11/17/2013 Sunday 1:00 p.m. CST --Valpo at Ohio University--game thread

[historyman]

Ohio lost to Ohio State by 10 in Columbus. Will Valpo find the skill and mental toughness to rebound and beat the Bobcats in Athens?

[classof2014]

If we can go punch for punch with Illinois we should be able to beat the Bobcats. Gotta play the game though, another tough game on the road. Hopefully we can pull through in this one and make our damn free throws!

[valpotx]

I see a win against a team that doesn't give Valpo players the 'big program jitters' we seem to get nowadays.  I know that they are a good team in the past few years, but the name of Ohio does nothing to most basketball players.  It will be a close game, but I think the aspect of having less mystique will take the pressure off our guys.

Valpo 73
Ohio 69

[covufan]

I think we have a good chance to win one of the next two games on the road (Ohio, Evansville). 

Valpo   71
Ohio     70

[sliman]

Ohio has more experience and played better against a much better team at Ohio State than we did at Illinois:  Ohio 76, Valpo 64.   I still like the future for this team but it may be the conference schedule before we gain any momentum.

[a3uge]

Like Valpo, Ohio lost a lot of minutes from last year, including one of their best players in the program's history. Last year they lost in the MAC championship game to Akron (a team that was hanging on for dear life after a couple suspensions... before completely flat-lining against VCU in the tournament). They are projected in the middle of the MAC via the coaches poll and after week 1 and received 33 votes in the mid major top 25 (Valpo had 58). They have played 2 games: The first game an 11 point win against UNI (opened the season ranked 6th in MM Top 25) and the second a hard fought 10 point defeat against Ohio State (ranked 10 in AP poll).

The MAC is kind of a weird conference. There's always a handful of really decent teams and Ohio has had some tournament success recently... but there's also a lot of bottom dwellers like Northern Illinois and Bowling Green that push the conference back down.

I think Ohio is right around Valpo's caliber which makes me want to predict the game going to the home team.

[agibson]

Looks like there may be (free?) streaming video.  It seems that there was for the northern Iowa game.

[valporun]

Yes, the MAC does stream their games online for FREE!!

[bbtds]

Yes, the MAC does stream their games online for FREE!!

Where'd they get that idea?

I'll skip the Athens game so I can get to the Evansville game where I think Valpo could put it together and finally pull one out. Also it spreads it out more from the Illinois game.

I hope Bryce realizes we will get jobbed by the refs in Evansville and techs at the end of games after the fact don't help. Get mad immediately before the calls get worse. I think the refs know what kind of guy you are and a more volatile response early will get a ref that knows you to think "I wonder why he is reacting so unusual for me. I gotta get better," before the biggest calls of the game happen. 

[agibson]

I hope Bryce realizes we will get jobbed by the refs in Evansville and techs at the end of games after the fact don't help. Get mad immediately before the calls get worse. I think the refs know what kind of guy you are and a more volatile response early will get a ref that knows you to think "I wonder why he is reacting so unusual for me. I gotta get better," before the biggest calls of the game happen. 

I figured the T was for the players, not the refs.

[agibson]

Maybe we should edit the title?  Either switch to central time, add the time zone to the title, or both?  2:00 PM EST, 1:00 PM CST.

[historyman]

Maybe we should edit the title?  Either switch to central time, add the time zone to the title, or both?  2:00 PM EST, 1:00 PM CST.

My mistake. I looked up the game time on the HL website and forgot they list game time as eastern.

[truth219]

I think our starting lineup needs adjusted. If dority isn't a point guard, then why play him there.  Besides having a good shot, dority is average at every other aspect. Williams should start and bobby needs to be benched.

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[classof2014]

I think our starting lineup needs adjusted. If dority isn't a point guard, then why play him there.  Besides having a good shot, dority is average at every other aspect. Williams should start and bobby needs to be benched.

Agreed. Bobby, looks awful, I know he was injured but that doesn't account for the bonehead plays he's been making on the court. I'm not saying we win the Illinois game without Bobby but I think we would've had a much higher chance. Everyone else I've been pleased with. Bobby looks awful and had 5 of our 12 turnovers against Illinois, which is ridiculous in my opinion. I'd say move Peters to the 4. I know Moussa hasn't been anything special but he plays solid defense and so does Vashil, they take away their big man, Bobby has been a liability offensively and defensively and has always been in foul trouble.

So far the 2 biggest surprises has been the play of Lexus Williams and Jordan Coleman and the biggest disappointment has been Bobby. Perhaps benching him will wake him up cause he's done nothing so far this season other than make a few 3 pointers.

[truth219]

Id like to see jubril get some more minutes. He only got one minute on Wednesday and got 2 points.



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[valpopal]

I think our starting lineup needs adjusted. If dority isn't a point guard, then why play him there.  Besides having a good shot, dority is average at every other aspect. Williams should start and bobby needs to be benched.

Agreed. Bobby, looks awful, I know he was injured but that doesn't account for the bonehead plays he's been making on the court. I'm not saying we win the Illinois game without Bobby but I think we would've had a much higher chance. Everyone else I've been pleased with. Bobby looks awful and had 5 of our 12 turnovers against Illinois, which is ridiculous in my opinion. I'd say move Peters to the 4. I know Moussa hasn't been anything special but he plays solid defense and so does Vashil, they take away their big man, Bobby has been a liability offensively and defensively and has always been in foul trouble.

So far the 2 biggest surprises has been the play of Lexus Williams and Jordan Coleman and the biggest disappointment has been Bobby. Perhaps benching him will wake him up cause he's done nothing so far this season other than make a few 3 pointers.

Okay, this is not going to be popular, but I am going to defend Bobby. The comments here are similar to ones posted last year even into the beginning of conference play. I just looked at the posts after the January Loyola loss, and the criticism of Bobby was the same. However, later in the season his play was praised, especially after the ejection at Detroit.

First of all, Bobby's play has not been as bad as stated. His field goal shooting is at 60%. His three-point shooting is at 83%. He is averaging 1 point for every 2 minutes of play. He has committed 8 turnovers in 3 games (2.6 avg.) He has committed 7 fouls in three games, an average a little more than 2. Admittedly, he doesn't exhibit the flow or stamina that he had at his peak last year, but he did get a slow start to the season because of his lingering leg injury and lack of practice time. Last year he also had a slow start due to his surgery.

In addition, he is playing a new position this year, which will require a different approach, a couple more outside shots, and probably result in fewer rebounds. As a forward rather than a center, he is up against quicker players, especially when the opposing team is Illinois. Therefore, I would expect more turnovers and fouls as a result. However, when we get to conference play, I also expect Bobby to be stronger, to be more in the flow, and to match up well in most games; therefore, his stats will improve.

On the board last year when there were similar complaints, I recommended patience with Bobby's progress, and he proved the wait was worth it. I will be patient again this year, and I hope he exhibits progress the way he did last year.

[LaPorteAveApostle]

Okay, this is not going to be popular, but I am going to defend Bobby.

Hear, hear!

[bbtds]

I think our starting lineup needs adjusted. If dority isn't a point guard, then why play him there.  Besides having a good shot, dority is average at every other aspect. Williams should start and bobby needs to be benched.

Agreed. Bobby, looks awful, I know he was injured but that doesn't account for the bonehead plays he's been making on the court. I'm not saying we win the Illinois game without Bobby but I think we would've had a much higher chance. Everyone else I've been pleased with. Bobby looks awful and had 5 of our 12 turnovers against Illinois, which is ridiculous in my opinion. I'd say move Peters to the 4. I know Moussa hasn't been anything special but he plays solid defense and so does Vashil, they take away their big man, Bobby has been a liability offensively and defensively and has always been in foul trouble.

So far the 2 biggest surprises has been the play of Lexus Williams and Jordan Coleman and the biggest disappointment has been Bobby. Perhaps benching him will wake him up cause he's done nothing so far this season other than make a few 3 pointers.

Okay, this is not going to be popular, but I am going to defend Bobby. The comments here are similar to ones posted last year even into the beginning of conference play. I just looked at the posts after the January Loyola loss, and the criticism of Bobby was the same. However, later in the season his play was praised, especially after the ejection at Detroit.

First of all, Bobby's play has not been as bad as stated. His field goal shooting is at 60%. His three-point shooting is at 83%. He is averaging 1 point for every 2 minutes of play. He has committed 8 turnovers in 3 games (2.6 avg.) He has committed 7 fouls in three games, an average a little more than 2. Admittedly, he doesn't exhibit the flow or stamina that he had at his peak last year, but he did get a slow start to the season because of his lingering leg injury and lack of practice time. Last year he also had a slow start due to his surgery.

In addition, he is playing a new position this year, which will require a different approach, a couple more outside shots, and probably result in fewer rebounds. As a forward rather than a center, he is up against quicker players, especially when the opposing team is Illinois. Therefore, I would expect more turnovers and fouls as a result. However, when we get to conference play, I also expect Bobby to be stronger, to be more in the flow, and to match up well in most games; therefore, his stats will improve.

On the board last year when there were similar complaints, I recommended patience with Bobby's progress, and he proved the wait was worth it. I will be patient again this year, and I hope he exhibits progress the way he did last year.

I agree with valpopal's assessment. Bobby wasn't all bad in the Illinois game. Yes, there were some boner plays but there were some boner plays by almost everybody. Given positives and negatives with Capo I think it comes out fairly even given the 2 important threes. Bobby will get even better as he heals more. I think a huge thing for Valpo will be the condition of LaVonte's ankle going into the Ohio game on Sunday afternoon.

[valpotx]

Hopefully we can work in some of the KVW low post work moves for Bobby.  It looks like we have tried to get everyone on the perimeter except him a few times, but he hasn't been able to work himself to that inside position to get the lob pass near the basket, that led to so many KVW lay-ups.  If we get that play to work a little better for him, it will open up other parts of our offense.

[bbtds]

I saw that 2 players each had 21 points for the Bobcats against Ohio State in the 10 point loss. Nick Kellogg in 34 minutes, a guard, was 3 for 7 from three and 5 for 6 from two. Kellogg made 2 FT's. Stevie Taylor, another guard, was 2 for 6 from three and 6 for 11 from two along with 3 FT's and no missed free throws out of 5 from the guards while the starting forwards missed 4 total charity tosses out of 7. It's seems we need to foul the forwards if possible, Maurice Ndour and Jon Smith (who's parents obviously saw nothing special about him) instead of the guards. With Taylor getting 33 minutes there was only about 8 or 9 minutes when both guards weren't on the floor.

Five Bobcat payers fouled out at Columbus when the refs called every foul they saw. Both Kellogg and Taylor made it through to the end but Ndour, Smith and the other starter, Ricardo Johnson, plus 2 players off the bench, fouled out. Not surprisingly no Buckeyes fouled out of this game as the foul difference was 34 to 21 in favor of Bobcat fouls. I think this is where the major teams get help from the refs when the fouls are called so tightly, especially when the majors play on their home court.

In Valpo's game at Illinois the foul difference was 20 to 17 with only 3 more Crusader fouls called while it seemed many more Illini fouls could have been tallied on hand checks, which don't seemed to get called on majors at home.

Aaron Craft, by himself, made 8 FT's for the OSU at the end of the game in the parade to the line. That's extremely important in a 10 point win.

Without the huge foul difference with the Bobcats being at home and the forwards and Johnson most likely not fouling out or sending a parade of players to the FT line, I see Ohio being extremely tough.

Down by double figures most of the game, the Bobcats got back into it in the closing minutes behind the play of Stevie Taylor and Nick Kellogg, both from Columbus, who both scored 21 points.

Trailing 64-53, Kellogg hit a reverse layup in traffic before Craft missed a layup at the other end. A long pass led to Taylor's three-point play that cut it to 64-58 with just over 5 minutes remaining.

"Nick and I are roommates," Taylor said. "We talked about just coming home and playing solid, doing whatever it is that Coach wanted us to do. We did a good job of that."

After a free throw by Craft, Maurice Ndour hit a follow shot to cut it to 65-60. Williams then tipped in a miss by Ross. Off an Ohio miss, Craft hit two more foul shots to push the lead back to 69-60.

Still, the game wasn't firmly in hand until Shannon Scott drove the left baseline and flipped a pass to the right corner to Smith who hit a 3 with 2 minutes remaining for a 74-64 lead.

The Bobcats never got closer than seven points again as Craft scored nine of Ohio State's last 12 points.

http://www.ohiostatebuckeyes.com/sports/m-baskbl/recaps/111213aaa.html

[bbtds]

Here's the page for the link to the Valpo at Ohio U men's bb game.

I clicked on the link but got nothing yet. I assume it will be active by Sunday.

http://www.mac-sports.com/Schools/Ohio.aspx

And if not, our old classmate, Jon Steinbrecher, I'm sure, will come riding to the rescue.

[valpo84]

Nick Kellogg is a good college ballplayer and son of Ohio State legend Clark Kellogg ("squeeze the orange"). Ohio is very solid and very guard orientated but have very tough, physical inside players. The #MACtion was always the "little B1G" as the players were a bit smaller than the B1G but the league was just as physical. Ohio still has that make up. Plus, we're on the road coming off a frustrating loss. We can win this game, but need to be tougher to the hole than at Illinois and have to take advantage of shots we have. Again, offensively how many missed layups and fast breaks. As to Booby's TOs the other night, 2 were on questionable offensive foul calls (phantom and inconsistently called moving pick away from the ball) and a travel where he was pushed to the floor by an Illini player at the basket. We need to rebound better. Looking for continued improvement on offense in flow and finding open looks, esepcially the big guys. Defense the other night was very solid against a B1G. Held someone to under 65 in their gym with the new rules. Realize how blessed we are with a goalie at the basket in Moussa and Vashil is playing well defensively. Illinois was a winnable game. This is a team in development, patience for a few games (analysis that says so and so is terrible and needs to be benched after 2 real games playing together is not analysis) and then let's see what we have.

[classof2014]

This is a very winnable game. Not gonna be easy and not saying they're gonna win but they can. Both Vashil and Moussa can take away any scoring around the rim turning teams to become one dimensional and we saw that against Illinois, I would imagine that's gonna be the same for Ohio. I hope we have a better rebounding performance both on the offensive and defensive glass. I would like to see them get more open looks and more opportunities for high percentage shots. As I've stated before, FREE THROWS!!!!! We need to make them, we left 9 points on the court against Illinois and 12 points on the court against Murray State. If we wanna beat good teams on the road free throws are so damn important.

I would love to see Alec get some opportunities from 3-point range since he hasn't had many chances so far. Overall, I like our defense, Moussa and Vashil completely take away the inside, hopefully they can do something offensively against Ohio.

From what I've seen from the team so far, they're gonna be really tough to beat this year especially come Horizon League play once Keith Carter becomes eligible. There's a chance he's the best player in the league and we have him in our back pocket right now waiting just another month before he suits up.

Back to the Ohio game, I think Valpo pulls out the win. They have a bitter taste in their mouths after coming out unsuccessful in Champaign.

Valpo 75 Ohio 68

[LaPorteAveApostle]

Realize how blessed we are with a goalie at the basket

best phrase of the month

[talksalot]

That OU arena is a really tough place to play... and I hope we can get a return-engagement with the bobcats in the ARC next year... Valpo wins if it can hit more than 75% of the free throws... and I hope there was a lot of charity stripe practice since Illinois.  Woulda Coulda Shoulda...  This game will tell us a lot. 

Regardless, I think we can take Evansville...