broadcaster screws up pronunciation of Valparaiso

bbtds · June 19, 2013, 05:24:20 AM

Mike Shannon, the part-time (this year at least if not further into the future) radio broadcaster of the Cardinals, was describing a game that Jeff Samardzija was pitching in St Louis last night. Since Mike is what some observers would call not as well educated as other baseball broadcasters he tried to pronounce the birthplace and home town of the starting Cubs pitcher in last night's game.

By the way, Jeff pitched a beauty for the Cubs for 8 1/3 innings. And the Cubs knocked off the Cards 4-2.

When Moon man Shannon pronounced the names it came out Mar-i-ville and Val-par-I-si-o. I couldn't believe how bad it came out and you knew by the way he paused Shannon had no idea how to pronounce it. Maybe it's finally time to retire, Mike. I believe Shannon has been broadcasting for the Cardinals for about 50 years and spent about 35 to 40 with Jack Buck.

I wonder what was going through the mind of former White Sox broadcaster and current Shannon partner, John Rooney, when Shannon paused before naming Samardzija's birthplace and hometown.

valporun · June 19, 2013, 10:52:30 AM

I'm sure Mike Shannon is on the same kind of work plan as Vin Scully, Jerry Coleman, Denny Matthews, and some of the longtime broadcasters over the years, only works home games, and maybe road games within the division (ala Scully). Fans in St. Louis love Mike Shannon because they grew up with him as either a player or a broadcaster, and he brings you the game not crap analyzation that the SABR-metrician loves to badger pure baseball fans with.

StlVUFan · June 19, 2013, 10:56:45 AM

Quote from: valporun on June 19, 2013, 10:52:30 AMnot crap analyzation that the SABR-metrician loves to badger pure baseball fans with.

Which pbp guys are doing that?

valpo64 · June 19, 2013, 02:25:50 PM

Mike Shannon used to have a drinking problem...don't know if he ever got on the wagon or not but if he still has a problem perhaps not a lot of effort goes into his work these days...to me he always sounds like he just finished a few too many...just sayin'

a3uge · June 19, 2013, 04:52:51 PM

Mike Shannon can barely pronounce half of the cities that have MLB teams (thank god Louisville doesn't have a team), let alone random cities in Indiana.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 4 Beta

StlVUFan · June 19, 2013, 06:14:09 PM

Quote from: a3uge on June 19, 2013, 04:52:51 PM
Mike Shannon can barely pronounce half of the cities that have MLB teams (thank god Louisville doesn't have a team), let alone random cities in Indiana.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 4 Beta

To say nothing of getting all excited over fly balls that don't make the warning track.

bbtds · June 19, 2013, 06:30:23 PM

Some friends I know have said Shannon gets them lost so easily trying to follow the games on the radio because Mike will occasionally miss a ball 4 and suddenly talk about a runner on first base or something similar to a situation where you go "when did that happen?" Rooney has done a good job of following behind Shannon and makes sure every play gets mentioned.

valporun · June 20, 2013, 02:04:28 PM

Stl, once Jim Deshaises became the color commentator for the Cubs, he started Len Kasper on the SABR stats talk. Drives me crazy when they do SABR/Stats Sunday because I don't like or care for most of the stats that have been created for those who can't watch baseball without it affecting fantasy baseball teams/rosters they have. It also has become too much of a focus on MLB Network with MLB Now or any of the shows that they created to give Brian Kenney a job.

a3uge · June 21, 2013, 12:11:24 AM

I've listened to Mike Shannon calling games 4 or 5 times while driving from St Louis. He is so incredibly difficult to follow that you need a smartphone with scores up in order to still follow the game. He may have been a great announcer back in the day, but I think Shannon is too old to do all 9 innings.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 4 Beta

valporun · June 21, 2013, 12:51:37 PM

I've listened to Mike Shannon this season, and he often rotates pbp with John Rooney, but isn't always a consistent pattern. I know a lot of the announcers will do the first 3 and last 3 innings, and give the color guy or radio producer 1-3 innings in the middle of the game, so the main guy can get some food, go to the bathroom, or just get a small amount of sleep. I know Pat Hughes passes the 5th inning on to Keith Moreland and Judd Sirott, but Keith can handle pbp duties nicely, since he did that often when he worked for the University of Texas. I believe Harry Caray started the phenomenon of taking innings off from one side or the other, but he would do 6 TV innings, first 3/last3, then go to WGN radio for the middle 3 innings. I haven't listened to Jerry Coleman or Denny Matthews lately, but I can't imagine either of them does the whole game, or an entire 162 game season any longer?

StlVUFan · June 21, 2013, 06:05:59 PM

Quote from: valporun on June 20, 2013, 02:04:28 PM
Stl, once Jim Deshaises became the color commentator for the Cubs, he started Len Kasper on the SABR stats talk. Drives me crazy when they do SABR/Stats Sunday because I don't like or care for most of the stats that have been created for those who can't watch baseball without it affecting fantasy baseball teams/rosters they have. It also has become too much of a focus on MLB Network with MLB Now or any of the shows that they created to give Brian Kenney a job.

1. That started a couple of years ago, actually, when Bob Brenly was still in the booth. Len Kaspar is actually the "stathead" in the group.
2. They weren't created for fantasy baseball. They were created to better evaluate player performance, and this movement goes back at least to the 1980s and Bill James.
3. By the way, every ML franchise uses advanced metrics along with every other tool to evaluate their teams. The revolution has been permanently institutionalized.

I'm guessing most broadcasts don't do this, and it's only 1 day a week.

It's not necessary to enjoy baseball, but I don't believe they are exactly shoving it down your throat. It's a modicum of advanced stats 1 day a week.

valporun · June 22, 2013, 11:23:10 AM

The modicum gets overkilled by ESPN and MLB Network though. I can't watch Baseball Tonight anymore because of it. Some of the shows on MLB Network, I can't do either. In my opinion, a lot of today's top hitters, they are in the wrong positions, not because of the SABR stats, but because they aren't batting next to the right combo to get the pitches they can get on base with. During the Cubs game yesterday, they had a graphic up that Starlin Castro is down about 70 points in batting average from this time a year ago, and I believe some of this is because he's not batting near Darwin Barney, who protected the pitches that Castro would get, since they both could hit. Now Castro is shuffled around the top of the batting order, and Barney is the sacrificial lamb to the pitcher. Barney isn't getting many pitches to do anything with because opposing pitchers can throw seeming junk to the Barney because he's "protecting" an easy out in the pitcher in the 9 hole. Barney and Castro hit a lot better when they were batting right next to each other in the lineup because pitchers had to be more careful pitching to them. What hurt their averages was Barney missing the first month with the laceration in his leg. They need to be batting next to each other, and not where advanced SABR-metrics say they should.

ARCInsider · June 22, 2013, 07:11:53 PM

valporun, the game and the way it's watched has dramatically changed. Believe it or not, a lot of fans want to know and understand the stats. The eye-test and scouting still have a place, but they just aren't nearly as relevant as the numbers.

P.S. Kasper and Deshaies are one of the best teams in the game...as much as I like Scully's voice, his analysis is no where near what you get from a sabr-informed guy.

P.P.S. Great response by StlVUFan...summed up what I was thinking.

ARCInsider · June 22, 2013, 07:15:41 PM

Quote from: valporun on June 22, 2013, 11:23:10 AM
The modicum gets overkilled by ESPN and MLB Network though. I can't watch Baseball Tonight anymore because of it. Some of the shows on MLB Network, I can't do either. In my opinion, a lot of today's top hitters, they are in the wrong positions, not because of the SABR stats, but because they aren't batting next to the right combo to get the pitches they can get on base with. During the Cubs game yesterday, they had a graphic up that Starlin Castro is down about 70 points in batting average from this time a year ago, and I believe some of this is because he's not batting near Darwin Barney, who protected the pitches that Castro would get, since they both could hit. Now Castro is shuffled around the top of the batting order, and Barney is the sacrificial lamb to the pitcher. Barney isn't getting many pitches to do anything with because opposing pitchers can throw seeming junk to the Barney because he's "protecting" an easy out in the pitcher in the 9 hole. Barney and Castro hit a lot better when they were batting right next to each other in the lineup because pitchers had to be more careful pitching to them. What hurt their averages was Barney missing the first month with the laceration in his leg. They need to be batting next to each other, and not where advanced SABR-metrics say they should.

And, frankly, Barney has little to no impact on what's going on with Castro....the guy is a career .653 OPS hitter (which isn't really all that advanced for a stat), which is horrendous. He's a negative WAR player this season and his good WAR last year was primarily aided by defense.

Castro's problem is that he is trying to adjust his approach to be what Theo/Jed want the organization to have...patient, taking pitches, etc.

ARCInsider · June 22, 2013, 07:20:28 PM

Ok, last thing on the Barney/Castro thing (can you tell I'm a Cubs' fan and a sabr-guy?)...

When Barney hit 2nd last year, next to Castro in the lineup, he hit .214 and had a .527 OPS...that's horrible...when he hit away from Castro he was significantly better...he hit .280 and .290 in the 7th and 8th spots respectively. The sabr guys are saying he should hit lower in the lineup because a) he hits better there and b) he's an awful hitter and awful hitters hit at the bottom of the lineup.

StlVUFan · June 27, 2013, 06:03:58 PM

Quote from: valporun on June 22, 2013, 11:23:10 AMThe modicum gets overkilled by ESPN and MLB Network though. I can't watch Baseball Tonight anymore because of it. Some of the shows on MLB Network, I can't do either.

I don't watch ESPN for baseball anymore, so I can't comment on that. MLB Network has one show, last I checked, called Clubhouse Confidential. Yes, Brian Kenney is also on MLB Now, but it's in a stupid Crossfire (which CNN is bringing back, for crying out loud) style with Harold Reynolds. The one time I watched (only to see Hawk Harrelson make a fool of himself, I guess), after it was over, I said to myself, "there's 30 minutes of my life I'll NEVER get back."

When it's done so horribly, then I can understand the aversion to it completely. If you want to get MLB Network's best attempt at SABRmetrics, I'd stick with Clubhouse Confidential and ignore the other one. I suspect Harold Reynolds has Brian Kenney mumbling to himself more often than not, simply by shouting utter (but popular and conventional) stupidity. Please note, I'm not saying Harold Reynolds *is* stupid. I'm saying half the time when I've heard him analyze baseball, he *sounds* stupid. It's the same complaint I've always had about Joe Morgan (to say nothing of Hawk Harrelson). Each of them has forgotten more about baseball than I will ever know, and my IQ goes down every time I listen to what they have to say. It's amazing.

valporun · June 27, 2013, 11:48:45 PM

Is Clubhouse Confidential going to continue in the offseason?

valpospartan · July 03, 2013, 11:20:31 PM

Quote from: bbtds on June 19, 2013, 06:30:23 PM
Some friends I know have said Shannon gets them lost so easily trying to follow the games on the radio because Mike will occasionally miss a ball 4 and suddenly talk about a runner on first base or something similar to a situation where you go "when did that happen?" Rooney has done a good job of following behind Shannon and makes sure every play gets mentioned.

The "beloved" Harry Carey did the same thing in his declining years.

vuweathernerd · July 04, 2013, 04:53:54 AM

i grew up in st louis listening to mike and jack buck, and they made a pretty decent pair. but as shannon's seeming interest level has declined, i've grown to enjoy john rooney. he's definitely the better of the pair in the cardinals booth right now.

valporun · July 05, 2013, 03:57:48 PM

I'll agree about John Rooney, but we all grew up with some of the best in radio or tv, and now they are being replaced by a lot of people who couldn't get the time of day from ESPN or another tv brand. In most cases, they are just filling a seat until the contract runs out, and a new former player retires to the broadcast booth.