Stetson 10/24

[vumsb]

Yes, students are on fall break. The campus is practically deserted until tomorrow. Can't really fault the low turnout today on anything other than that.

As far as the offense goes, one of the main problems is that after every game, the OC comes out and says that there was no problem with his scheme, or his play calling, but rather with the effort put forth from the players. Really tired of the coaches not taking any responsibility for the  losses. There are just too many freshman playing on the offensive line and in other blocking positions for this offense to have any success. As I watched the game today, I realized that this offense is missing from last year's team a quarterback, two running backs,  the two best receivers, and the entire offensive line that was very efficient. Combine that with a horrible scheme plus pathetic play calling and this is what you get.

Disappointing all around.

[vu72]

Yes, students are on fall break. The campus is practically deserted until tomorrow. Can't really fault the low turnout today on anything other than that.

As far as the offense goes, one of the main problems is that after every game, the OC comes out and says that there was no problem with his scheme, or his play calling, but rather with the effort put forth from the players. Really tired of the coaches not taking any responsibility for the  losses. There are just too many freshman playing on the offensive line and in other blocking positions for this offense to have any success. As I watched the game today, I realized that this offense is missing from last year's team a quarterback, two running backs,  the two best receivers, and the entire offensive line that was very efficient. Combine that with a horrible scheme plus pathetic play calling and this is what you get.

Disappointing all around.

Watch the press conference. Dave takes plenty of blame.

[usc4valpo]

Cheerleaders and the band should stay for a home football game, especially if you are trying to portray yourself as a Division I team.

[vumsb]

I know the buck stops with the head coach, as it should, but all I heard was Cecchini taking full responsibility for the failings of the offense in order to protect his OC whois calling the plays. . Also heard him spend a lot of time making excuses and coddling the freshman who fumbled and turned the ball over. Maybe it's time for a little tough love for the freshmen if they're going to be out on the field, and hold all players to the same standards and accountability for their mistakes.

[usc4valpo]

If these guys, players and coaches, do not get their act together, we are talking about a 1-9 season. Not good, and applauding positive and providing warm fuzzies after losing 37-14 to a team they should beat is not going to make things better. 

[VU2624]

Cecchini did take responsibility for the offensive ineptitude which is a good first step. Why it was felt the focus of the offense needed to be changed for a team you'd be expected to beat I'm not sure.  The coaches repeatedly went to a formation of TE and the Z and X receivers out by the numbers and they couldn't run it or throw it out of this formation as Stetson lined up against it with 2 CBs out wide and the safety at the hash so he could go either way and took everything away from the Crusaders. I don't think Valpo had a successful play run out of this formation. The other formation the team went with was a tight formation of an H and 2 TEs with a wing and WR which only served to invite Stetson to play 9 in the box with no concern of being beaten deep. There was also no success at all with this formation until the last drive vs. the backups (and I was glad the coach acknowledge it was against the backups in the PC). These two formations, schemes or whatever you wish to refer to them as were installed during the week of the game. What that tells the offense is they weren't good enough for Stetson running what they had been doing. This creates doubt. Doubt is bad for a football player.

The offense did nothing in the first half until they went 4 wide and went down the field in under a minute. That never appeared again IIRC. Why? Jean Rene has scored 4 TDs in 3 games and I think he played 3 or 4 plays in the second half. Does this make any sense to anyone? How about the coaches outsmarted themselves by not only force feeding an unneccesary offensive philosophy but being all too willing to put lesser players on the field just to placate the scheme.

I also agree with those saying that the babying of the freshman should cease. It's a way of life in the PFL and will continue to be so at Valpo. The QB is also holding the ball too long and needs to be more accurate in the short game.

[usc4valpo]

I guess this is the way you need to coach millennials.

Rene needs to be on the field early and often.

[dime life]

Maybe 1-9...wake up sader nation. The 1-9 train is coming. The freshman experiment has failed and this is what we have to show. In the process many of the upperclassmen who SHOULD be playing and who earned spots have checked out. That is obvious from the sights and sounds of the field / bench. Also, all this talk of us relying on our D this year, subbing freshman in there too, seams, skinny posts and at least 3-4  "slant and go's" a game. Throw in the usual 8-10 RB and Slot screens and we get, "monstered". 

Don't know what is said to team at halftime of these games, if anything. The captains, picked by the coaching staff (not voted on by the team, never heard of this) are same from last year...must be at their wits end watching this unfold. As the season has progressed, the changes we hoped to see have not happened. Instead things have been more complex and more difficult to understand. Most frustrating is this continued hope that some of these routes, schemes and players will suddenly get better. They will not. And all the while, many players who are not intimidated, who came here to win and who got reps last year, just sit. Not even being given a chance to make plays. Stetson is a 3 year old program.  And we just gave them their biggest win of the season. All Aboard!!!     

[vu72]

Maybe 1-9...wake up sader nation. The 1-9 train is coming. The freshman experiment has failed and this is what we have to show. In the process many of the upperclassmen who SHOULD be playing and who earned spots have checked out. That is obvious from the sights and sounds of the field / bench. Also, all this talk of us relying on our D this year, subbing freshman in there too, seams, skinny posts and at least 3-4  "slant and go's" a game. Throw in the usual 8-10 RB and Slot screens and we get, "monstered". 

Don't know what is said to team at halftime of these games, if anything. The captains, picked by the coaching staff (not voted on by the team, never heard of this) are same from last year...must be at their wits end watching this unfold. As the season has progressed, the changes we hoped to see have not happened. Instead things have been more complex and more difficult to understand. Most frustrating is this continued hope that some of these routes, schemes and players will suddenly get better. They will not. And all the while, many players who are not intimidated, who came here to win and who got reps last year, just sit. Not even being given a chance to make plays. Stetson is a 3 year old program.  And we just gave them their biggest win of the season. All Aboard!!!     

So just so I don't misunderstand your post, let me say it back in my words and then you can agree or clarify.  What I read is that the coaching staff is playing freshman when there are upperclassmen who are better players. As a result we need to run the same patterns over and over again because the freshman just can't get up to speed on anything more complicated. Further, the fact that mono and flu plus concussions to key players have depleted our depth (I added that last part!)

In short, you are saying that the coaching staff is deliberately choosing to lose so that the freshman (who may or may not be more talented) get valuable reps to build for next year.  Am I getting your drift??

[usc4valpo]

My interpretation is that dime lite wants to see the upperclassmen play, which is fair. But here is the problem: there are very few upperclassmen on this team, and the upperclassmen in general have not been world beaters. The low number of juniors and seniors on the roster is incredible.

Currently, the overall talent level of the team is below par - let's face facts. They also recruited an insanely large freshman class. I wonder if they are whining about PT or threatening to leave. 

All is not lost yet -- at least we not hearing any Osteen quotes.

[dime life]

Said nothing about deliberate in trying to lose...no one would do that.

We have 1 win (and that was barely). There seems to be an overt effort to get freshmen in the mix. No matter how they do. Even after mistakes (See 2 of the 3 turnovers this week), no changes are made.

Did we see the RB' s shuffle earlier this year , 3 -4 at a time? Why? The WR's playing? Where is Shea? Morgan? Others? Why are we not 4 wide most of the time? Why were we subbing Bastin?  And yes, there are players on the bench who helped to beat teams last season. This team was set to be a possible 4-4 in league play.   

[chef]

I don't blame anyone for being frustrated. Heck I'm frustrated, but I take exception to anyone saying Freshman are playing over Jr's and Sr's who helped win games last year. I've gone up and down the roster and only found one JR or SR on the team that has not been injured and has been replaced by a Freshman, and that's the punter. There are a few upperclassman that are splitting time with Freshman, but none are standout players. There are other upperclassman such as Bastin, Fox, Hall, and Koeneman that have been injured. If I'm missing any upperclassman that contributed last year and are riding the pines this year please share who you are referring to, because I don't think that's the case.

[vumsb]

Said nothing about deliberate in trying to lose...no one would do that.

We have 1 win (and that was barely). There seems to be an overt effort to get freshmen in the mix. No matter how they do. Even after mistakes (See 2 of the 3 turnovers this week), no changes are made.

Did we see the RB' s shuffle earlier this year , 3 -4 at a time? Why? The WR's playing? Where is Shea? Morgan? Others? Why are we not 4 wide most of the time? Why were we subbing Bastin?  And yes, there are players on the bench who helped to beat teams last season. This team was set to be a possible 4-4 in league play.

I agree that the coaches would never intentionally try to lose. However, I think the coaches have absolutely given up on this season. That is the consensus among the parents and fans. Everything is "for the future" regardless of the remaining games in this season. This attitude is why they are constantly shuttling freshman in the mix and pulling out the older and, yes, better players, just to give the freshman their playing time "for the future". Players are unable to establish any rhythm or gain momentum because they are shuttled in and out repeatedly and too often we see any type of drive stalled because of that. The RB shuffle you described is a perfect example with 4 running backs (yes, there have been injuries, but the shuffle has been since the very beginning with everyone healthy). There are players on the bench who contributed last year who appear to have been relegated solely to scout team this season. Why aren't they given the same opportunities with PT that all of the freshmen are getting? Do not discount the effects of maturity and experience that these players bring. We are seeing freshmen make the same critical mistakes over and over and it does not appear that they are being corrected or told what they are doing wrong. The freshman players are struggling learning the offense and seem overwhelmed which is understandable. I wouldn't be surprised to see some of them burned out after this season and leave, and I am talking about ones that are playing. It is infuriating to see this season written off so early when there was still so much fight and determination left in the upperclassmen. I get the feeling that the attitude and philosophy from the coaches is having a  trickle-down effect and is sucking the life and enthusiasm out of this team that ended last season was so much hope and excitement for this year.

[covufan]

Quote from: usc4valpo on October 24, 2015, 05:00:47 PM729 fans is pathetic and embarrassing - and no fans and no cheerleaders?  Seriously?This is a rough season with a lot of growing pains.Students are on fall break.
                     
                  
                  
                     
                     
                     
                        

So which came first?  Did we schedule a game knowing it was going to be fall break, or did we schedule fall break, knowing we had a game?

[IndyValpo]

So which came first?  Did we schedule a game knowing it was going to be fall break, or did we schedule fall break, knowing we had a game?

We have a new winner for dumbest question ever.

[VU2624]

I don't blame anyone for being frustrated. Heck I'm frustrated, but I take exception to anyone saying Freshman are playing over Jr's and Sr's who helped win games last year. I've gone up and down the roster and only found one JR or SR on the team that has not been injured and has been replaced by a Freshman, and that's the punter. There are a few upperclassman that are splitting time with Freshman, but none are standout players. There are other upperclassman such as Bastin, Fox, Hall, and Koeneman that have been injured. If I'm missing any upperclassman that contributed last year and are riding the pines this year please share who you are referring to, because I don't think that's the case.

Riding the pines? No. However the structure of the offense has changed a bit which, in my opinion, has lesser players on the field. I think they are playing too much 2 TE/Hback over 3 and 4 WR sets. That was before the Stetson game. The Stetson game was an embarrassment in the coaches being either too stubborn or too less than smart about going with what may work and what was demonstrably not working. This put freshman TEs who typically line up in line to block someone standing in front of them and moved them to stalk blocking as a WR would which the TEs are not quick enough for. In addition, while Catrine has filled in admirably as the X, he's not as dynamic as Kuramata was, and they cannot figure out the z receiver at all as they have rotated 5 freshman through the position without settling on one. Thus in the Stetson game, nearly the entire game, you had Catrine on the field with two freshman TEs often playing out of position and a freshman Z receiver all of whom have struggled while Rene and Shea were not on the field. It's also taken them too long to figure out Morgan main role on the team. He seemed uncomfortable as a receiver and probably should have been spotted within the RB rotation a while ago. So whether this is a offensive philosophy issue or a we want to play our freshman toys option the result is that you're playing lesser players over better and more experienced players unnecessarily.

RB has been affected by injury with Hall and Bastin. Hall hasn't looked as good as he did last year at any point this year and currently has a hand injury. Graysin has had at least one concussion and that is current with no timetable set to return. Jake Hutson is a great kid and came back for his 5th year but I'm not sure Choudry shouldn't have been given more of a role more quickly. Again, Morgan should have been with this group sooner.

The OL is currently a disaster but that shouldn't have precluded the offense from running their regular sets (prior to Sat). There would have been negative plays but there was demonstrable evidence that there would have been positive plays as well. One thing no one will address is the fact that the QB has simply not been accurate enough for this type of offense. It's an offense dependent upon completing the short pass, taking what you can get an moving on to the next play. This softens the defense for the running game. Too many easy completions not made because of poor throws and, imho, too many drops. Lobbing the ball to Catrine may seem effective but it really isn't as it's become almost an overall philosophy and it's being used as a crutch. Vs. Dayton twice both slots were running up the hash 10 yds behind the back of the defense and Clarke only looked at Catrine for the jump ball and a 15 yard gain and an incompletion both times. Maybe he missed it the first time. You'd think the coaches might mention to him to take a longer look elsewhere the next time.

I suspect there is some force feeding of freshman in spots it is not necessary. The staff has had almost an arrogance about their first recruiting class but, to be honest, I don't see it as remarkably different than some classes prior to the new staff. There are some early hits but mostly guys who shouldn't be out there much if at all but they are.

[VU2624]

Said nothing about deliberate in trying to lose...no one would do that.

We have 1 win (and that was barely). There seems to be an overt effort to get freshmen in the mix. No matter how they do. Even after mistakes (See 2 of the 3 turnovers this week), no changes are made.

Did we see the RB' s shuffle earlier this year , 3 -4 at a time? Why? The WR's playing? Where is Shea? Morgan? Others? Why are we not 4 wide most of the time? Why were we subbing Bastin?  And yes, there are players on the bench who helped to beat teams last season. This team was set to be a possible 4-4 in league play.

I agree that the coaches would never intentionally try to lose. However, I think the coaches have absolutely given up on this season. That is the consensus among the parents and fans. Everything is "for the future" regardless of the remaining games in this season. This attitude is why they are constantly shuttling freshman in the mix and pulling out the older and, yes, better players, just to give the freshman their playing time "for the future". Players are unable to establish any rhythm or gain momentum because they are shuttled in and out repeatedly and too often we see any type of drive stalled because of that. The RB shuffle you described is a perfect example with 4 running backs (yes, there have been injuries, but the shuffle has been since the very beginning with everyone healthy). There are players on the bench who contributed last year who appear to have been relegated solely to scout team this season. Why aren't they given the same opportunities with PT that all of the freshmen are getting? Do not discount the effects of maturity and experience that these players bring. We are seeing freshmen make the same critical mistakes over and over and it does not appear that they are being corrected or told what they are doing wrong. The freshman players are struggling learning the offense and seem overwhelmed which is understandable. I wouldn't be surprised to see some of them burned out after this season and leave, and I am talking about ones that are playing. It is infuriating to see this season written off so early when there was still so much fight and determination left in the upperclassmen. I get the feeling that the attitude and philosophy from the coaches is having a  trickle-down effect and is sucking the life and enthusiasm out of this team that ended last season was so much hope and excitement for this year.

Last year, make a mistake...particularly a younger player...off the field you came. Even minor mistakes were dealt with this way last year such as false starts for anyone other than a lineman. This year, this has not happened.

The parents/fans and some players were in full riot mode Saturday and this is particularly true with those affiliated with the offensive side of the ball. Parents and other third party fans pay the bills and players make decisions. Based on my conversations either in person, phone or text it is not limited to freshman who may not be playing at this point who are struggling with the is this worth it issue.

I mentioned that the change in offense, even if it appeared subtle to some (it wasn't), can have a devastating effect on the confidence of a team. The question being asked on the offensive side, and it was there Thursday prior to the game, is why are we making changes for Stetson. I assume the offensive players talk to the defensive players and maybe that first drive was what the coaches got as a result. Coach's comments that they had a good week of practice did not mesh with his players or at least some of them who talked of too many balls hitting the ground and players being unclear on assignments.

[VU2624]

Quote from: usc4valpo on October 24, 2015, 05:00:47 PM729 fans is pathetic and embarrassing - and no fans and no cheerleaders?  Seriously?This is a rough season with a lot of growing pains.Students are on fall break.         
                  
                  
                     
                     
                     
                        

So which came first?  Did we schedule a game knowing it was going to be fall break, or did we schedule fall break, knowing we had a game?

All teams play home games during breaks in the semester at some point. The scheduling of the game has nothing to do with the school schedule.

[usc4valpo]

Strange comments. Fall break or not, 729 fans is pathetic. Not a lot of participation.

[VU2624]

Is it really any worse than the 1200 at San Diego or 2000 at Drake? It's a function of the level and interest. Interest is earned.

[usc4valpo]

Drake was 3X.

[vu72]

Is it really any worse than the 1200 at San Diego or 2000 at Drake? It's a function of the level and interest. Interest is earned.

3183 for the San Diego game.

[a3uge]

Having 730 fans attend a game isn't all that embarrassing. Having one of the worst program for any D1 sport this past decade... Well, that's embarrassing.

[Vinny]

Yep. I think the school needs to give the football program a long and thorough examination. It's one thing to have a bad few seasons, but outside of a handful of years, Valpo football has been a failure for the better part of three decades. According to the school's archives, the team even has a losing record all time AT HOME. How does that happen?


I'm not sure I buy the argument that football is a $$ maker for the school when you consider coaching salaries, equipment, recruiting, travel and everything else. And in the end what is the return on investment? A whole lot of losses. I have to think the money could be better spent elsewhere. Maybe the new field house?

[usc4valpo]

The football program brings in student athletes that will pay tuition to play. At a higher level it brings in revenue to the school.