Valpo First HL Tournament Game Saturday

[oklahomamick]

I know Oakland practiced on at JLA.  Pictures were posted on twitter.  Kampe was laughing it up with LeCrone.   

[VU2014]

The first time they stepped on the floor was for shoot around. MKE and Valpo were practicing at Detroit-Mercy's arena.

Here is a pic the MKE team twitter tweeted out. Valpo posted the same thing but with our guys earlier yesterday but I can't find the tweet anymore.

https://twitter.com/MKE_MBB/status/838116519334793216

[valpopal]

I know Oakland practiced on at JLA.  Pictures were posted on twitter.  Kampe was laughing it up with LeCrone.   

Then there needs to be a reason given as to why Valpo did not have a practice in the arena. This is a question that should be answered.

[VULB#62]

The combination of men's and women's games at the same location in the same weekend no doubt must have been a factor in the alleged absence of shoot-around time on that floor - this year.  Last year, I'm pretty confident it was just the double bye thing that bit us in the a$$.  It's unfortunate that the HL's slow learning curve over two years of "neutral court" MCM experimentation seems to have sacrificed the #1 and #2 seeds in each of the last two years. 

Regarding a VU scheduling problem that might have been the cause of the lack of a shoot-around, I cannot believe for one minute that if a specific shoot-around time slot was offered to VU by the HL tournament committee, that we would have not taken advantage of it.  I don't know where the team was housed but I assume somewhere close to the arena? So even if a bus does not show up on time a short walk to JLA might have solved that. I really hope the truth of this matter is uncovered soon.

BTW, USAToday's Bracketology, as of this morning, has NKU at a #15 in the East playing Florida State.

[brycepeters]

You shouldn't need a practice in that arena to beat a team as pathetic as uwm peters or no peters


7-15 fts is why they lost


Quit making excuses

[VU2014]

You shouldn't need a practice in that arena to beat a team as pathetic as uwm peters or no peters

7-15 fts is why they lost

Quit making excuses

Nobody is saying Valpo doesn't own the loss. Valpo absolutely did. Quit your troll.

You don't think practicing on the court doesn't help? Damn you must have never played or coached a day in your life.

-shooting back drop (particular in a very spread-out wide arena at the Joe affects depth perception)

-Learning where there are dead spots on the court, etc.

Horizon League HQ leadership strikes again...

Nobody is blaming the loss on this but it could have played a factor and you are naive to deny Valpo & MKE should have at least been able to hold a practice in the Joe once before they play the game.

[yayphoenixyay]

In all fairness, it simply does not matter where you shoot around, when you shoot around, what court you play on, what state the tournament is held in, etc... At the end of the day, you have to beat the team across the court from you. That is why we have conference tournaments. Want something more embarrassing than "not sending your best team to the dance?" Try having everyone but the top two teams phone it in for the last 2 months of the season because there is no conference tournament. I'm sorry, but win your games. I would rather have the "hottest team peaking at the right time" going to the dance instead of the team who beat a team receiving votes in the AP poll in November. Whether it be Youngstown, NKU, Green Bay, whomever, I would rather have them dance than a team that folds to a clearly inferior team. Trust me, the conference is not plotting against you, Oakland or any other team. It is not LeCrone's fault that the Grizzlies or Crusaders are not dancing, it is the teams' faults.

[FieldGoodie05]

In all fairness, it simply does not matter where you shoot around, when you shoot around, what court you play on, what state the tournament is held in, etc... At the end of the day, you have to beat the team across the court from you. That is why we have conference tournaments. Want something more embarrassing than "not sending your best team to the dance?" Try having everyone but the top two teams phone it in for the last 2 months of the season because there is no conference tournament. I'm sorry, but win your games. I would rather have the "hottest team peaking at the right time" going to the dance instead of the team who beat a team receiving votes in the AP poll in November. Whether it be Youngstown, NKU, Green Bay, whomever, I would rather have them dance than a team that folds to a clearly inferior team. Trust me, the conference is not plotting against you, Oakland or any other team. It is not LeCrone's fault that the Grizzlies or Crusaders are not dancing, it is the teams' faults.

There is no conspiracy, agreed.

We beat ourselves last night, agreed.

The temperature of an inferior team does not greatness make.  Having talent is a prerequisite to winning in March.  I don't think the bottom half of our league could make a run anywhere but their underpants.  We will probably suck again at some point, but for now I don't believe any team left CAN win in mid March.  You all will draw a 1 or 2 seed, and GOOD LUCK SIR.

[Valpo89]

I can't help but think back to the 1990s when the Mid-Con tourney was played in the Quad Cities and then later in Fort Wayne.
Those Valpo teams seeded No. 1 always seemed to be able to take care of business, putting a first-round beating on teams like Chicago State.
Why hasn't that been the case the last couple years?

[justducky]

I'm sorry, but win your games. I would rather have the "hottest team peaking at the right time" going to the dance instead of the team who beat a team receiving votes in the AP poll in November. Whether it be Youngstown, NKU, Green Bay, whomever,

I pretty much agree and had Adekoya been cleared to play early February, with a healthy Alec that peaking team would have been Valpo.

[wh]

The "hottest team peaking at the right time" would in fact be the Oakland Grizzlies, who after a 5-4 1st half went 9-0 in the 2nd. If the tournament were held in Oakland, as it should have been, this never would have happened.

A year ago the "hottest team peaking at the right time" would in fact be the Valpo Crusaders. If the tournament were held in Valpo, as it should have been, Green Bay and it's conference-humiliating NCAA blow-out loss would never have happened.

So, to be clear, GB was not the "hottest team peaking at the right time" last year. GB is not the hottest team peaking at the right time this year. The HL did not be send its best team to the NCAA tournament last year. The HL will not be sending its best team this year. That is the very disaster that occurred 15 years ago at the hands of a terrible GB team upsetting a far superior Butler team that caused the league to go to the double bye formula to begin with. Interesting how history repeats itself when people forget the lessons of the past.

[brycepeters]

Playing on your home court doesn't mean you won't lose to an inferior team.


Green Bay did to uwm in 2014. Hell butler did back in the day to Cleveland st


Oakland did basically play a home game yesterday and still lost


The only way you are going to protect your top seeds is by either eliminating the conference tourney all together which will never happen or by limiting it to the top six or top four making it and not allowing everyone in.


Valpo almost lost at home to Green Bay in 2015 and should have if not for an epic second half collapse by the Phoenix

[a3uge]

In all fairness, it simply does not matter where you shoot around, when you shoot around, what court you play on, what state the tournament is held in, etc... At the end of the day, you have to beat the team across the court from you. That is why we have conference tournaments. Want something more embarrassing than "not sending your best team to the dance?" Try having everyone but the top two teams phone it in for the last 2 months of the season because there is no conference tournament. I'm sorry, but win your games. I would rather have the "hottest team peaking at the right time" going to the dance instead of the team who beat a team receiving votes in the AP poll in November. Whether it be Youngstown, NKU, Green Bay, whomever, I would rather have them dance than a team that folds to a clearly inferior team. Trust me, the conference is not plotting against you, Oakland or any other team. It is not LeCrone's fault that the Grizzlies or Crusaders are not dancing, it is the teams' faults.

100% - 16 seed vs 1 seed.
93.8% - 15 seed vs 2 seed.
83.6% - 14 seed vs 3 seed.
80.3% - 13 seed vs 4 seed.
66.9% - 12 seed vs 5 seed.

Sending the hottest team at the right time is irrelevant to the NCAA tournament. These guys have over a week off in-between their hot streak and the next game. Sending a 15 seed that was on a hot streak from a week and a half ago is irrelevant when they're playing Kentucky in Louisville or something like that.

The whole reason for protecting top teams is to give them more winable games in the tournament. West Virginia, Cincinnati, and SMU are far more winable than Kentucky, Oregon, and Louisville. Whether that's a team that was a little hot a week ago probably doesn't make a difference.

"Win your games" is cute and all, but the league  may have flushed millions down the drain by ensuring another 15 seed in the tournament.

Even when the top seeds lost in the old format, it would at least help the bottom team by adding a road win vs a top 100 team to their resume.

[justducky]

Valpo almost lost at home to Green Bay in 2015 and should have if not for an epic second half collapse by the Phoenix

There seems to be a link between good defenses and second half collapses. Last March a bubble St Marys team scored 12 second half points at the ARC in a similar situation. 

Wait! We played that GB game shorthanded as well. Tevonne tried to play but couldn't, EVN was banged up and wasn't D. Walker or somebody among the walking ill or wounded? Depth is a great thing. VU started this year with only 10 eligible scholarship players then finished with 8 and a walk on. So, no we would not have been able to win it at the ARC either. Are you happy now?

As to home court advantage for Oakland at the Blacktop, it could have been enormous! Still not a guarantee but BBBBBIG.

[a3uge]

I can't help but think back to the 1990s when the Mid-Con tourney was played in the Quad Cities and then later in Fort Wayne.
Those Valpo teams seeded No. 1 always seemed to be able to take care of business, putting a first-round beating on teams like Chicago State.
Why hasn't that been the case the last couple years?

This may be the case around all of college basketball right now. Last year, only a few 1 seeds won their conference tournaments. Belmont just lost in the semis, and they ROLLED through the league, only losing one game.

Also, Milwaukee and YSU aren't Chicago State bad. Milwaukee should have beat Oakland and played each team close at some point during the year.

[NativeCheesehead]

Is a Green Bay fan honestly talking about "hottest team peaking"? I'm sorry. What was the score of your NCAA game last year and how was that good for the conference?

[a3uge]

Is a Green Bay fan honestly talking about "hottest team peaking"? I'm sorry. What was the score of your NCAA game last year and how was that good for the conference?

Or how was UWM winning 4 years ago good for the conference instead of UWGB?

[FieldGoodie05]

Is a Green Bay fan honestly talking about "hottest team peaking"? I'm sorry. What was the score of your NCAA game last year and how was that good for the conference?

There's something fulfilling watching Wisc tear into Wisc

[valpotx]

I always find it hilarious when a fan from another team claims that it is good when a 3-6 seed gets hot and wins 3-4 games in a row in the conference tournament.  It DOES NOT mean that you are the best team.  The best team is determined during the regular season over an 18 game schedule, regardless of what happens in a short period of time in one weekend.  Would GB have won the tournament without Fouse and Cooper last season?  That is the circumstance that we had this season without Peters and Adekoya.  'Just win the games' is much harder when a GB player gets away with a foul on your star player, which eventually knocks him out over the last 3 games .

[yayphoenixyay]

Say what you will, but if you can't win your conference tourney, you shouldn't be playing in the field of 64. That is the nature of mid-major college basketball. The Phoenix are down at the half right now. If they don't beat UIC, then they simply don't deserve to keep playing and that will be that.

How good is it for the conference to just have the regular season champ in the dance every year? Has the Ivy made a big splash outside of Harvard (I believe) winning a game a few years ago?

I fail to see the validity of the argument that the neutral court decided the Oakland and Valpo games. Oakland essentially played a home game and still lost. Furthermore, if you can't beat Youngstown or Milwaukee on a neutral court, how can you claim that you'd have a good chance against Cincy or another 4 or 3 seed on a neutral court? You can bicker about all the nuances surrounding the game (arena, format, etc...) but the fact of the matter is if you get outplayed, you lose, no matter where or when you play.

[yayphoenixyay]

I also never said that we were necessarily sending our best team on paper to the tourney, I carefully made the "hottest" team distinction. You can't look anyone in the eye and tell me that the team that lost to UWM last night could've made waves in the dance. Why? Because they were horribly out of sync and couldn't function without their centerpiece. I'm not trying to be hostile, but the fact of the matter is, regardless of how your whole season played out up until about two weeks ago, as of right now, Valpo was not the best, nor the hottest team.

[a3uge]

Say what you will, but if you can't win your conference tourney, you shouldn't be playing in the field of 64. That is the nature of mid-major college basketball. The Phoenix are down at the half right now. If they don't beat UIC, then they simply don't deserve to keep playing and that will be that.

How good is it for the conference to just have the regular season champ in the dance every year? Has the Ivy made a big splash outside of Harvard (I believe) winning a game a few years ago?

I fail to see the validity of the argument that the neutral court decided the Oakland and Valpo games. Oakland essentially played a home game and still lost. Furthermore, if you can't beat Youngstown or Milwaukee on a neutral court, how can you claim that you'd have a good chance against Cincy or another 4 or 3 seed on a neutral court? You can bicker about all the nuances surrounding the game (arena, format, etc...) but the fact of the matter is if you get outplayed, you lose, no matter where or when you play.

I take it you didn't watch the FGCU game today? Or the UWGB Valpo game 4 years ago? In both cases, the home team was down at half and the crowd got them back into the game. The road team could never get momentum back.

There's a statistical advantage to playing at home. This is well stated, to the point where RPI rewards road victories. I don't think many people are trying to get rid of the conference tournament all together, rather, many mid major fans of decent-RPI teams (decent seeds in the NCAA tournament) like the idea of having a little bit of an advantage in their conference tournament.

You throw around terms like "deserve" - well that's fun and all, but if the House sends a 15 seed, they're certainly not making any money from a Sweet 16 run because 15 seeds RARELY win their first round games.

[FWalum]

Matt comment:
"It's tough when you come in and don't take any shots in the arena."

Oren follow-up question:
"Coach, I don't know if this is the time to bring this up, but the same kind of thing happened last year not getting into the arena and everything. What led to that? Was it a Valpo scheduling thing?  A Horizon League scheduling thing? What was it?

Matt reply:
"I don't know. I just know it's difficult."

So, for 2 consecutive years we take the floor against teams that played the day before, and our players haven't so much bounced a ball or taken a shot until pregame warmups. And we lose both games. By the way, 40% of our minutes were played by freshmen in their first college tournament game in an arena they've never been to before.

Two years ago when Valpo hosted, a comprehensive practice schedule published by the league was posted on every door, showing when each team had exclusive use of the floor on what day. I cannot image that has changed. Before our tournament game against Maryland we had exclusive use of the arena.

IMO there's about a 95% chance this is another Valpo Athletic Department F-up. I know there are people who post anonymously on this board who work in the Athletic Department. If you don't have the gumption to defend your employer and refute this notion, my suspicion will become 100%.

If this is a "Valpo thing," someone's head needs to roll. But, of course it won't because that would be admitting guilt and accepting responsibility,
and if we learned anything from the Jubril situation, never ever do that.

Did anyone hear Todd's interview with Luke Gore after the game? Luke talked quite a bit about not getting to practice at the arena, but I missed the part why he said it was an issue.  I did hear him say it was the right thing to do under the circumstances.

[a3uge]

I also never said that we were necessarily sending our best team on paper to the tourney, I carefully made the "hottest" team distinction. You can't look anyone in the eye and tell me that the team that lost to UWM last night could've made waves in the dance. Why? Because they were horribly out of sync and couldn't function without their centerpiece. I'm not trying to be hostile, but the fact of the matter is, regardless of how your whole season played out up until about two weeks ago, as of right now, Valpo was not the best, nor the hottest team.

It's almost as if sometimes teams have good games, while other times, teams have bad games. Perhaps a single game isn't indicative of the team's talent level and performance over the next few games?

I don't think any of us are arguing that Valpo would have won a tournament game this year. Typically the 2 seed isn't down an all American, but I'd still probably take Valpo being closer to Cincinnati than NKU to Kentucky in the tournament.

I'm still not sure how anyone can reason that UWGB winning the league last year was good for the league when they got drilled by A&M. Valpo would have had a much more winable game.

[EddieCabot]

Matt comment:
"It's tough when you come in and don't take any shots in the arena."

Oren follow-up question:
"Coach, I don't know if this is the time to bring this up, but the same kind of thing happened last year not getting into the arena and everything. What led to that? Was it a Valpo scheduling thing?  A Horizon League scheduling thing? What was it?

Matt reply:
"I don't know. I just know it's difficult."

So, for 2 consecutive years we take the floor against teams that played the day before, and our players haven't so much bounced a ball or taken a shot until pregame warmups. And we lose both games. By the way, 40% of our minutes were played by freshmen in their first college tournament game in an arena they've never been to before.

Two years ago when Valpo hosted, a comprehensive practice schedule published by the league was posted on every door, showing when each team had exclusive use of the floor on what day. I cannot image that has changed. Before our tournament game against Maryland we had exclusive use of the arena.

IMO there's about a 95% chance this is another Valpo Athletic Department F-up. I know there are people who post anonymously on this board who work in the Athletic Department. If you don't have the gumption to defend your employer and refute this notion, my suspicion will become 100%.

If this is a "Valpo thing," someone's head needs to roll. But, of course it won't because that would be admitting guilt and accepting responsibility,
and if we learned anything from the Jubril situation, never ever do that.

Did anyone hear Todd's interview with Luke Gore after the game? Luke talked quite a bit about not getting to practice at the arena, but I missed the part why he said it was an issue.  I did hear him say it was the right thing to do under the circumstances.

An absolute crime that Valpo didn't get to practice at JLA before the game.  Lottich and Gore have good reason to be upset.  What a farce!