Welcome to the Horizon League Oakland, Evansivlle, and Belmont!!!!!!!

[Valposter]

Ok, I am just speculating based upon this article from back in September and comments from the Wright State AD at halftime last Saturday.  The article (link posted below) referenced alot of indicators pointing to Oakland, Evansiville, and Belmont as the leading candiates expected to be added as the Horizon League is expected to expand from 9 to 12 teams.

http://www.midmajormadness.com/2012/9/27/3418698/horizon-expansion-candidates-oakland-evansville-belmont-rumor

I bet there is a lot of truth to this rumor.  If it has been finalized by now, then it was probably close to being finalized back in September when this article rolled out.  It makes a lot of sense, and it would certainly be consistent with the comments the Wright State AD was referencing when he said the expansion candidates have been finalized and will be annnounched in March and that the fans of the HL would be very pleased.  With the plural "candidates" we know that 3 teams and not one team is being added.  And we know that Oakland is being added, that has been a given for awhile.  Belmont and Evansville are logical additions to join with Oakland. 

If so, I like it!!!  I think Oakland, Evansiville, and Belmont would be very good additons for both baseball (my first love) and basketball (most people's number on priority).  Actually, I think it would be a very good fit for all sports programs.  Add the Nashville market.  Add a past rival in Evansiville.  And Oakland has been a frontrunner all along.

[Valpo89]

I agree with all three, Valposter. But how do you know that "Oakland being added as been a given for a while?"

I know Greg Kampe would love to be in the Horizon, but I also know Detroit has tried to block them in the past.

[Valposter]

Valpo89, I should clarify that Oakland being added has been a forgone conclusion TO ME.  Certainly by no means do I have concrete inside information nor should this be taken as a statement of fact.  I didn't phrase that well.  However, every rumor that I have heard or seen on the internet or othewise regarding HL expansion has indicated Oakland.  Also, I know a couple of student-athletes at Oakland and they indicated that their coach thought it was likely to happen.

[VULB#62]

Lets wait and see.  But all three add something.

But, if/when Evansville comes aboard in the HL and we resume our competitive association, we need to convince them to resume FB in the PFL.  As mentioned before in other threads, there is a remorse down there about dropping the sport and the PFL could be an answer.  Some of those southern schools I firmly believe are using the PFL as a staging ground for going scholarship FCS in a couple of years.  That's pretty evident when you look at the facilities they are building.

[valpotx]

Belmont makes a lot of sense for us, as it seems like our athletic teams play them just about every year anyways.  I would love to add all 3 in all sports, and get our baseball number up to 8!  Though, I do have to admit that this year's 1 in 5 chance of going to the NCAA tournament is nice lol

[vuweathernerd]

i like the potential, but i think we should hold off on this kind of speculation until something official is out. while these are all good possibilities, there are some others that very well could also be on that list.

[VULB#62]

Yah, that article was in September. But I didn't really expect the Purple Aces to pull out of the MVC -- somewhat of a step down for them.  But that's what makes it tantalizing for the HL as it pulls an OVC and MVC team into the fold.  My brain, however, doesn't handle well Belmont only staying in the OVC for only one year.  On the other hand, Belmont is a private university that might want to expand it's student recruiting base northward and Wisconsin, Illinois, Indiana, Ohio and Michigan can significantly expand their recruiting area -- it would be the only "warm" weather location in the league. But they are already in Illinois and Mizzou.  I don't count Jacksonville State as it is an aberration geographically.

[HC]

These would be great additions. I was hoping for a Murray State, but would be thrilled if these teams were announced in March

[Enrico Palazzo]

I don't know the date, but expect an announcement in March.  And at this point, it's a safe assumption that three teams, not one, will be added.  Heard a lot of names, but at this point it's a parlor game as to whom.

[Valposter]

I don't know the date, but expect an announcement in March. And at this point, it's a safe assumption that three teams, not one, will be added. Heard a lot of names, but at this point it's a parlor game as to whom.

I think I can speak for a lot of the fans of Valpo and the Horizon League that we will be anxiously awaiting the expansion announcement in March!  This will be a big moment for Valpo and the Horizon League to help position us for the future!

[valpopal]

A lot of interesting speculation, some on other boards even suggesting adding 5 teams rather than 3. However, going with the teams most mentioned and in the title of this thread, there seems to be some difficulty in geographic considerations for Valpo. If we go back to travel partners, what would the pairings be?

Milwaukee/Green Bay
Cleveland State/Youngstown State
Detroit/Oakland
Loyola/UIC
Belmont/Evansville
Valpo/Wright State

Or ideally, my preference would be if we added a stronger lineup of schools with Murray State and Robert Morris as well for 5-team expansion:

Milwaukee/Green Bayi
Cleveland State/Wright State
Detroit/Oakland
Loyola/UIC
Belmont/Murray State
Valpo/Evansville
Robert Morris/ Youngstown State

Though I'd like to see Murray State added, I am still afraid IUPUI might eventually be in the mix as a travel partner for Valpo and to provide a school based in Indianapolis, where the Horizon League headquarters are located:

Milwaukee/Green Bay
Cleveland State/Wright State
Detroit/Oakland
Loyola/UIC
Belmont/Evansville
Valpo/IUPUI
Robert Morris/ Youngstown State


All pure speculation.

[FWalum]

I know that I had stated in another thread that I would report back after talking to some of my friends involved with a sports management group that has universities in all of the conferences that could probably be affected by our Horizon League additions/expansion.  I was asked NOT to talk about specifics regarding those conversations and the univeristies those people work with so I did not reply as I had originally intended.  This thread does talk about what most of them thought was the lynch pin university to the 3 team addition to the Horizon League, and that was to my surprise the University of Evansville. They also thought that the Oakland Detroit situation was not as clear cut as we all seem to think that it is. 

[wh]

To FW's point it would not surprise me if Oakland has not received an invitation.  What makes sense to us may play a lot differently in Detroit.  Imagine if there were another mid major in NWI, and they are in the Summit Conference. Right now we can tell potential recruits about the advantages of the HL over the Summit-higher rated conf ., less travel, closer for friends and family to attend road games, etc.  Once they join the HL, all those talking points are gone.  Being honest if we were Detroit, I would be completely against it.  If the conf. can find a way to add quality teams that will support baseball as well as basketball without bringing in Oakland, it would probably be a better long term solution. 

[crusadermoe]

You don't think that the chance to travel and see new sites in the Dakotas during winter is a selling point?   

[bbtds]

Being honest if we were Detroit, I would be completely against it.  If the conf. can find a way to add quality teams that will support baseball as well as basketball without bringing in Oakland, it would probably be a better long term solution.

Wait a minute. Why does Loyola and UIC work in the Horizon League? Why doesn't Detroit sell their school instead of their league or their location when recruiting? Are they afraid that Oakland's suburban location will draw better than their urban location in the city of Detroit. In that case your coach is just plan bad at recruiting. What's the real problem for Detroit? Not a good excuse. Maybe the HL should drop Detroit and pick up Oakland if that is the case.

[VULB#62]

Being honest if we were Detroit, I would be completely against it.  If the conf. can find a way to add quality teams that will support baseball as well as basketball without bringing in Oakland, it would probably be a better long term solution.

Wait a minute. Why does Loyola and UIC work in the Horizon League? Why doesn't Detroit sell their school instead of their league or their location when recruiting? Are they afraid that Oakland's suburban location will draw better than their urban location in the city of Detroit. In that case your coach is just plan bad at recruiting. What's the real problem for Detroit? Not a good excuse. Maybe the HL should drop Detroit and pick up Oakland if that is the case.

I was going to post generally the same thing.  Isn't this like UIC/Loyola and suburban Chicago-located Valpo?  The rivalry potential in super.  Could result in sellouts twice every year.  Maybe like Cincy/Xavier, the Philly 5, USC/UCLA, Colby/Bates/Bowdoin.

[Valposter]

Being honest if we were Detroit, I would be completely against it.  If the conf. can find a way to add quality teams that will support baseball as well as basketball without bringing in Oakland, it would probably be a better long term solution.

Wait a minute. Why does Loyola and UIC work in the Horizon League? Why doesn't Detroit sell their school instead of their league or their location when recruiting? Are they afraid that Oakland's suburban location will draw better than their urban location in the city of Detroit. In that case your coach is just plan bad at recruiting. What's the real problem for Detroit? Not a good excuse. Maybe the HL should drop Detroit and pick up Oakland if that is the case.

All good points. 

Also, as a Conference, I would be careful putting the desires of one school over the best interests of the Conference as a whole.  The Greater Good and all of that.  After all, Detroit, or any HL team (see Butler), can leave at any time for a "better offer".  So, how does it make sense to turn down Oakland, and then Detroit leaves next year to join some other conference they perceive better.  There was an article recently in the Detroit paper that Detroit (Titans) was keeping its options open.

[Valposter]

Here's the link to the Detroit Free Press article I referenced above about Detroit keeping it's "conference options open".

http://www.freep.com/article/20130108/SPORTS08/301080105/College-basketball-roundup-Titans-might-be-tempted-to-look-beyond-Horizon

[wh]

Being honest if we were Detroit, I would be completely against it.  If the conf. can find a way to add quality teams that will support baseball as well as basketball without bringing in Oakland, it would probably be a better long term solution.

Wait a minute. Why does Loyola and UIC work in the Horizon League? Why doesn't Detroit sell their school instead of their league or their location when recruiting? Are they afraid that Oakland's suburban location will draw better than their urban location in the city of Detroit. In that case your coach is just plan bad at recruiting. What's the real problem for Detroit? Not a good excuse. Maybe the HL should drop Detroit and pick up Oakland if that is the case.

All good points. 

Also, as a Conference, I would be careful putting the desires of one school over the best interests of the Conference as a whole. The Greater Good and all of that.  After all, Detroit, or any HL team (see Butler), can leave at any time for a "better offer".  So, how does it make sense to turn down Oakland, and then Detroit leaves next year to join some other conference they perceive better.  There was an article recently in the Detroit paper that Detroit (Titans) was keeping its options open.

Of course we would not want to put the best interests of an individual school over the best interests of the conference.  My point is trying to find a comprehensive solution that best serves the interests of the conference without alienating any of its current members in the process has to be the preferred approach.  For instance, if adding Belmont, Murray State and Evansville would meet the needs of the conference as much as adding Oakland and 2 of those three, the conference would be silly not to consider it.  As to the point that Detroit might walk regardless, Oakland will still be available whether they're a first option or a second.  They're not going anywhere else because they don't fit the profile (geographic, no football, other) of any conference other than the Horizon League. 

[Valposter]

Well said wh...............

[vuweathernerd]

You don't think that the chance to travel and see new sites in the Dakotas during winter is a selling point?   

quoting raj from the big bang theory, "i'd like to answer this. no."

[crusaderjoe]

Being honest if we were Detroit, I would be completely against it.  If the conf. can find a way to add quality teams that will support baseball as well as basketball without bringing in Oakland, it would probably be a better long term solution.

Wait a minute. Why does Loyola and UIC work in the Horizon League? Why doesn't Detroit sell their school instead of their league or their location when recruiting? Are they afraid that Oakland's suburban location will draw better than their urban location in the city of Detroit. In that case your coach is just plan bad at recruiting. What's the real problem for Detroit? Not a good excuse. Maybe the HL should drop Detroit and pick up Oakland if that is the case.

C'mon, this was a joke, right?  If Valpo can't compete for public dollars like Wright State et. al. can, why would you want to cut down on the number of private schools in this conference if you are VU?

I'm not an expert on MCC matters, but something that I think is overlooked in this discussion is that the conference dynamic that was in play when UIC joined the MCC in 1994 and Oakland's situation in potentially joining the HL in 2013 is vastly different from one another, so it is hard to compare both situations IMO.  IIRC, and some of you on this board may have a better memory, but I believe there were only five or six schools left in the MCC when UIC and the others moved as a packaged deal from the Mid-Con in '93/94, thus preserving their automatic bid.  Just a guess, but I would venture that as a charter member of the MCC/HL, UDM has far more leverage now to exert its proximity concerns than Loyola did back then because the HL is not nearly in as much peril now as the MCC was in the early 90's.

And for argument's sake, who says the LUC/UIC thing is working for all parties anyway?  LUC hasn't been to the NCAA tournament since 1985 and UIC has been there three times since 1994. You don't think VU would at least pause and ponder athletically if PUC or PNC decided to make the move to D-I and then attempted to join the HL?

[StlVUFan]

And for argument's sake, who says the LUC/UIC thing is working for all parties anyway?  LUC hasn't been to the NCAA tournament since 1985 and UIC has been there three times since 1994. You don't think VU would at least pause and ponder athletically if PUC or PNC decided to make the move to D-I and then attempted to join the HL?

Yeah, I was going to say.  LUC/UIC "works" because neither team gets much attention from the market they are in anyway.  They're both scrounging table scraps.  The 4 Chicago papers do a horrible job of covering their men's teams and there is zero coverage of their women's teams.  You have to actually have a piece of the pie before you can muster up any jealousy toward your neighbor's attempt to slice off their own piece.

That said, I personally think that if Detroit can't compete with Oakland in the recruiting game, they should be ashamed of themselves.

[vu72]

Being honest if we were Detroit, I would be completely against it.  If the conf. can find a way to add quality teams that will support baseball as well as basketball without bringing in Oakland, it would probably be a better long term solution.

Wait a minute. Why does Loyola and UIC work in the Horizon League? Why doesn't Detroit sell their school instead of their league or their location when recruiting? Are they afraid that Oakland's suburban location will draw better than their urban location in the city of Detroit. In that case your coach is just plan bad at recruiting. What's the real problem for Detroit? Not a good excuse. Maybe the HL should drop Detroit and pick up Oakland if that is the case.

I was going to post generally the same thing.  Isn't this like UIC/Loyola and suburban Chicago-located Valpo?  The rivalry potential in super.  Could result in sellouts twice every year.  Maybe like Cincy/Xavier, the Philly 5, USC/UCLA, Colby/Bates/Bowdoin.

Seriously?  A bit of Northeast snobbery or just having some fun with the field hockey rivalry??  We are talking midwest basketball, not northeast hockey.  You know as well as most that a colby-bates "rivalry" basketball game might draw what? 500 or 600?

I like the Detroit/Oakland thing as much as I loved the Valpo/Butler rivalry.  Interconference rivalries only add to the overall conference status.

[VULB#62]

Just playfully wondering if someone would pick up on it and thought for sure that setshot, not you 72, would be all over that.

But I was serious about the rivalry potential. That could turn into a local war -- and that would be great for both schools.  In the Chicago land area there are many more D-I schools vying for attention.  Metro Detroit less so -- most of the attention is in the East Lansing/Ann Arbor vicinity. A hot rivalry in the metro area would pull some of that attention back to Detroit, don'tcha think?.