NCAA College Basketball Talk

[EddieCabot]

I believe only their wins are affected. Their losses stand.

Exactly. Valpo still earned their wins despite the opposition team cheating. Could you imagine how fast that rule would end due to high major teams objections if it were the rule that winning teams lost their wins when the losing team was caught cheating.

Great point.

[VUGrad1314]

Looks like things are about to get interesting on the realignment front:

BE signs extension  with MSG:

http://www.zagsblog.com/2018/12/09/big-east-msg-to-announce-extension-of-big-east-tournament/

BE Commissioner Val Ackerman on expsnsion:

https://twitter.com/John_Fanta/status/1071812606938243073?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1071812606938243073&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fcsnbbs.com%2Fthread-865850.html

https://twitter.com/John_Fanta/status/1071812795807744001?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1071812795807744001&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fcsnbbs.com%2Fthread-865850.html

AAC Considering GOR:

https://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2018/12/10/Colleges/AAC.aspx

[VUGrad1314]

Here's what I think all of this means: I think it all points to UCONN returning to the Big East very soon. Think about it.

The conference just reupped its tournament in Madison Square Garden in UCONN's backyard

The Commissioner of the Big East talked about how expansion could help the conference with scheduling but stressed the importance of retaining the double round robin

The very next day talk of the AAC attempting to convince its schools to sign a Grant of Rights to restrict movement leaks and under the terms of the agreement UCONN stands to receive secondary status in terms of revenue distribution. As the most recognizable basketball and  athletic brand in the conference except perhaps for Navy and the only state flagship school in the conference this has to be very insulting for them.

I can't see the AAC mending fences here. I think the Huskies are gone football issue or not.

[VUGrad1314]

More smoke that indicates fracturing in the AAC.

https://theathletic.com/706227/2018/12/11/big-12-expansion-ucf-football/

[VULB#62]

More smoke that indicates fracturing in the AAC.

https://theathletic.com/706227/2018/12/11/big-12-expansion-ucf-football/

The article also chides the Big-XII for not going to 11 schools when they had the chance.  Echos of the MVC not bringing the Racers on board with Valpo?

[talksalot]

South Dakota state just dropped 90 on Savannah state.   In the First Half !

[VULB#62]

What is unusual about that? Their body bag football contracts specify that Savannah State "shall allow a minumum of 40 points in each half."   

[crusaderjoe]

More smoke that indicates fracturing in the AAC.

https://theathletic.com/706227/2018/12/11/big-12-expansion-ucf-football/

The article also chides the Big-XII for not going to 11 schools when they had the chance.  Echos of the MVC not bringing the Racers on board with Valpo?

If the Big 12 maintains a nine game conference schedule, the addition of UCF means that the round robin becomes disrupted and someone isn't going to play Texas or Oklahoma every year anymore.

If I'm Iowa State, does that help or hurt?

[VUGrad1314]

Doesn't matter. Here's a big bucket of cold water on most major realignment.  If anything, this would STRENGTHEN the AAC as their top team could potentially be good enough to qualify under this alignment and the Big XII would likely hold together under this making the AAC signing the GOR more likely. They might even consider expanding to take the top of the MWC.

https://theathletic.com/708538/2018/12/ ... m-support/

[VUGrad1314]

Pay for play? what could this mean to us and schools like us and to our conference? Do you think that we or the MVC will be affected?

https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/lawsuit-has-conferences-quietly-preparing-for-the-likelihood-of-compensating-players/?irgwc=1

[IrishDawg]

Pay for play? what could this mean to us and schools like us and to our conference? Do you think that we or the MVC will be affected?

https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/lawsuit-has-conferences-quietly-preparing-for-the-likelihood-of-compensating-players/?irgwc=1

Not in a significant way. That's the beauty of having no scholarships for football. You only have to worry about paying 13 guys vs 98 (85 football and 13 basketball). Even for those leagues with football, like the MAC, this won't change the level of recruits they get.

[VUGrad1314]

Pay for play? what could this mean to us and schools like us and to our conference? Do you think that we or the MVC will be affected? https://www.cbssports.com/college-football/news/lawsuit-has-conferences-quietly-preparing-for-the-likelihood-of-compensating-players/?irgwc=1

Not in a significant way. That's the beauty of having no scholarships for football. You only have to worry about paying 13 guys vs 98 (85 football and 13 basketball). Even for those leagues with football, like the MAC, this won't change the level of recruits they get.

Even in basketball and other Olympic sports?

[vu72]

You only have to worry about paying 13 guys

Make that 26.  No way the guys get paid the the women don't.  Title 9.

[VUGrad1314]

I wonder if this means we'll have some new friends in the Pioneer League which in turn might open up some interesting opportunities for the MVC olympic sports realignment wise.

[IrishDawg]

You only have to worry about paying 13 guys

Make that 26.  No way the guys get paid the the women don't.  Title 9.

I'm not sure Title IX would apply here, given that they're talking about additional compensation beyond their scholarships that would then amount to them being employees of the University, and coaches of male teams generally are paid at a much higher rate than coaches of female teams.

[VUGrad1314]

Could this decision threaten the very existence of womens college sports? That would never fly nor should it. I hope the judge considers any potential Title IX ramifications very carefully before she rules. That could potentially undermine the whole case or open up a whole new series of lawsuits. This truly could be a Pandora's Box with unending consequences that could threaten the financial health of institutions and athletic programs. I don't know which side I should be rooting for.I understand the idea of compensating the athletes because of all the money they bring in but at the same time they're there to be students too and a debt free degree is pretty darn great compensation if you ask me. I really cannot conceive of what the world of college athletics will be like if this lawsuit is successful and that worries me a little bit. I guess one question I have is which system is more likely to help schools like Valpo competitive at the highest attainable levels in both mens and womens sports?

[IrishDawg]

Could this decision threaten the very existence of womens college sports? That would never fly nor should it. I hope the judge considers any potential Title IX ramifications very carefully before she rules. That could potentially undermine the whole case or open up a whole new series of lawsuits. This truly could be a Pandora's Box with unending consequences that could threaten the financial health of institutions and athletic programs. I don't know which side I should be rooting for.I understand the idea of compensating the athletes because of all the money they bring in but at the same time they're there to be students too and a debt free degree is pretty darn great compensation if you ask me. I really cannot conceive of what the world of college athletics will be like if this lawsuit is successful and that worries me a little bit. I guess one question I have is which system is more likely to help schools like Valpo competitive at the highest attainable levels in both mens and womens sports?

No.  This wouldn't threaten the existence of women's college sports.  Title IX would still apply in terms of giving an equal amount of women athletes the chance to compete for the school and receive scholarships to do so.  If anything, you'd see other men's olympic sports get cut that weren't financially viable so the University would remain in compliance with Title IX.

I wouldn't worry too much about how this will impact Valpo or the majority of other schools.  The biggest changes will be at the top of college sports in the power 5 programs.  What would be interesting to see is how coaches at big-time programs and universities would handle the new power dynamic in which the players were compensated.

[crusaderjoe]

Doesn't matter. Here's a big bucket of cold water on most major realignment.  If anything, this would STRENGTHEN the AAC as their top team could potentially be good enough to qualify under this alignment and the Big XII would likely hold together under this making the AAC signing the GOR more likely. They might even consider expanding to take the top of the MWC.

https://theathletic.com/708538/2018/12/ ... m-support/

The Big 12 will distribute about $35M per school this year.  Talk to me when the AAC achieves anything close. Until then, that's all the strength you need to know.

[VUGrad1314]

Things are beginning to get active again on the Realignment Front. Looks like Augustana (SD) is headed to D1 and  the Summit League. My suspicion is that they will either drop football or go non-scholarship and repurpose  the football monies into starting other sports to fill in some gaps for the SL. This could be a tacit admission that PFW is gone with Robert Morris possibly following (hence the Merrimack to the NEC announcement. I'm guessing that these teams are announcing their intention to leave quietly so that the conferences can get their house in order before it's scramble time. This could be LeCrone's big expansion move or it could be a response to another move from the MVC.


It will be interesting to see what Western Illinois does in response to this. They can't be too terribly happy about the conference becoming even more Dakota Centric. I expect that they might strike up discussions with the OVC where they would fit much better with  EIU SEMO SIUE UT-Martin and Murray State if they stay. Assuming no other movement it would give the OVC a 13\10 split which they can make 14\10 by adding Lipscomb. I'm not sure how Belmont would react to this but it's important to note that the two schools did share a conference for nine years in the Atlanric Sun from 2003-2012 and play an annual in-season home and home. They may be even more attractive now given their recent success on the basketball court.

This could be really concerning for the MVC's pursuit of Murray State because adding a close competitive football team and another rising basketball program might just be enough to placate the Racers and give them renewed optimism concerning their lot in the OVC. Furthermore, WIU leaving for the OVC eliminates the need for the MVFC to balance out the North Dakota addition unless Robert Morris also joins AFTER WIU leaves which they may but it's far from a guarantee.

http://espn991.com/augustana-university-to-make-the-jump-to-division-i/

https://www.argusleader.com/story/sports/college/augustana-university/2018/12/13/augustana-university-vikings-d-1-division-sioux-falls-college-sports/2307262002/

https://twitter.com/DBrownMidcoSN/status/1073387966247174144?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed&ref_url=http%3A%2F%2Fusdcoyotesports.proboards.com%2Fthread%2F2163%2Fsummit-league-expansion%3Fpage%3D21

[VULB#62]

The PFL Fan Board has been speculating about Augustana for some time. They are a very good D-II fb program with a great stadium and support facilities. Going non-scholarship should not be a recruiting handicap for them. Theywould make an immediate impact in the PFL.

[valpo84]

A take on this from a few years ago:

https://www.bloggersodear.com/2011/9/21/2439658/ncaa-boiling-point-our-conference-on-the-left-is-now-our-conference

[VUGrad1314]

A bit dated but potentially relevant as it concerns a midwestern school:

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/michigan/2018/03/20/emu-cut-4-varsity-sports-after-spring/440968002/

[VU2014]

A bit dated but potentially relevant as it concerns a midwestern school:

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/michigan/2018/03/20/emu-cut-4-varsity-sports-after-spring/440968002/

Really unfortunate news. SIU made some significant cuts to their athletics programs recently. Valpo has 19 sports teams and 21 if you count Cheerleading and the Crusaderettes. I've been wondering if it's sustainable financially over the long-term. The only program that VU probably sees a financial return on is maybe the men's basketball program and football team because it's non-scholarship. It's a 9-10 split between men's and women's sports. Valparaiso is a very unique small private institution that offers so many different sports.

[VUGrad1314]

Anybody think it's possible they could leave the MAC? And if so where could they go?

Here's some speculation from me:

If it happens I'm sure they'd go to the HL and their football team if it still exists would probably go to the MVFC or Pioneer League. Could a trade of YSU and Eastern Michigan make sense? I can't imagine the conference wanting ANOTHER Ohio school and I can't imagine EMU being too thrilled about giving up the main branding edge they have over UDM and Oakland .

Other candidates could be UMASS  EKU Illinois State UNI and Missouri State but I can't see any of them making the jump due to the finances and increased travel involved. UCONN could be a football fit if they go to the BE but then they'd need a  basketball member. I can't see anyone in the MVC making that jump. Maybe a HL team like UIC or Milwaukee?

[VUGrad1314]

Great article on scheduling from Winthrop's perspective. Should we outside the top seven conferences be playing non D1s? Do we have a choice? Yes but we all need to work together.  A series against Winthrop  wouldn't be a bad series by the way.

https://www.heraldonline.com/sports/college/big-south/winthrop-university/article222906070.html