Football sholarships?

[vu16]

Heard rumors of football going to become scholarshiped... Any thoughts?
Anyone hear anything?

[covufan]

Heard rumors of football going to become scholarshiped... Any thoughts?
Anyone hear anything?

I doubt it would be anytime soon.  If we can't win in the Pioneer League, what are our chances in a scholarship conference?  It would also change the Title IX landscape at VU, which I doubt happens anytime soon.

Do I think that a school that has a strong commitment to athletics (especially football), a strong academic reputation, and access to a large population within a 3 hour drive could be competitive in FCS scholarship football?  Yes, I could see that happening.  Things that need to happen:

We need to be competitive in the PFL, and provide the students/alumni/parents/local community with a great gameday experience for the next several years.  Increased student population and support.  A donor (or donors) with the vision to provide the facilities and infrastructure ($$$ for coaching staff and scholarships) necessary to be competitive in FCS scholarship football. 

We really need to be competitive in the PFL for a decade before we can even entertain such thoughts of going scholarship for football.  If we do have people with this vision, I'm sure scholarship football could only enhance the commitment to a perennial top 50-60 team in Men's Basketball.

[vu72]

I understand that there have been VERY, make that VERY VERY early and preliminary discussions concerning this.

[covufan]

I understand that there have been VERY, make that VERY VERY early and preliminary discussions concerning this.

Yeah, like 2030 or 2040 vision

[usc4valpo]

I think the Valpo Hockey topic has more credibility than this.

[VU2624]

Agree that it would be a ways off but there's no requirement that Valpo be successful as a non scholarship program prior to becoming a scholarship program. Scholarship would simply change the focus of recruiting and make the program more attractive the moment it's announced. What happened prior wouldn't really matter.

[covufan]

Agree that it would be a ways off but there's no requirement that Valpo be successful as a non scholarship program prior to becoming a scholarship program. Scholarship would simply change the focus of recruiting and make the program more attractive the moment it's announced. What happened prior wouldn't really matter.

Agree that there is no requirement.  Where is the $$$ for a scholarship program?  We still have many alumni that don't understand the football move to Division I, which was required.  We have many that have been frustrated enough to say that if we are not going to put  decent effort into football, get rid of football.  The recruiting focus would still be the same (IMO) - looking for qualified student athletes to come play football for Valpo.  It might become easier to compete with universities offering scholarship $$ if we are offering similar amounts, but we would still need to find student-athletes to pay their own way.

[VU2624]

Agree that it would be a ways off but there's no requirement that Valpo be successful as a non scholarship program prior to becoming a scholarship program. Scholarship would simply change the focus of recruiting and make the program more attractive the moment it's announced. What happened prior wouldn't really matter.

Agree that there is no requirement.  Where is the $$$ for a scholarship program?  We still have many alumni that don't understand the football move to Division I, which was required.  We have many that have been frustrated enough to say that if we are not going to put  decent effort into football, get rid of football.  The recruiting focus would still be the same (IMO) - looking for qualified student athletes to come play football for Valpo.  It might become easier to compete with universities offering scholarship $$ if we are offering similar amounts, but we would still need to find student-athletes to pay their own way.

All true.

[VULB#62]

We were at one point in our not so distant FB history (1990-1992) D-II (i.e., scholarship) before eventually being a founding member of the PFL.  So there was maybe an attempt at scholarshipping the FB program.  But it might also have been an attempt to play scholarship programs (Hillsdale, Grand Valley, Indianapolis etc.) without funding scholarships as an interim measure.  Tom Horne went 5-21-1 in those years.  And prior to being in the Midwest Intercollegiate FB Conference we were in the D-III Heartland Conference from 1978-1989.

[covufan]

We were at one point in our not so distant FB history (1990-1992) D-II (i.e., scholarship) before eventually being a founding member of the PFL.  So there was maybe an attempt at scholarshipping the FB program.  But it might also have been an attempt to play scholarship programs (Hillsdale, Grand Valley, Indianapolis etc.) without funding scholarships as an interim measure.  Tom Horne went 5-21-1 in those years.  And prior to being in the Midwest Intercollegiate FB Conference we were in the D-III Heartland Conference from 1978-1989.

According to cfbdatawarehouse, our football classification was:


1937-1940  N/A
1941-1972  NCAA College Division (Small College)
1973-1978  NCAA Division III
1979-1992  NCAA Division II
1993-20XX  NCAA Division I-AA

And the number of football scholarships for a NCAA Division II team is currently 36, but I don't know what the limits were in the '79-'92 years.  The conference we were in at that time may have had scholarship restrictions as well.  I only recall a handful of scholarships for football in the '80's. 

[VULB#62]

I may be mistaken, but that 36 is the max for D-II but fewer can be given; the same with FCS that maxes at 65 but fewer can be given (e.g., NEC and Patriot).  Whereas FBS requires 85, period.

[usc4valpo]

unless you are screwed like USC with the loss of scholarships.

[bbtds]

We were at one point in our not so distant FB history (1990-1992) D-II (i.e., scholarship) before eventually being a founding member of the PFL.  So there was maybe an attempt at scholarshipping the FB program.  But it might also have been an attempt to play scholarship programs (Hillsdale, Grand Valley, Indianapolis etc.) without funding scholarships as an interim measure.  Tom Horne went 5-21-1 in those years.  And prior to being in the Midwest Intercollegiate FB Conference we were in the D-III Heartland Conference from 1978-1989.

I looked up the word scholarshipping and only found it in the urban dictionary. (don't worry--this definition is clean)

the act of looking at a scholarship website and praying that something applicable will turn up. then mailing out countless applications in hopes that someone else will be kind enough to pay your substantial college debts for you

"I wasted a perfectly good Saturday scholarshipping by writing a fictitious letter to my congressman about suggestions for controlling overpopulation in the United States for the Negative Population Growth (NPG) scholarship"

[a3uge]

We were at one point in our not so distant FB history (1990-1992) D-II (i.e., scholarship) before eventually being a founding member of the PFL.  So there was maybe an attempt at scholarshipping the FB program.  But it might also have been an attempt to play scholarship programs (Hillsdale, Grand Valley, Indianapolis etc.) without funding scholarships as an interim measure.  Tom Horne went 5-21-1 in those years.  And prior to being in the Midwest Intercollegiate FB Conference we were in the D-III Heartland Conference from 1978-1989.

I looked up the word scholarshipping and only found it in the urban dictionary. (don't worry--this definition is clean)

the act of looking at a scholarship website and praying that something applicable will turn up. then mailing out countless applications in hopes that someone else will be kind enough to pay your substantial college debts for you

"I wasted a perfectly good Saturday scholarshipping by writing a fictitious letter to my congressman about suggestions for controlling overpopulation in the United States for the Negative Population Growth (NPG) scholarship"

I think you're hairsplitterating.

Sent from my XT1095 using Tapatalk

[crusaderjoe]

I've looked into my crystal ball and this is what will happen:

1.  Idaho and NMSU are exited from the Sun Belt as football only members.
2.  VU announces a press conference to state that it will start offering football scholarships.
3.  Eastern Kentucky moves to the Sun Belt.
4.  Tired of having football in a separate league, Valpo moves to the OVC to take EKU's place as an all sports member.
5.  UIC and another soccer school also move to the OVC so that it can start sponsoring the sport.
6.  With UIC in the league, the OVC basketball tournament is held in Chicago. 
7.  Valpo and UIC co-host the OVC tournament and both ADs send a fax to the HL office which says "Enjoy your tournament in Detroit."
8.  Valpo wins 2025 FCS NC by beating Delaware, 20-16.

[VULB#62]

I've looked into my crystal ball and this is what will happen:

1.  Idaho and NMSU are exited from the Sun Belt as football only members.
2.  VU announces a press conference to state that it will start offering football scholarships.
3.  Eastern Kentucky moves to the Sun Belt.
4.  Tired of having football in a separate league, Valpo moves to the OVC to take EKU's place as an all sports member.
5.  UIC and another soccer school also move to the OVC so that it can start sponsoring the sport.
6.  With UIC in the league, the OVC basketball tournament is held in Chicago. 
7.  Valpo and UIC co-host the OVC tournament and both ADs send a fax to the HL office which says "Enjoy your tournament in Detroit."
8.  Valpo wins 2025 FCS NC by beating Delaware, 20-16.

Scary how this will all spill out, but you forgot item 2a:  Valpo expands Brown Field to 12,000 seats to attract OVC invite and accommodate OVC crowds 

[IndyValpo]

I've looked into my crystal ball and this is what will happen:

1.  Idaho and NMSU are exited from the Sun Belt as football only members.
2.  VU announces a press conference to state that it will start offering football scholarships.
3.  Eastern Kentucky moves to the Sun Belt.
4.  Tired of having football in a separate league, Valpo moves to the OVC to take EKU's place as an all sports member.
5.  UIC and another soccer school also move to the OVC so that it can start sponsoring the sport.
6.  With UIC in the league, the OVC basketball tournament is held in Chicago. 
7.  Valpo and UIC co-host the OVC tournament and both ADs send a fax to the HL office which says "Enjoy your tournament in Detroit."
8.  Valpo wins 2025 FCS NC by beating Delaware, 20-16.

You also forgot what women's sport or sports we added to remain in compliance.
And that the OVC tourney played in Chicago was an attendance disaster.
Still points for thinking outside the box.....

[historyman]

I think you're hairsplitterating.

Good one. I have enjoyed having some of the vocabulary explained. We are all the more educated for it.

[crusaderjoe]

You also forgot what women's sport or sports we added to remain in compliance.
And that the OVC tourney played in Chicago was an attendance disaster.
Still points for thinking outside the box.....

but you forgot item 2a:  Valpo expands Brown Field to 12,000 seats to attract OVC invite and accommodate OVC crowds

In reading my tea leaves, I've been advised that we have potential fixes for some of your concerns:  1)  add womens' crew to maintain Title IX compliance; and 2)  while we're fundraising for upgrades for a 12K football stadium, play our home games at Merrillville High School (capacity 7K), and if possible, put temporary seating in the end zones to possibly get to 9 or 10K when needed. 

Ah, who are we kidding...none of this is ever going to happen  , except for maybe EKU moving to the Sun Belt at some point.

[VULB#62]

In reading my tea leaves, I've been advised that we have potential fixes for some of your concerns:  1)  add womens' crew to maintain Title IX compliance; and 2)  while we're fundraising for upgrades for a 12K football stadium, play our home games at Merrillville High School (capacity 7K), and if possible, put temporary seating in the end zones to possibly get to 9 or 10K when needed. 

Ah, who are we kidding...none of this is ever going to happen , except for maybe EKU moving to the Sun Belt at some point.

Ah.... so that is your #9 crystal ball prediction. 

[valpochgo]

I wish Valpo would either offer scholarships or just join a D3 conference. Even when teams like USD go to the playoffs they take a beating so really....what's the point?  I'd rather watch Valpo play in the D3 playoffs and watch GOOD football then to cheer for one of the worst 3 schools in D1 every year.  I watched the D3 championship game last year between Whitewater and Mt Union and it was exciting football.  The reasons fan's leave our games isn't because they aren't true football fans and want Valpo to lose; they don't want to watch BAD football.  I watch my community high school football team play every Friday night because it's GOOD football games.  Most times they win...sometimes they lose but the level competition makes it enjoyable to watch.  I'd drive to Valpo for every home game from Chicago if the games were good but they are horrible to watch. I've seen Lake Forest College play St. Norbert College (neither ranked in D3) and it was a great football game.  In the last 2 years; I've only seen Valpo play one great game that was exciting to watch and it was actually their loss to USD last year.  Yes ,I want to see Valpo win more but I also want to see good competitive football not a game against Sacred Heart where they dominate us then a game against College of Faith which also was just a travesty of a game.

[vusupporter]

You can't just pick and choose what sports play in what division. If you're a Division I athletics department, all your teams must participate at the Division I level. The only exception comes in the opposite direction - if you're a lower division athletics department, you can choose one sport that "plays up", which you see a good bit for example with ice hockey.

[VULB#62]

Or like D-III Johns Hopkins that plays D-I Lacrosse and has won a couple NCAA titles.

[IndyValpo]

I wish Valpo would either offer scholarships or just join a D3 conference

If a school plays D1 basketball all sports have to be D1.

[covufan]

I wish Valpo would either offer scholarships or just join a D3 conference

If a school plays D1 basketball all sports have to be D1.

Is this not 20+ year old info?