GB Coach Wardle Under Investigation

[classof2014]

Would like a player actually speak out against Wardle... If these allegations are true about Wardle, and it's starting to look like they are. He's a disgrace to the GB basketball program, the Horizon League, and the rest of basketball, but most of all he has been a disappointment to the young men who chose to play basketball up north.

It's starting to look like that there will be somebody new at the helm of GB basketball next season.

[StlVUFan]

Having first hand experience with clinical depression (not me), it is serious and requires persons to understand, not persecute, the individual.  Meds help a lot, but sometimes they can't always do the job and the person suffering is helpless to control their behavior.

I thought I read that the reason Wardle listed that as a distraction was because he had *stopped* taking his medicine?  Not sure I would call that persecution.

[LaPorteAveApostle]

And remember, folks, this is Basketball Prediction's just some guy's preseason pick to win the HL!

(bout of coughing)

This seems like as good a place as any to post this:
Melissa McCarthy Rutger's SNL Parody Full Version

[StlVUFan]

And remember, folks, this is Basketball Prediction's just some guy's preseason pick to win the HL!

Several prominent and would-be-prominent bloggers have *way* too much time on their hands.

As far as I'm concerned, this is guy is dreaming of taking Lunardi's job, which is pretty sad when you think about it.

[VULB#62]

Having first hand experience with clinical depression (not me), it is serious and requires persons to understand, not persecute, the individual.  Meds help a lot, but sometimes they can't always do the job and the person suffering is helpless to control their behavior.

I thought I read that the reason Wardle listed that as a distraction was because he had *stopped* taking his medicine?  Not sure I would call that persecution.

From Mrs. Cougill: "Among the issues addressed in the letter was Gina Cougill's assertion that her son's clinical depression was categorized by Wardle as a distraction to the team. She added that Brennan's experience pales in comparison to what other players have been subjected to."

The way I read the "stopped" statement was it was just one more depression thing.  Based on his behavior on the court at Valpo (from what some posters have mentioned) Wardle is wrapped tighter than a drum.  Tolerance or understanding don't seem to fit into his makeup.  We also don't know why Cougill decide to stop the meds -- for all we know, he may have been coerced or he may have reasoned that not taking them might help him deal with Wardle -- we'll never know.

Clinical depression is a serious matter.  I'm really surprised that the kid made it this far in a highly competitive and emotional sport like D-I basketball.

[StlVUFan]

According to Gina Cougill, her son began treatment for depression, including medication, when he was enrolled at Kirkwood Community College in Cedar Rapids, Iowa, during the 2010-11 academic year. She said Brennan stopped taking the medication for a period of three to four days leading up to UWGB's game against UW-Milwaukee on Feb. 4, 2012. During the game, Brennan had what she described as a breakdown during the second half of an 81-75 home loss.

According to a source, Cougill had to leave the bench area and began crying.

"Wardle was like, 'that's a distraction to the team to not take his medicine,' " Gina Cougill said.

The bolded part is what I was referring to.  If he was *not* taking his medicine and subsequently was breaking down during a game, I think Wardle was right to call that a distraction.

Of course, if he felt coerced by Wardle to not take his medicine, because it impeded his performance (not out of the question), then it falls back on Wardle.

It is because I do believe that clinical depression is a serious matter that I noticed that blurb.

[VULB#62]

Yeah, it'll all come out sooner or later, I guess.  The article said that Brennan would say something after the investigators talk to him.  Maybe then it would get clearer.

[StlVUFan]

Yeah, it'll all come out sooner or later, I guess.  The article said that Brennan would say something after the investigators talk to him.  Maybe then it would get clearer.

http://wnflam.com/podcasts/maino-and-nick-show/dick-bennett-joins-show-41613/

One/both of the hosts started by going off on players who "need their mommies to plead their case for them", making the ridiculous comparison between sports and war ("mommies ain't allowed in foxholes").

[VULB#62]

Fact of the matter is that few 22 year old athletes are ready to take on the nasty world.  That is especially true of some or maybe even most who are in the sheltered, regimented world of coach-controlled D-I athletics.  They are told what to do, where to go, how to behave in certain respects, but also have ingrained in them that they are special.  Big weight on a kid's shoulders.  Some get past that, others don't.

There are coaches, and I think Bryce is definitely one, who are catalysts for personal growth for their players -- plus they play great BB.  Then there are the Rice's and the Wardels who see any form of independent thought, alternative interests or slightly peculiar (to them) behavior as a challenge or a threat that must be put down for the good of their program.  That screams insecurity.  On the other hand, you've got Frosty Westering.

Getting back to "mommies in the foxholes."  When a kid has been under the thumb of a strong-willed coach for 1, 2 or 4 years, it is terribly difficult for him to get out from under and confront the man and the issues.  It is a clear parallel to any classic abusive relationship.  Many people can't speak up, so someone has to.  I don't see her as a helicopter parent; just someone who's seen enough.  Yet, she's gonna take a lot more crap before this is over.

[classof2014]

There are coaches, and I think Bryce is definitely one, who are catalysts for personal growth for their players -- plus they play great BB.  Then there are the Rice's and the Wardels who see any form of independent thought, alternative interests or slightly peculiar (to them) behavior as a challenge or a threat that must be put down for the good of their program.  That screams insecurity.  On the other hand, you've got Frosty Westering.

If this is like Wardle GB should fire him. What does the screaming and yelling teach these kids? That is you scream and yell enough you get what you want. No, if you play for GB your chances of going pro are slim to none and still that is no excuse for this style of belittling your players and believing nothing is more important than basketball. If this is Wardle's style of coaching GB should get rid of him for the sake of their basketball program.

[StlVUFan]

Did you notice how often they sprained a vocal chord protesting that they were not taking sides (while clearly taking sides)?

There was an article in the USA Today reporting a study that was done on aggressive coaching: http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaab/2013/04/15/clemson-study-aggressive-coaching-mike-rice/2084539/

I don't know how reliable it is, but the conclusions sound very plausible to me.

And, it should come as no shock whatsoever that the father of Alec Brown says his son has zero complaints about Wardle.  I don't mean that to sound cynical.  I've been through a few boss personality conflicts at Boeing in my almost 33 years and for every person who thought the boss was the most despicable human being on the face of the earth, there was another person who thought they were just fine (I've been that "another person" more than once).

[milanmiracle]

on the other hand, I wouldn't have a hard time picturing him using obscenity-laced tirades during practices

good. point.

if you'd use that word in front of several thousand people and televised, how much would you use it behind closed doors in front of two dozen?

the worst part will come when we as a society reach the point where no one sees that as a big deal any more.

or have we already?

That ship has sailed...oh well...f-it. Haha

[LaPorteAveApostle]

I don't mean that to sound cynical.

I would.  And I'm guessing also Keifer Sykes' parents are OK with Warble (yeah, sic).

Because let's face it, the stars' parents are generally going to have a LOT fewer problems with the coach.

Well...

until they feel he's being used incorrectly...

and then...

"I felt like they weren't going anywhere as a team," Dan said. "It was time to make a change, to explore other options. Chris was averaging 17, 18 points per game the last six, seven games, and he had three shots going into the last three minutes (of that game). It's a big sacrifice for us -- our son having to leave home -- but Chris was willing to make it."

http://www.nwitimes.com/sports/high-school/boys-basketball/palombizio-leaving-chesterton-to-attend-traders-point-academy-for-basketball/article_d204dd12-5bf4-5d5b-82fa-1709b07960d9.html

I am guessing that maybe this kid isn't Valpo material, although I have no idea whether they even have an eye on him.  Like father...

[StlVUFan]

I don't mean that to sound cynical.

I would.  And I'm guessing also Keifer Sykes' parents are OK with Warble (yeah, sic).

Because let's face it, the stars' parents are generally going to have a LOT fewer problems with the coach.

Well...

until they feel he's being used incorrectly...

Fair point.  In one of those cases I *was* more highly regarded than the people who were bitching.  But in another case, that's far from clear.

Another distasteful aspect when this happens in the workplace is having to listen to the endless, repetitive gossip from the critics.

However, I still am not being cynical about this.  Both sides are understandable.  The truth has yet to come out.

[classof2014]

Over the past week not 1, not 2, not 3, not 4, not even 5, BUT 6 players have chosen to transfer out of Green Bay over the past week and 11 players in total have transferred out of Green Bay over the past few seasons according to verbal commits

Compared to other HL schools (minus Loyola):

Cleveland State - 6
Detroit - 2
UIC - 8
Milwaukee - 4
Valpo - 4
Wright State - 9
Youngstown State - 3

I know that some players transfer because they aren't getting the playing time they want or are unhappy with the team or might not get along with some of the players, or it's just not the right fit. But to have 6 players within the last week who have decided to leave the program is astonishing. Some schools haven't even had 6 players leave over the past 4 seasons. I think this proves that there is something wrong with the style Wardle uses, and if Green Bay knew what was best for their basketball program he would be terminated immediately. It's no coincidence that Green Bay leads the league in guys choosing to transfer out and to have 6 all at once leave is unacceptable and there is obviously something Wardle has done to make these kids want to leave. Like I said before Green Bay should terminate his contract immediately.

[LaPorteAveApostle]

http://www.verbalcommits.com/schools/green-bay

I've done what you did--when editing your link you made the hyperlink the text and the text the hyperlink.  But obviously it don't work

I'll just take you at your word for it then:  whoa.  That...wow.

[classof2014]

Over the past week not 1, not 2, not 3, not 4, not even 5, BUT 6 players have chosen to transfer out of Green Bay over the past week and 11 players in total have transferred out of Green Bay over the past few seasons according to verbal commits

Compared to other HL schools (minus Loyola):

Cleveland State - 6
Detroit - 2
UIC - 8
Milwaukee - 4
Valpo - 4
Wright State - 9
Youngstown State - 3

I know that some players transfer because they aren't getting the playing time they want or are unhappy with the team or might not get along with some of the players, or it's just not the right fit. But to have 6 players within the last week who have decided to leave the program is astonishing. Some schools haven't even had 6 players leave over the past 4 seasons. I think this proves that there is something wrong with the style Wardle uses, and if Green Bay knew what was best for their basketball program he would be terminated immediately. It's no coincidence that Green Bay leads the league in guys choosing to transfer out and to have 6 all at once leave is unacceptable and there is obviously something Wardle has done to make these kids want to leave. Like I said before Green Bay should terminate his contract immediately.

Miscounted there are actually 13 players over the past 4 seasons to have transferred out of Green Bay!

[LaPorteAveApostle]

I'm still trying to figure out that site, but I feel that some things are confusing.  Regardless, only three players that actually played last season are leaving: Cerroni (midseason), Muhmamad, and Arenz, who didn't even log 100 minutes on the year (less than half of Vashil's minutes).  So.

Fascinating site, though, and thanks for the link.

[wh]

Comment from a GB poster:

No doubt it's been on the job training. With out prior head coaching experience he's had a lot to learn. He's made some good decisions and some mistakes. He and his asst.'s strengh is recruiting.
That being said he was the best candidate when GB was looking for a head coach. If all works out well I hope he has many years at GB. The upside is tremendous and GB is not most head coaches 1st choice. Pay is low and not the biggest BB market. So BW with his local ties was a great find and we new we would have growing problems.

Rightly or not, I suspect that recruiting is going to take a hit, at least in the short term.  Uncertainty about who the "real" Wardle is will prompt a lot of players and their families to take a pass on GB.

[classof2014]

Comment from a GB poster:

No doubt it's been on the job training. With out prior head coaching experience he's had a lot to learn. He's made some good decisions and some mistakes. He and his asst.'s strengh is recruiting.
That being said he was the best candidate when GB was looking for a head coach. If all works out well I hope he has many years at GB. The upside is tremendous and GB is not most head coaches 1st choice. Pay is low and not the biggest BB market. So BW with his local ties was a great find and we new we would have growing problems.

Rightly or not, I suspect that recruiting is going to take a hit, at least in the short term.  Uncertainty about who the "real" Wardle is will prompt a lot of players and their families to take a pass on GB.

No matter how good of a recruiter or your ability to draw up plays that work, if you can't handle yourself regarding how you treat your players then you don't deserve to be a head coach. Being a head coach is much more than just recruiting and drawing up plays. When you're aggressive towards your players, they won't respond well. I think that played a big reason in GBs underachieving season. They had some very good basketball players but their season didn't replicate the level of talent they have. This falls on Wardle; he probably is a good recruiter and understands the game very well, but if you can't communicate with your players then you shouldn't be a head coach.

I think GB should get rid of Wardle, I think with these new allegations it will hurt their ability to recruit tremendously. I don't think Wardle is head-coach material. He might serve better as an assistant, when the head coach can keep him in line, since he can't keep himself in line.

[LaPorteAveApostle]

if you can't handle yourself regarding how you treat your players then you don't deserve to be a head coach. Being a head coach is much more than just recruiting and drawing up plays.

So true.  This also led to me rewatching the SNL skit above   hi-LARious.

[wh]

Comment from a GB poster:

No doubt it's been on the job training. With out prior head coaching experience he's had a lot to learn. He's made some good decisions and some mistakes. He and his asst.'s strengh is recruiting.
That being said he was the best candidate when GB was looking for a head coach. If all works out well I hope he has many years at GB. The upside is tremendous and GB is not most head coaches 1st choice. Pay is low and not the biggest BB market. So BW with his local ties was a great find and we new we would have growing problems.

Rightly or not, I suspect that recruiting is going to take a hit, at least in the short term.  Uncertainty about who the "real" Wardle is will prompt a lot of players and their families to take a pass on GB.

No matter how good of a recruiter or your ability to draw up plays that work, if you can't handle yourself regarding how you treat your players then you don't deserve to be a head coach. Being a head coach is much more than just recruiting and drawing up plays. When you're aggressive towards your players, they won't respond well. I think that played a big reason in GBs underachieving season. They had some very good basketball players but their season didn't replicate the level of talent they have. This falls on Wardle; he probably is a good recruiter and understands the game very well, but if you can't communicate with your players then you shouldn't be a head coach.I think GB should get rid of Wardle, I think with these new allegations it will hurt their ability to recruit tremendously. I don't think Wardle is head-coach material. He might serve better as an assistant, when the head coach can keep him in line, since he can't keep himself in line.

I agree.  This whole issue about it's ok to yell at players, get in their faces, etc. is completely convoluted in my opinion.  In the year 2013 managers in the workplace that yell and scream at their adult employees are considered bad managers, and rightfully so.  And yet, some of the same people that would never defend this in the workplace defend coaches who verbally abuse 18-22 college students on a daily basis.  Good coaches, like good supervisors, use a managerial style that promotes player  commitment toward accomplishing personal and team goals through positive reinforcement.  Bryce is a great example of a coach that develops commitment, as opposed to forcing compliance through bullying, intimidation, and manipulation. 

Forcing compliance is an agressive tactic that yields short term, moment-by-moment results and which has to repeated constantly to be effective; developing commitment is based on building positive win/win relationships over time, which yields unforced support and willing commitment.

[FWalum]

wh, do you happen to teach a management course?  I think your comments are right on, but there are still a lot of managers out there that manage by intimidation.

[wh]

wh, do you happen to teach a management course?  I think your comments are right on, but there are still a lot of managers out there that manage by intimidation.

Part of my career has been devoted to management development.  Like most other human traits, leadership style is in large part a "learned" behavior.  It begins at a very early age based on the examples set by parents and others in authority.  Bad leadership behaviors can be overcome through exposure to positive mentors, formal training, etc.  That's what management development is all about - reinforcing good behaviors and changing bad ones. 

I could be wrong, but I'm not aware of much effort in the world of athletics to develop leadership skills among coaches.  They just are who they are - for better or for worse. IMO there's way too much "the end justifies the means" mentality in coaching.  If a coach wins, abusive behavior is accepted or at least overlooked.  Bob Knight is the poster child for this.  As long as he was winning and making a lot of money for the university, the abusiveness was tolerated.  Once the winning stopped, people suddenly became offended by his boorish behavior.       

[VULB#62]

The proper mentoring thing is so important.  As you allude to, WH, if a "successful" (i.e., they win games) coaching tree is characterized by temper and intimidation, it'll probably look for those traits in its coaching applicants and then reinforce those traits going forward.  That's a hard cycle to break.  Similarly, family background where the same traits are present may lead an individual, who may have great tactical and recruiting skills, to adopt the same tactics as a coach unless properly mentored.  Mentoring takes time to exert it's influence.

About Wardle from Wikipedia:  He was an assistant at Marquette from 2003–2005 and UW-Green Bay from 2005–2010. Upon his hiring, Wardle became the youngest head coach in NCAA Division I basketball..  Three years ago he was thrown into a tough, win now (I assume, or at least, as a youngster, in his own mind) situation.  Just thinking (and, admittedly, speculating) that there was not much time to mature there.

Bryce, on the other hand, grew up being coached by mature, thoughtful coaches in HS and college, plus his family traits were not highlighted by temper or intimidation.  He also benefited from an extended playing career that exposed him to several coaching styles.

In reading about Wardle, the player, his career seemed to be highlighted by intensity.  That works fine for a player, but it needs to be refined and properly channeled as a coach.  It will be interesting to see how this all unfolds.  No question the negative publicity following on the heals of the Rutgers fiasco did UWGB no good.