NCAA College Basketball Talk

[IrishDawg]

Apparently this isn't over yet: https://www.freep.com/story/sports/2018/06/06/mikd-davis-detroit-mercy-indiana-texas-southern/677493002/

[VUGrad1314]

What a kick in the gut to UDM and the HL if they can't close this. A former P5 coach would rather dominate the SWAC than try to rebuild a program in the HL.It really is sad how far the HL has fallen.

[IrishDawg]

What a kick in the gut to UDM and the HL if they can't close this. A former P5 coach would rather dominate the SWAC than try to rebuild a program in the HL.It really is sad how far the HL has fallen.

I don't think this single situation is reflective of the league itself.  Detroit's been horrendous the last 2 seasons under Alexander, they basically have nothing in terms of roster, and is located in an area of the country in which Mike Davis hasn't been in the last 10+ years.  If the salaries are essentially equal and you know that you'll have a better chance of going to the tournament in your current situation in which you're already familiar, that's a hard sell to make to anyone.

In terms of the league as a whole falling off a cliff, yes, it has been drastic, but it was set in motion before the last couple of years where they were the 20th and 24th rated conference on kenpom.  Valpo was smart/fortunate to get out when they did.

[VUGrad1314]

What a kick in the gut to UDM and the HL if they can't close this. A former P5 coach would rather dominate the SWAC than try to rebuild a program in the HL.It really is sad how far the HL has fallen.

I don't think this single situation is reflective of the league itself.  Detroit's been horrendous the last 2 seasons under Alexander, they basically have nothing in terms of roster, and is located in an area of the country in which Mike Davis hasn't been in the last 10+ years.  If the salaries are essentially equal and you know that you'll have a better chance of going to the tournament in your current situation in which you're already familiar, that's a hard sell to make to anyone. In terms of the league as a whole falling off a cliff, yes, it has been drastic, but it was set in motion before the last couple of years where they were the 20th and 24th rated conference on kenpom.  Valpo was smart/fortunate to get out when they did.

I hope that Valpo is smart enough to point this out against the HL's claim that Valpo caused great damage to the league. It was already trending the wrong way and heading for permanent low major status. Even with Valpo it struggled to maintain status within the top 15-20 in both RPI and KenPom. Case in point, Valpo couldn't have irreparably damaged that which was already irreparably damaged.

[valpo64]

I just heard last night that the Horizon League has moved it's offices to South Dakota.   Bad new for some members I would think.

[VUGrad1314]

If true, they're going to try to raid the Summit League and\or the WAC and want a central base of operations.. New wave of realignment coming up. It shouldn't affect Valpo but it may affect the MVC. It'll be interesting to see how much the HL stretches its footprint and whether the Summit or WAC survive this. The HL could build a much stronger but much less stable league from this if it's true.

[VU2014]

Where did you hear the HL moved to SD? I'm pretty sure they're still in Indy.

[vu72]

I just heard last night that the Horizon League has moved it's offices to South Dakota.   Bad new for some members I would think.

I doubt it.  Have you been to South Dakota??   

[vusupporter]

The Summit League is moving, not the Horizon League.

[VUGrad1314]

That makes much more sense. I really do think it's with an eye toward further westward expansion. I've long thought a Summit-WAC merger with some pruning around the edges of both conferences was possible.

[crusadermoe]

Certainly true of UMKC, which really near to Omaha/S. Dak schools.   Makes a ton of sense.  Where was the Summit office before this alleged move?

Is Grand Canyon in the WAC?   They might be driving some of this. 

[VUGrad1314]

Summit League office used to be in the Chicago area (Elmhurst I believe) and yes Grand Canyon is indeed in the WAC. If the two conferences were to link up  a conference that could put together a top 4 of  South Dakota State  New Mexico State  GCU and Utah Valley would be pretty strong and could provide a viable alternative for BYU should Gonzaga ever decide to join the MWC. At which point I wouldn't be terribly surprised to see the discussion of moving the offices even further west (Colorado Springs? Salt Lake City?) open up.

[VUGrad1314]

Detroit's hiring of Mike Davis is official.

https://twitter.com/detroittitans

[VUGrad1314]

How does Western Kentucky land five star recruits over UCLA Kansas Cal and Wake Forest?

http://www.zagsblog.com/2018/06/13/charles-bassey-to-western-kentucky-already-on-campus/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=charles-bassey-to-western-kentucky-already-on-campus

[VU2014]

How does Western Kentucky land five star recruits over UCLA Kansas Cal and Wake Forest?

http://www.zagsblog.com/2018/06/13/charles-bassey-to-western-kentucky-already-on-campus/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=charles-bassey-to-western-kentucky-already-on-campus

Jeff Goodman summed it up well. $tansbury

https://twitter.com/GoodmanESPN/status/1007016713311879175

[VUGrad1314]

First they lose their coach to Ole Miss now this. Tough times may be ahead for the Blue Raiders.

https://www.dnj.com/story/sports/college/mtsu/2018/06/15/mtsu-mens-basketball-johnson-dixon-thomas-transferring/706533002/

[VUGrad1314]

Mike Davis has an imteresting and I believe solid scheduling strategy which he outlines in the link below:

https://soundcloud.com/sports1430/new-detroit-mercy-basketball-coach-mike-davis

Summary: Home games are nice but tough road games are what really prepare you for conference play. You should seek out the toughest games you can home or away especially in one bid leagues like to HL.

Our situation is slightly different here in the MVC where at large bids still appear possible, so I would add more nuance to the statement by saying that we should seek out the toughest possible winnable games but the core of the statement that a team should go on the road more if it makes their overall schedule stronger rings true to me.

I also liked his idea about recruiting a bit above your level if you can. From Valpo's perspective I think we have done and are doing a great job of this.

Overall a very enjoyable listen but I'm not sure why the interviewer kind of throws Davis under the bus at the end.

[VU2014]

It's not a bad strategy to take when you know your firmly in a one bid league. It preps the team for tough competition and taking all those buy games pays for the all the coaching salaries before the conference season even starts. I was wondering if that was a what the contract hold up was with Detroit. Apparently Detroit was offering $300,000, but he wanted to make closer to what Bakari Alexander made at 450k. My guess is that Davis wanted a cut of all the buy game revenue he'd be bringing in.

Everyone tries to recruit above their level to a certain degree. Valpo achieved that most years in the Horizon League, but other schools like Cleveland State under Gary Waters did as well but it didn't work out for them. If you look at Valpo's 2019 recruiting offers, you could make the case we are aiming high with Brendan Newman, Alex Hemenway and Quincy Guerrier. We should try and add at least one potential impact guy per class and in the years where we graduate a big senior class like after the (12-13), (16-17), and future (19-20) it will be critical to hit on recruiting.

[IrishDawg]

If the goal is simply to better prepare the team for conference play by playing teams that are much better than yours (on the road no less), then it's a good strategy, assuming you have the right guys in place who won't mentally fall apart after getting their brains beat in for the first half of the season.

Mike Davis was at Texas Southern for 6 years, and his teams won 13 games (12 against D1 opponents) before January 1st during that timeframe.  Last season he literally didn't win a game until New Year's Day.  Some tougher games to try and get an at large bid in the MVC (I think most years it will still be a one-bid league) is fine, but you definitely don't want to go to that extreme.

To win any league most years it certainly helps to recruit "above your level", but I think fit and being able to develop players within the system and school is extremely important at a smaller school in which you're going to generally rely on older guys to get you to where you want to go.

[bigmosmithfan1]

I think there's also a difference with Davis using that scheduling strategy at a SWAC school, where that buy-game revenue isn't just important for funding the basketball program, but helping to fund other athletic programs as well, vs. UDM, which as a private school should be a bit more financially stable (SWAC athletic depts. are typically many threads shy of even a shoestring budget).

I'm betting it's also a bit easier to pull off at Texas Southern because you could tell recruits about it up front and use those games as a selling point -- you're going to get to play a bunch of top programs and in famous arenas every year, and it's going to be hard and our non-conference record will be lousy, but it's going to mean we're ready for conference play in a league we tend to dominate, and you'll likely end up in the Dance as a result.

[IrishDawg]

Major changes in recruiting are coming quickly: https://collegebasketball.nbcsports.com/2018/06/22/major-rule-changes-expected-for-july-live-recruiting-period/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

[VUGrad1314]

According to this thread Northern Kentucky will begin a 4 year home and home series with Cincinnati in 2019.

http://horizonleaguefans.freeforums.net/thread/1114/hl-non-con-schedules?page=1&scrollTo=3545

[VUGrad1314]

Just shameful that teams like this will get the nod over deserving mids when their history shows that they deserve no such favor.

https://twitter.com/Fieldof68Freak/status/1014909262903103493

[EddieCabot]

According to this thread Northern Kentucky will begin a 4 year home and home series with Cincinnati in 2019.

http://horizonleaguefans.freeforums.net/thread/1114/hl-non-con-schedules?page=1&scrollTo=3545

I wonder if this series is tied to NKU allowing Cincinnati to use their arena last year?

[VUGrad1314]

According to this thread Northern Kentucky will begin a 4 year home and home series with Cincinnati in 2019.

http://horizonleaguefans.freeforums.net/thread/1114/hl-non-con-schedules?page=1&scrollTo=3545

I wonder if this series is tied to NKU allowing Cincinnati to use their arena last year?

It was. Still a great deal for them.