Valpo to be visited by MVC this week, thoughts?

[crusadermoe]

Let's just lock down what we have at this point and add Oakland.    Nice location and baseball team.   Also a good area for Valpo alumni.   

Out of the box thinking here and I've mentioned this before: 
Pursue Northern Illinois. 

They might be able to get special permission to play football-only in the MAC.   They aren't a good travel partner for other MACs in non-football.  Travel for the non-football sports from  DeKalb has to be a pain the rump.    They fit the Horizon footprint much better.

[VULB#62]

It really sounds like AD didn't stand for athletic director at Northern Kentucky.   

Apparently doesn't stand for ED either 

[crusaderjoe]

Love the map...I would add Niagara and Canisius from the Buffalo NY area. 

+1

and...

distance between Tulsa, OK and Valparaiso, IN - 711 miles
distance between Fargo, ND and Valparaiso, IN - 696 miles
distance between Philadelphia, PA and Valparaiso, IN - 719 miles

Where's Drexel, um, I mean Robert Morris' potential travel partner?

[Valpo71]

Forget about attracting MAC and MVC schools.  Why would they leave for Horizon?  Oakland and IUPUI are the best choices for geography, recent Big Dance participation, academics, etc.  Many here seem to believe facilities are not an issue, and if they are, IUPUI has great facilities other than basketball and they could play more games at Banker's Life Field house and travel with WSU.

[VULB#62]

Where's Drexel, um, I mean Robert Morris' potential travel partner?

Philly.

[valpotx]

Forget about attracting MAC and MVC schools.  Why would they leave for Horizon?  Oakland and IUPUI are the best choices for geography, recent Big Dance participation, academics, etc.  Many here seem to believe facilities are not an issue, and if they are, IUPUI has great facilities other than basketball and they could play more games at Banker's Life Field house and travel with WSU.

Absolutely not IUPUI.  They bring nothing to the table in basketball, and got rid of baseball in 2000-2001.  The recent big dance experience you mention for them was way back in 2002-2003.

[milldew72]

Also Murray State is within a few miles of the Tennessee line.

About 3 or 4. When I was at MSU in the early 90s, we'd drive just across the line into TN to a place called Mack's. Guy was a genius. He openened a drive through liquor store literally feet into TN. Calloway County KY (home of MSU) was dry at the time, so on weekends cars would be backed up past campus on the main road heading down to Mack's. He's got to be a billionaire by now


https://maps.google.com/maps?q=Murray,+KY&hl=en&ll=36.611118,-88.313599&spn=1.289711,1.766052&sll=41.475425,-87.053415&sspn=0.07524,0.110378&oq=Murray&t=m&hnear=Murray,+Calloway,+Kentucky&z=9

[classof2014]

I think our two best options are Robert Morris and Oakland.

Robert Morris has been in the tourney recently and I believe and 2 out of their past 3 seasons have been 20+ win seasons and they have been in the tournament recently as well. Yes, they are further from Valpo but they are only 60 miles from YSU and not too far from CSU or WSU. They'd be a good team to fill one of our 2 voids.

Same goes for Oakland, they had a bit of a down year this year but they've been to the ncaa recently and won a games as well. They're obviously real close to Detroit thus fitting perfectly within the Horizon.

Right now I'd like to see the HL approach these two schools. I think Oakland will be a lot easier to convince than Robert Morris at this point but it'll be worth a shot. They're a good team and would help our conference, not to mention bring in the Pittsburgh market as well.

In my opinion I see Valpo playing Oakland twice next season, I believe the HL will be back up to nine teams. 10 is a bit of a stretch but I wouldn't be surprised if we do get a tenth. I think we need to try to get one team to sign on now and if another team comes along that's just a big bonus.

[Valposter]

Adding Oakland is a no-brainer at this point.  We are down to 8 teams......only 5 that play baseball.  They want in.  They are an upgrade to Loyola in MBB and they have baseball.  They fit the geographic footprint.  It is a win-win.  Good for them and good for us.  If this isn't officially announced by July 1st then LeCrone is officially incompetent and should be removed from office immediately.  If we add a 10th program that makes sense, great.  If not, we at least need to replace Loyola since there is a logical choice just sitting out there waiting for the invitation.  How hard can it be?  Is LeCrone afraid of commitment?  Just make the damn invitation already so we can move on. 

We were told at the beginning of the year that a big announcement was coming in March regarding HL expansion.  There were hints that it was big (like we were adding 3 teams that everyboby was going to like).  There was published speculation in multiple sources that it was Oakland, Belmont and Evansville.  We were led to believe that it was a "done deal" with negotiations finalized, invitations extended and accepted, and just pending the public official announcement after basketball season.  March came and went with nary a comment.  Then, the next thing we know we are losing team(s) to the MVC which ultimately proved to be Loyola.

All HL member schools should be very alarmed with everything that has transpired with conference membership (I.e. nothing) since B____r left.

[Valposter]

I guess that I now have the impression that LeCrone is just playing his fiddle while the HL is burning.  And I will have this impression until I see evidence to the contrary.

[StlVUFan]

We were told at the beginning of the year that a big announcement was coming in March regarding HL expansion

... by the Wright State A.D. who probably talked out of school, so to speak.  Nobody in the HL office said any such thing that I can recall.

[Valposter]

We were told at the beginning of the year that a big announcement was coming in March regarding HL expansion

... by the Wright State A.D. who probably talked out of school, so to speak.  Nobody in the HL office said any such thing that I can recall.

But it is safe to say that the WSU AD was getting that from somewhere in the Hl Office.  I doubt that he just made that up out of the thin air.

[Valposter]

Just think if it was UIC that bolted for the MVC as originally speculated.  Then we would be down to four baseball schools next season putting us in DESPERATION mode to add two baseball programs to avoid losing our automatic bid.  That impacts over 140 current HL baseball student athletes and is not acceptable.  It cannot be rationalized in any way.

[StlVUFan]

We were told at the beginning of the year that a big announcement was coming in March regarding HL expansion

... by the Wright State A.D. who probably talked out of school, so to speak.  Nobody in the HL office said any such thing that I can recall.

But it is safe to say that the WSU AD was getting that from somewhere in the Hl Office.  I doubt that he just made that up out of the thin air.

I would have hoped so, but I think he was speaking out of school at best.  Of course, this kind of thing happens in politics all the time, but I'm not sure how using one of the ADs to float a trial balloon benefits LeCrone.  The other interpretation is that the WSU AD has been so impatient that he misinterpreted something that was said in closed-door preseason meetings and couldn't contain himself.  The virtue of that interpretation is that we've seen the rationale for it written about recently in the Dayton Daily News with respect -- not to basketball, but to baseball, which it appears he feels is WSU's marquee sport.

[valporun]

Don't forget, when the original announcement was supposed to be made, basketball conferences were being poached at rapid rates, plus the Big East was putting their stuff together to announce the New Big East forming with the 7 Catholic schools, then other schools started jumping. This stopped the original announcement from being made, in case one of the schools we talked to got poached out from under us.

[agibson]

Adding Oakland is a no-brainer at this point.  We are down to 8 teams......only 5 that play baseball.  They want in.  They are an upgrade to Loyola in MBB and they have baseball.  They fit the geographic footprint.  It is a win-win.  Good for them and good for us.  If this isn't officially announced by July 1st then LeCrone is officially incompetent and should be removed from office immediately.  If we add a 10th program that makes sense, great.  If not, we at least need to replace Loyola since there is a logical choice just sitting out there waiting for the invitation.  How hard can it be?  Is LeCrone afraid of commitment?  Just make the damn invitation already so we can move on.

Detroit still has a veto, right?

[a3uge]

There was published speculation in multiple sources that it was Oakland, Belmont and Evansville

By 'published speculation in multiple sources' you really mean a UWM fan blogger who just made a report that the UIC to the MVC was a done deal.

It wasn't the Wright State athletic director. If anyone has a source on this, I'd love to see it because I sure can't find it.

http://www.courierpressblogs.com/sports/ue/?p=217
http://www.midmajormadness.com/2012/9/27/3418698/horizon-expansion-candidates-oakland-evansville-belmont-rumor

[StlVUFan]

Adding Oakland is a no-brainer at this point.  We are down to 8 teams......only 5 that play baseball.  They want in.  They are an upgrade to Loyola in MBB and they have baseball.  They fit the geographic footprint.  It is a win-win.  Good for them and good for us.  If this isn't officially announced by July 1st then LeCrone is officially incompetent and should be removed from office immediately.  If we add a 10th program that makes sense, great.  If not, we at least need to replace Loyola since there is a logical choice just sitting out there waiting for the invitation.  How hard can it be?  Is LeCrone afraid of commitment?  Just make the damn invitation already so we can move on.

Detroit still has a veto, right?

Not all by themselves, no.  And, it is fair to suspect that they have plenty of other problems on their plate besides keeping Oakland out of the HL this time around.

[Valposter]

There was published speculation in multiple sources that it was Oakland, Belmont and Evansville

By 'published speculation in multiple sources' you really mean a UWM fan blogger who just made a report that the UIC to the MVC was a done deal.

It wasn't the Wright State athletic director. If anyone has a source on this, I'd love to see it because I sure can't find it.

http://www.courierpressblogs.com/sports/ue/?p=217
http://www.midmajormadness.com/2012/9/27/3418698/horizon-expansion-candidates-oakland-evansville-belmont-rumor

Read the "Welcome to the Horizon League Oakland, Belmont, and Evansville" thread under Horizon League to catch up on this topic.  You are confusing two topics and the related time lines.

[a3uge]

There was published speculation in multiple sources that it was Oakland, Belmont and Evansville

By 'published speculation in multiple sources' you really mean a UWM fan blogger who just made a report that the UIC to the MVC was a done deal.

It wasn't the Wright State athletic director. If anyone has a source on this, I'd love to see it because I sure can't find it.

http://www.courierpressblogs.com/sports/ue/?p=217
http://www.midmajormadness.com/2012/9/27/3418698/horizon-expansion-candidates-oakland-evansville-belmont-rumor

Read the "Welcome to the Horizon League Oakland, Belmont, and Evansville" thread under Horizon League to catch up on this topic.  You are confusing two topics and the related time lines.

Dude, you literally referenced the same link as I just did in the "Welcome to the Horizon League Oakland, Belmont, and Evansville" thread: http://www.valpofanzone.com/forum/index.php?topic=1146.0 In the thread, you combined a Bob Grant interview (not printed by any source as far as I could find) and a rumor by PantherU (the UWM blogger that said UIC to MVC was a done deal), and speculated that Grant was referring to Evansville, Oakland, and Belmont. So no, I'm not confusing two topics, and am not confusing the timelines.

[agibson]

Detroit still has a veto, right?

Not all by themselves, no.  And, it is fair to suspect that they have plenty of other problems on their plate besides keeping Oakland out of the HL this time around.

Is that right?  Is it a straight vote? 

I thought somehow there was a built-in veto for schools in the same market.  e.g. Oakland couldn't join unless Detroit signed off, even if the other 7/8/9 schools voted in favor.

I don't have a great source for it, just now.

http://oaklandpostonline.com/2013/04/04/sports/oakland-to-horizon-its-not-a-done-dea/

at least describes a veto, casually.

[wh]

Detroit still has a veto, right?

Not all by themselves, no.  And, it is fair to suspect that they have plenty of other problems on their plate besides keeping Oakland out of the HL this time around.

Is that right?  Is it a straight vote? 

I thought somehow there was a built-in veto for schools in the same market.  e.g. Oakland couldn't join unless Detroit signed off, even if the other 7/8/9 schools voted in favor.

I don't have a great source for it, just now.

http://oaklandpostonline.com/2013/04/04/sports/oakland-to-horizon-its-not-a-done-dea/

at least describes a veto, casually.

According to this blogger the veto can be overridden by a majority vote of the other conference members:

http://www.bloguin.com/runthefloor/2012-articles/may/by-the-numbers-is-oakland-perfect-for-the-horizon-league.html

I have come to be very wary of anything these amateur bloggers state "as fact," so take it for what it's worth. Someone like BigDWSU would probably be a better source for something like this.

[agibson]

According to this blogger the veto can be overridden by a majority vote of the other conference members:

That could well be.  But then the "veto" begins to sound awfully similar to a "vote".

[agibson]

Here's something concrete.  This is from 2009-10, so some things might well have changed post-Butler.

http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/ilch/genrel/auto_pdf/HLHandbook.pdf

But, it had

"New members shall be admitted subject to the approval of two-thirds (2/3) of the Voting Directors of the Board; provided, however, a Voting Director may veto a membership invitation to an institution located geographically within twenty-five (25) miles of the member institution which the vetoing director represents. This veto, however, may be . overridden by an unanimous vote of the Voting Directors whose institutions they represent are located beyond twenty-five (25) miles from the prospective institution."

So, there is (or at least was) a veto.  It can be overridden.  It takes a unanimous vote of the members further than 25 miles away.

[LaPorteAveApostle]

But then the "veto" begins to sound awfully similar to a "vote".

especially if you're dyslexic