagine that Valpo and Murray St both stay at 5 loses but that every multiple bid league has a big tournament championship upset and that these 2 teams are by the numbers the last team in and the first team out. We could also dream up a case where they might be the last in and the first out with both having lost 6. Either way who would the selection committee pick given the details that I listed in the previous post? Might they be more likely to find a way to rationalize both teams in or both teams out even if that result would be in conflict with the numbers?     Reel reel jerk wiggle wiggle..........Reel reel jerk wiggle wiggle

[wh]

A very newsy post game story from the Murray, KY newspaper, including several quotes from both coaches:

http://murrayledger.com/sports/murray_state/wrong-way-murray-state-falls-in-second-straight-for-first/article_25c9807e-52f9-11e2-8145-0019bb2963f4.html

[vu72]

A very newsy post game story from the Murray, KY newspaper, including several quotes from both coaches:

http://murrayledger.com/sports/murray_state/wrong-way-murray-state-falls-in-second-straight-for-first/article_25c9807e-52f9-11e2-8145-0019bb2963f4.html

Now THAT, was an in-depth article.  Very interesting.  Hopefully our experience will continue to payoff as we go forward.

[DMvalpo18]

Excuse me, but did somebody mention something about us running the table in the Horizon? We are not THAT good. Remember, Gordon Hayward's Butler team did that last, and they went to the National Championship game. Which by the way, that one was a game for the ages. So let's forget about this whole at large thing. The only reason a resumé means something now is so that if we win the conference tournament, we can get a better seed. We lost to Oakland and Nebraska - can we let go of this fanatical world in which you still have at large hopes with those losses?