Conference

[covufan]

"Delusional?" Cockeyed Optimist may be? Who would have thought we'd be where we are in basketball in 1988?

Even during the Smith years, I always thought that Valpo basketball could be in the top 1/3 of schools in Division I.  Within a 3 hour drive of Valpo is quite the pool of basketball talent.  I never at that time got the feeling that the administration was determined to get there.  Would we be there?  At that time I thought we would be decent in a great year, but not as good as we have been for 20 years now.

Who would have thought Butler would be in the Big East a few years ago?

Before two runs to the national championship game, even the most optimistic Butler fan would never have guessed Big East.  Butler was in the right place at the right time - getting into the A-10 and then the changes with the Big East.  Good for them.  (Gosh, that was not easy to write  )  Before Butler there was Gonzaga.  I've often wondered why that couldn't happen to Valpo after the 1998 sweet sixteen run (not critical, just wishing).  With Bryce and some luck in the next few years, we could be in the same position as Northern Iowa and Wichita St.

If you don't have aspirational goals as an organization then how do you know where you want to be?

Very true.  Without goals and some forward thinking, we end up aimlessly wondering about.  But I digress...

[classof2014]

The MVC would be instant gratification. We can compete in the MVC now, would we be conference champs next season? I doubt it but there is no question we'd be very competitive.

The Big East and A 10 are better than the MVC so we need to establish ourselves a bit more, consistently be ranked, make multiple runs in the tournament. If we did those the Big East and A 10 are not out of the question. It'll take a few years before I think those conferences would be a good fit but why not in a few years.

[LaPorteAveApostle]

Let me rephrase this in a slightly different manor.

this should do nicely

[talksalot]

I keep wondering if all the TV spots on the Horizon League games for  Kentucky elk hunting are some kind of foreshadowing.

One of the "Corporate Sponsors" for the entire tournament is the Kentucky Department of Fish and Wildlife... along with Progressive, the Detroit-Mercy MBA Program, Valpo School or Law, Athlon, Family Express and a few others...

[bbtds]

I keep wondering if all the TV spots on the Horizon League games for  Kentucky elk hunting are some kind of foreshadowing.

One of the "Corporate Sponsors" for the entire tournament is the Kentucky Department of Fish and Wildlife... along with Progressive, the Detroit-Mercy MBA Program, Valpo School or Law, Athlon, Family Express and a few others...

I think he might have been trying to say that Elk cast a huge shadow or Kentucky Norse hunting may be the next big thing in the HL.

[talksalot]

I see what you did there on your Hilltop, Colonel... but let's not soar with the Eagles in roundball, too.

[FWalum]

Let me rephrase this in a slightly different manor.

this should do nicely

I think Evansville's Manor is nicer.

Harlaxton Manor

[justducky]

Let me rephrase this in a slightly different manor.

this should do nicely

I think Evansville's Manor is nicer.

Harlaxton Manor

Oh no! I hope I didn't offend the Lord and Lady Spellwrite!!         

[LaPorteAveApostle]

Oh no! I hope I didn't offend the Lord and Lady Spellwrite!! 

dibs on being the Lord

[usc4valpo]

I think if we were in the Valley this year, we would finish third or fourth this year.  By the eye test, Wichita St. and UNI are obviously better than Valpo. Illinois State I think is in the same quality range as Valpo. If the Valley gives Valpo an opportunity to join, I think it would be wise to accept the invitation - I was disappointed they gave the offer to Loyola. I Horizon is a cute conference and better than the Summit (or Mid-Con), but the Valley is definitely a step up.


Sure, Wichita St. spend double n their basketball program as Valpo, but they have a better product on the floor. They also draw 3 times more and are the big show in a reasonably size city.


Sometimes thinking about growth and taking a risk is not a bad thing.

[oklahomamick]

I agree uscvalpo.  But let's establish ourselves in the HL first like we did in the midcon.  We out grew the midcon lets outgrow the HL first. 

[Smj]

Could you guys quit putting pictures of my personal homes on here....   You are a bunch of paparazzi

[a3uge]

Could you guys quit putting pictures of my personal homes on here....   You are a bunch of paparazzi

Does that mean your wife is off limits as well?

[classof2014]

I think we reasonably could compete for the MVC championship next season if we were in the MVC. It isn't out of the realm of possibility for this team to be ranked next season. We return everybody but Vashil, that is a big loss but only a single player. We get Lexus back along with Hammink. I'm not expecting a ton out of Smits right away, he needs to hit the weights, and everyone else gained a year of experience.

We'd easily handle the lower half of the conference, SIU, Drake, Bradley, Missouri St, Loyola. We should also be able to handle Indiana St and Evansville. We would most likely be a top 4 team, UNI loses Tuttle to graduation, that's all I really know about Wichita St and UNI, I know Van Vleet is a junior and I know nothing about the Red Birds.

The big question to me. Where is our best chance to make the NCAA every year? Is it staying in the HL, where there's no question that next season we will be the favorites to win the HL. Or is it the MVC where we will have a better shot at an at-large?

If offered the opportunity of the MVC next season. I say take it. I think our chances of making the NCAA tournament next may go down but in the long run will increase.

[bbtds]

Oh no! I hope I didn't offend the Lord and Lady Spellwrite!!

dibs on being the Lord

Jim Caviezel beat you to it. Although he's willing to let you do an episode of "Person of Interest."

Did you know that Caviezel's father played college basketball at UCLA for John Wooden?

Does that mean Wooden was the Almighty's head coach? 

[vu72]

I think we reasonably could compete for the MVC championship next season if we were in the MVC. It isn't out of the realm of possibility for this team to be ranked next season. We return everybody but Vashil, that is a big loss but only a single player. We get Lexus back along with Hammink. I'm not expecting a ton out of Smits right away, he needs to hit the weights, and everyone else gained a year of experience.

We'd easily handle the lower half of the conference, SIU, Drake, Bradley, Missouri St, Loyola. We should also be able to handle Indiana St and Evansville. We would most likely be a top 4 team, UNI loses Tuttle to graduation, that's all I really know about Wichita St and UNI, I know Van Vleet is a junior and I know nothing about the Red Birds.

The big question to me. Where is our best chance to make the NCAA every year? Is it staying in the HL, where there's no question that next season we will be the favorites to win the HL. Or is it the MVC where we will have a better shot at an at-large?

If offered the opportunity of the MVC next season. I say take it. I think our chances of making the NCAA tournament next may go down but in the long run will increase.

I'd be surprised if we aren't ranked.  A few weeks ago we wer 29th in one poll and 31st in the other.  While in Valpo for the semi-finals I had a chance to talk to the coaches as well as Rod Moore.  rod told me that they expect a bunch from Hammink.  The kid has 6% body fat, runs like a deer, can shoot the lights out and is left handed.  Other than those attributes, he is a very nice kid.  The big question is clearly the effect od replacing Vashil with Smits.  Smits is a little bigger, won't have the shot blocking presents of Vashil, but does have a range beyond 2 feet. 

[IndyValpo]

Even during the Smith years, I always thought that Valpo basketball could be in the top 1/3 of schools in Division I.

So you are the one.  The Smith era was tough but better than the Rochlitz era.

[valpopal]

UIC has just announced that it has parted ways with Howard Moore. It will be interesting to see who they can get to replace him and whether the new coach can strengthen their program in the conference. He wasn't successful as coach at UIC, but as a person, Moore was a good guy.

[LaPorteAveApostle]

Here's what I don't understand in this whole "who cares who's in our conference?" debate.

How many other conferences are just a hodgepodge?  Sure, the Big 5 are all in the same boat, pretty much.  But so are the schools at lower levels.  Just imagine a representative school from both D2 and D3 and you immediately hit upon the general differences:  D2:  large state school, usually directional, never flagship, which you didn't get into, hence you're here.  D3:  a small liberal arts college with a good academic track record.

Here's a typical D2 conference (MIAA).
University of Central Missouri (1912)
University of Central Oklahoma (2012-13)
Emporia State University (1991)
Fort Hays State University (2006)
Lincoln University (2010)
Lindenwood University (2012-13)
Missouri Southern State University (1989)
Missouri Western State University (1989)
University of Nebraska at Kearney (2012-13)
Northeastern State University (2012-13)
Northwest Missouri State University (1912)
Pittsburg State University (1989)
Southwest Baptist University (1986)
Washburn University (1989) 

Here's my undergrad's conference:  the North Coast Athletic Conference (D3).
Allegheny College, Denison University, DePauw University, Hiram College, Kenyon College, Oberlin College, Ohio Wesleyan University, Wabash College, Wittenberg University, The College of Wooster, along with affiliate member Earlham College.

Now, about none of these could you plausibly sing the old Sesame St standby ("One of these things is not like the others"), unless it was that Wabash is "like SausageFest '98".

And you can't do that about the big conferences really either.

So why in the middle ALONE do we settle for these hodgepodges and pretend 'it don't matter'?

[historyman]

Could you guys quit putting pictures of my personal homes on here....   You are a bunch of paparazzi

If laporte is the the Lord I think we know who the Lady is.

[oklahomamick]

HL should not add n.kentucky until they prove they can win.  We don't need another 250+ rip to bring us down after we beat them.  I love travel partners but it's not worth bringing another bad program in. 

Maybe not now but when the HL was having success and then butler left we should have been able to get a decent program into the HL.  Oakland was a good addition even though I wish they would change their scheduling procedures and would not accept questionable transfer characters. 

I think Belmont stays in OVC.  They realize after going to the NCAA a couple times over the last years that ticket would be more difficult in the HL.  I think the same goes for us when looking at the mvc.  Unless we are wanting an at large bid.  But I don't think we are on that level yet. 

[nkvu]

I believe Northern Ky in transitioning to D1 hasn't been eligible for post season play until this year which has understandably hurt their recruiting. I expect them to improve over the next several years as they start bringing in better players, but it will be a while before they show they can compete anywhere near a Horizon League level.

[justducky]

Possibile conference realignments are an ongoing subject of discussion so I looked back and found our conversations from last March.

I think we reasonably could compete for the MVC championship next season if we were in the MVC. It isn't out of the realm of possibility for this team to be ranked next season. We return everybody but Vashil, that is a big loss but only a single player.

With this team, this year, the MVC could have been in pursuit of us. All of the conference members would already be be watching our games and waiting for their chances. That doesn't mean that we would have emerged as the regular or the tournament champs but we would now be in the top mix of every conversation. So lets not slip up at ISU or here with MSU.

Has anybody been watching the Conference-USA free-fall? They have a lower OOC winning % than the Horizon and are rated 4 or 5 slots weaker by everybody. How long will UAB, Western Kentucky, UTEP and some of the others tolerate this? Are they an organization that might splinter or explode? If so might this create some opportunities?

[talksalot]

the bottom 6 teams in the CUSA are 4-34 against D1.
the bottom 5 teams in the HL are 3-24 against D1.
the bottom 5 teams in the OVC are 5-32 against D1.
the bottom 5 teams in the Northeast are 5-40 against D1

compare that to the
Summit... only their bottom 2 teams have losing records, Nebr-Omaha 3-4 and IUPUI at 2-6
Colonial... only Drexel has a losing record, 1-5

[wh]

As the numbers suggest, the bottom half of the Horizon League is awful. The bottom 3 or 4 are so bad they would be anchors in any low major conference in the country.

As I've said many times, the answer to elevating the conference's profile lies not in adding a couple of hopefully better programs, so long as the league's losing programs continue to woefully underperform. That would be like a business adding new, better performing employees to hopefully offset the damage being caused by a workforce full of slackers. That move by itself  would never yield a positive result.