FLAMEOUT 2014

LaPorteAveApostle · January 24, 2014, 03:25:35 AM

Back by unpopular demand.

Introducing FLAMEQUEST 2014: The Quest To Be the Worst Team In Horizon League History Or At Least Hopefully Better Than Milwaukee Last Year. Throughout the conference season we'll all be watching to find whether or not UIC can at least be the best—at being the worst. You may have thought Milwaukee was absolutely wretched last year (and they were), but at least they won amidst the many beatings they absorbed. No, to be truly the worst, UIC has to lose ALL their games just to tie 2003-04 Cleveland State (0-16).

The Horizon League has also never had a team with RPI below 2004-05 Youngstown St (321 out of 327, or 1.8 percentile). UIC is 293/349, or 16th percentile—losing out would leave them 324/349, or 7.2% (RealTimeRPI says they are 294 now...).

Third: in conference play, 2004-05 YSU was outscored by 13.2 ppg; RPI Forecast has UIC on track to be outscored by 8.2 ppg (currently losing by only 8.7 ppg). Can they pull off the Pu Pu Platter, the Trifecta of Awful?

Doesn't look promising, since they're not quite as gawdoffal as UWM last year, but they've set the barlow and keep underwhelming...ladies and gentlemen, your 2014 HL UIC FLAMES!

As of 1/23/14
Record: 0-6
RPI: 294
Scoring margin: -8.6
NEXT GAME: @ OAK
CHANCE OF WINNING: 21%
MARGIN: 9
Thing they are like: A great big rock teetering precariously on the precipice of a mountain. The mountain's name is Mt. Awfuldom.

oklahomamick · January 25, 2014, 03:08:57 PM

Should have picked up a win at Oakland. Mundy made a 3pt at the buzzer to steal the game. The crowd storms the floor for the victory over last place UIC. Poor UIC. The wheels may fall off.

a3uge · January 25, 2014, 03:27:05 PM

Quote from: oklahomamick on January 25, 2014, 03:08:57 PM
Should have picked up a win at Oakland. Mundy made a 3pt at the buzzer to steal the game. The crowd storms the floor for the victory over last place UIC. Poor UIC. The wheels may fall off.

What are they, Indiana? Wtf.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

historyman · January 25, 2014, 04:12:40 PM

I think this guarantees that UIC will win several games. Every time you start to take pleasure in pointing out that a team is so bad that they will be god awful and start poking fun at them they seem to do better. When Aaron of Milw was teased for having one of the poorest shooting % in the HL he was the second leading scorer on the Panthers against Valpo. When you made fun of how poorly Milw did last year they won a few games against teams that played a game even more poorly than the Panthers. When Wright St was teased about having a poor out of conference schedule and record the conference season started and they started winning games (which was most likely due to the way the officiating called their games). So if we really want to make sure Valpo turns their season into a great one by playing up to their potential maybe we should have Apostle start making fun of them for possibly being one of the worst Valpo teams in many years.

LaPorteAveApostle · January 25, 2014, 05:46:24 PM

we are one of the worst valpo teams in recent years. since 2009-10 and maybe 08-09.

and jordan aaron still blows.

historyman · January 25, 2014, 06:41:19 PM

Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on January 25, 2014, 05:46:24 PMwe are one of the worst valpo teams in recent years. since 2009-10 and maybe 08-09. and jordan aaron still blows.

That's it. Now Valpo is sure to knock off Green Bay on Wednesday.

LaPorteAveApostle · January 25, 2014, 07:14:39 PM

I do what I can.

circle70 · January 25, 2014, 07:58:41 PM

UIC fan here. Nice thread. Thanks. I know we suck. Our coach is in way over his head, etc., etc.
Let's look at the big picture. Do you think that the Horizon League is happy that its largest market team is the laughing stock of the league? I know everyone has to root for their team, but I think having a good Chicago team would benefit everyone. JMHO.

wh · January 25, 2014, 08:24:44 PM

Quote from: circle70 on January 25, 2014, 07:58:41 PM
UIC fan here. Nice thread. Thanks. I know we suck. Our coach is in way over his head, etc., etc.
Let's look at the big picture. Do you think that the Horizon League is happy that its largest market team is the laughing stock of the league? I know everyone has to root for their team, but I think having a good Chicago team would benefit everyone. JMHO.

Welcome to the board, circle70. UIC has a ton of advantages that we at Valpo don't have. Chicago is an attraction in itself. My daughter lived in Lakeview for several years. We loved coming to the City and going places, jogging along the lakeshore, enjoying all the great eateries, etc. It's a fun and exciting place to be, especially for young people. I've been to UIC several times - nice campus, nice bb venue, good academics and choices of majors, literally hundreds of thousands of alumni for networking, etc., etc. For the life of me I can't understand how all these advantages don't translate into a recruiting advantage.

LaPorteAveApostle · January 25, 2014, 08:45:54 PM

Hey, man, I'm just trying to help you out.

After all, Milwaukee was historically bad last year, even worse than you promise to be, I singled them out, and now this year, voilá! Mediocrity.

BTW, what did Hayden Humes do to make Coach hate him this year?

HC · January 25, 2014, 10:14:03 PM

Maybe should've started this thread next Weekend after we play them.

circle70 · January 26, 2014, 12:09:56 PM

Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on January 25, 2014, 08:45:54 PM
Hey, man, I'm just trying to help you out.

Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on January 25, 2014, 08:45:54 PMBTW, what did Hayden Humes do to make Coach hate him this year?

Just playing poorly. After averaging 8.2 and 10.3 ppg his first 2 years at UIC, he is down to 6.9 this year and not providing the senior leadership that Moore hoped he would get out of Humes. Btw, he didn't play yesterday due to an eye injury---out 2-4 weeks.

LaPorteAveApostle · January 26, 2014, 02:06:49 PM

Nah, sorry, don't buy that. of COURSE he's averaging fewer PPG--he's getting fewer minutes! (The same minutes he got freshman year at Toledo. Where he transferred from.)

he didn't suddenly forget how to play. I'd surmise part of his decrease in shooting % would be the yo-yoing he's getting in the lineup.

Bat-signal for HC--if you have time to crunch PPS numbers for Humes? I'd be forever grateful.

One possibility is the "new rules" may have hurt his game--his fouls are WAY up.

circle70 · January 26, 2014, 03:30:16 PM

LPAA:
I know you reached out to HC for this info., but you got my curiosity going so I did some research.
I calculated Humes' PPS (points per shot) by taking total points scored, including free throws, divided by total FG attempts.
These are the stats for his 3 years at UIC (newest to oldest): 1.14, 1.24, 1.29
Other stats for his 3 years (same order):
FG%: .397, .473, .448
3-PT FG%: .353, .400, .418
Minutes per game: 26.2, 33.2, 30.8 (supports your argument about reduced playing time)
What has always amazed me about Humes is his timidness (or lack of aggressiveness, if you prefer). In 524 minutes of playing time this year, he has been to the FT line only 23 times!!! Isn't that a tad low for a 6' 8" power forward?
Just curious, why the interest in Hayden?

historyman · January 26, 2014, 04:17:08 PM

Quote from: circle70 on January 26, 2014, 03:30:16 PMJust curious, why the interest in Hayden?

You forgot what high school Humes attended. Actually he went to the same HS as Apostle, I believe. Humes was down the road in one of the elementary schools or with his mommy when Bryce Drew announced he was going to Valpo U and Apostle was hiding in one of the band rooms next door.

HC · January 26, 2014, 05:12:29 PM

Points Per Shot...that's cute. If school gets cancelled for tomorrow I will run PPS for Mr. Humes tonight. I've personally never found him to be very good, we will see though just how productive he actually is.

LaPorteAveApostle · January 26, 2014, 05:27:08 PM

Quote from: historyman on January 26, 2014, 04:17:08 PMHumes was still in utero with his mommy when Bryce Drew announced he was going to Valpo U

fixed it for you.

Circle, I used to think PPS was points per shot, but our HC has his own special proprietary formula that should take into account minutes played to give a balanced picture, or to be able to compare disparate years.

I think he's a good kid--not really rough like you'd want down low, hence the low FT rate (converts at a high rate, thanks Valpo Free Throw^TM) but yeah.

HC · January 26, 2014, 05:51:45 PM

Here ya go:
2013-2014 so far he is scoring a productivity score of .2786
2012-2013 he scored out at .4257

Last years score is probably at the lower end of average for a HL starter. Now knowing that, this year he just isn't producing anyone positive for his team.

If you need something to compare these to click here, http://cbbpps.wordpress.com/valpo-pps-2012-2013/. I last ran these a week or so ago and it's a combination of 2 guys who play the same position. Or you can click around the site and see what guys score out on individual games or see what IU players have done so far.

axaguy · January 29, 2014, 12:02:15 PM

Another UIC guy, here. Hate to single a college player out for his play but Humes has been a frustrating guy while at UIC. I'm certain he's a really nice guy and good student and I don't want to really rip him but he plays soft and has ever since he's been at UIC. He has the numbers (height) but simply isn't physical or an inside threat and won't shoot from distance, either......

I don't know if it's him or his confusion of what he's supposed to do offensively in Moore's offense but he has either been tremendously underutilized or just doesn't get what he's supposed to do. He should be shooting more because he's probably our best 3 guy, like Novak was at Marquette with Wade there. But he doesn't. Why? Haven't a clue. A good foul shooter too but never gets to the line and certainly lacking in rebounding help.....

Everyone has become a spectator when Barlow has the ball.............. Humes included. Movement? What's that?? There's a few disappointed folks in Chicago these days. Glad the Jimmy Collins era ended but unhappy that the change hasn't improved basketball success....... The potential far outweighs the results, I'm afraid...................

This thread is correct. We are a flameout this year for sure and hoping the future's not doused, either.....

LaPorteAveApostle · January 29, 2014, 04:34:43 PM

Quote from: axaguy on January 29, 2014, 12:02:15 PMplays soft

I know what you mean, but he's hardly alone.

It seems like basketball has caught baseball's disease: "chicks dig the long ball". Now guys that are 6'7, 6'8 and taller think they should be out roaming the perimeter instead of getting their freaking hands dirty and learning to play back to the basket.

NOTE TO TALL NONBELLICOSE TYPES: IF YOU WANT A SPORT WHERE YOU JUST SASHAY AROUND THE PERIMETER ALL DAY, TAKE UP TEAM HANDBALL

LaPorteAveApostle · January 29, 2014, 09:33:52 PM

So. They stormed the court after beating the Flames?

I hope you're pleased with yourself, Oakland.

Italy didn't storm the court after they obliterated Ethiopia in...um soccer.

Totally not just about to reference either Italo-Ethiopian War. Nope. And not just because soccer doesn't have courts.

(But courts have soccer fans...HEYO HERE ALL WEEK)

As of 1/29/13
Record: 0-8 (2004 CSU 0-16)
(realtime)RPI: 303/349 (bottom 13.2%) (2005 YSU 1.8%)
Avg scoring margin: -7.3 (2005 YSU -13.2 ppg)
BEST CHANCE OF WINNING: 43% vs. Detroit
WORST CHANCE OF WINNING: 5% @ UWGB
THING THEY ARE LIKE: Said rock, beginning to stir.

valporun · January 30, 2014, 10:37:26 AM

Quote from: LaPorteAveApostle on January 29, 2014, 09:33:52 PM
So. They stormed the court after beating the Flames?

I hope you're pleased with yourself, Oakland.

Italy didn't storm the court after they obliterated Ethiopia in...um soccer.

Totally not just about to reference either Italo-Ethiopian War. Nope. And not just because soccer doesn't have courts.

(But courts have soccer fans...HEYO HERE ALL WEEK)

As of 1/29/13
Record: 0-8 (2004 CSU 0-16)
(realtime)RPI: 303/349 (bottom 13.2%) (2005 YSU 1.8%)
Avg scoring margin: -7.3 (2005 YSU -13.2 ppg)
BEST CHANCE OF WINNING: 43% vs. Detroit
WORST CHANCE OF WINNING: 5% @ UWGB
THING THEY ARE LIKE: Said rock, beginning to stir.

LAA, is this what UIC means when they say, "Get me the rock"?

LaPorteAveApostle · January 30, 2014, 02:07:00 PM

Quote from: valporun on January 30, 2014, 10:37:26 AM"Get me the rock"?

+10

valporun · January 31, 2014, 03:48:34 PM

As Lost and Found, the Lutheran two-man band says, "Stein Auf, UIC"! (Rock On Top Of..)

LaPorteAveApostle · February 01, 2014, 10:08:23 PM

Not wanting to rub it in too much.

Just wanted rather to commiserate with Flames fans.

You see, it's been 47 days since they've seen a home win (Purdue-Cal).

It's been 319 days since they've seen a home win over a D1 opponent (Chicago St).

And since they don't really count either, it's been 334 days since they've treated people to a real honest good ol' satisfying win over the proverbial worthy opponent. (Cleveland St).