Enrollment numbers

[valpopal]

You're incensed and out for blood.

As I did to a previous post by you, for the sake of comity, I will proceed again under the assumption your account has been hacked by someone with ill intent. 

[wh]

You're incensed and out for blood.

As I did to a previous post by you, for the sake of comity, I will proceed again under the assumption your account has been hacked by someone with ill intent. 

Don't underestimate the enemy you've created. No one wants to be remembered as being at the wheel when the ship goes down.

[VU2022]

Valpopal, I'm not sure that I agree with the argument put forth above. If there isn't such a commotion over the art sale, perhaps construction does begin this spring instead of in 2024. It feels slightly like an unfair comparison to make, as people who have opposed the art sale have dragged their feet, slowing down the process for the university, and then pointed their finger at the university for the process being slow.... A more just criticism as you pointed out might be on Padilla for at least attempting some sort of alternative methods or being transparent and putting out statements like "we need x amount of money by this deadline or we will have to resort to downsizing the brauer collection for those funding as we need it immediately." However, I would counter that by saying that we need new dorms ASAP and funding takes time, and there are other projects that valpo needs like a new nursing building that donors will need to fund. At the end of the day, there just isn't enough donor funds for everything the university desperately needs tomorrow, hence the art sale. 

[David81]

And yes, this also ties back to the art sale. The President and the board made a hard choice that is consistent with core mission of the university...sell the art, fund infrastructure improvements to attract new students. A hard decision, but a necessary decision. The people who oppose the art sale offer no better solution...but are very happy to put the difficulty of finding a solution on the President and others, have no problem with it taking years for improvements to be competitive on infrastructure. They do not care about keeping the engine that drives revenue and margin going.

First, yes it is the job of the President and the Board to find funding solutions that preferably are deemed ethical, legal, and a benefit by all, and everyone supports this. However, let's put to bed the idea that no alternative solutions were posed by opponents of the art sale. When presented with possible alternatives by faculty in their meeting with him this semester, Padilla refused to engage in dialogue or consider options offered that did not include immediate funding by the end of spring semester so that renovation construction could begin in summer 2023.


He even objected to a possible idea floated of a short-term targeted fundraiser for $10 million. With the recent publicity and the desire by many alums and donors to keep intact the crowns of the museum collection, this could be feasible. (Indeed, had Padilla sought faculty input from the beginning of his plan last year, perhaps the short-term solution actually could have included enough funding by the end of this spring to begin renovations.) Instead, "I need the money now," he has stated. Nevertheless, lo and behold, if the art sale occurs, VU's representatives today declare the earliest it could happen would be the end of this year, which apparently would mean renovation starting in summer 2024. Padilla's timeline restriction and reason for not listening to suggested alternative paths has become invalid.

I understood your argument the first time you made it, and every time since. The only thing you have helped clarify along the way is your and your fellow faculty members' real problem - loss of power and control that you've lorded over the place in the name of "academic freedom." You're incensed and out for blood. President Padilla has become Padilla and the board you used to control has finally awakened to its true fiduciary responsibility to lead from ahead, not from behind.

wh, I know you have a lot of hostility towards faculty, but your reference to "loss of power and control that you've lorded over the place in the name of 'academic freedom'" sounds like a talk radio rant, as opposed to being an accurate description of a university faculty that has never been regarded as overly demanding or entitled. And as for the faculty controlling the board.....yikes, are you sure you're talking about the same university that pays full-time, tenure-track faculty $48-50k to start?

I mean, really, scolding someone here for writing "Padilla" instead of "President Padilla"? Heh, I'm guessing that you didn't always refer to "President Heckler." 

[valpopal]

Valpopal, I'm not sure that I agree with the argument put forth above. If there isn't such a commotion over the art sale, perhaps construction does begin this spring instead of in 2024. It feels slightly like an unfair comparison to make, as people who have opposed the art sale have dragged their feet, slowing down the process for the university, and then pointed their finger at the university for the process being slow....

I appreciate and fully understand this line of thinking, 2022; however, it raises a curious question. Pres. Padilla is not naive and he is not ignorant, especially about the history of restrictions in deaccessioning guidelines, which he enforced as General Counsel at DePaul, and his knowledge of unfortunate precedents in similar scenarios at other museums. So why did he not realize that the art sale proposal would be vigorously opposed by the new museum director, the namesake of the museum, the museum properties committee, the patrons of the museum, the art donors, the faculty, members of the law community, the national museum associations, VU students, art publications, the news media, and others?


Padilla couldn't keep this secret forever, and I predicted the sale would at least be delayed the minute the plan was uncovered and revealed. He should have known a schedule that completed the sale and attained funds by spring was obviously unrealistic amid such expected resistance, as has been seen elsewhere. Therefore, knowing the spring goal was tentative at best, he should have been more receptive to the idea of possible alternatives. Maybe with the spring deadline almost here and the art sale months away at a minimum, he and the Board will now consider exploring further options, some compromise that will supply support for renovation of the dorms without diminishment of the museum's prestige. I am still hopeful of such an outcome that could be a win for all.     

[vu84v2]

valpopal - what you are suggesting is not a compromise regarding the art sale. The people opposed to the art sale give nothing in what you are stating....it is simply "we get what we want and President Padilla must find a way to move the university forward...but, of course, we must approve of how the university moved forward."

You and I strongly disagree on the art sale, but you seem like a smart and rationale person who cares about Valpo. So, let me pose a question to you. Why would a potential donor donate for the dorms (or any infrastructure) if the university intentionally chooses to not sell an asset that is not core the university's mission? If you think about it from the perspective of a potential donor who feels the art should be sold, you are effectively asking them to donate money to preserve the art. Over the years, we have made donations for a variety of things at Valpo - including infrastructure. But we never knew the university held highly valuable art (and our friends and the two of us are pretty close to Valpo). I and others will now clearly question donating for anything other than specific programs unless the art is sold.

[valpopal]

You and I strongly disagree on the art sale, but you seem like a smart and rationale person who cares about Valpo. So, let me pose a question to you. Why would a potential donor donate for the dorms (or any infrastructure) if the university intentionally chooses to not sell an asset that is core the university's mission? If you think about it from the perspective of a potential donor who feels the art should be sold, you are effectively asking them to donate money to preserve the art. Over the years, we have made donations for a variety of things at Valpo - including infrastructure. But we never knew the university held highly valuable art (and our friends and the two of us are pretty close to Valpo). I and others will now clearly question donating for anything other than specific programs unless the art is sold.

Thanks for the complimentary language. In response to your question, a person would want to donate for dorm renovations if it enhances the university experience as Pres. Padilla suggests it would. It would be a targeted donation, perhaps just like donating for a coaching change, that has no connection to the art museum. In addition, donating for the dorm renovations could be thought as a way of assuring the university museum's prestige and integrity are preserved, another enhancement about which the university boasts and which would appeal to some donors. Even among those with whom I have spoken who would consider supporting the art sale if necessary, none has expressed a desire to lose the crown jewel paintings at the museum. Even if I thought it was ethical, I don't understand why anyone would want to get rid of these prized pieces and diminish the museum (and by extension, the university) if another solution works. Finally, if you are concerned about donors, think also of those who donated the artwork or who might think of donating artwork in the future, and who feel the sale would be a betrayal that shows the university cannot be trusted.     

[valpo tundra]

The History Department numbers presented are skewed because of the present faculty situation. One veteran professor just retired with the buyout, another longtimer has been on sabbatical, yet another is teaching overseas, and the department hired two brand new professors less than two years ago.

[vu84v2]

valpopal - Thank you for the thoughtful response. Again, we strongly disagree about the art - but I do appreciate your perspective.

A few things to consider:
-The "problem" for Valpo is not how to get $10M for the dorms. The problem is getting $50M+ for the dorms, nursing building and other necessary infrastructure improvements. Thus, it is a fallacy to say "we found a way to raise $10M and thus it is an alternative solution to selling the art."
-(a point that I have previously raised) Look at the issue in a different way. Assume Valpo has $8M and needs to make a choice how to spend the money, and assume that Valpo does not currently own the art (but has an opportunity to buy the art). It is faced with two options: use the money to finance infrastructure needs or use the money to buy the art. Which option, based on the university's current situation, should the university pursue?

[NotBryceDrew]

Ok it's May 1st need some good news

[valpopal]

valpopal - Thank you for the thoughtful response. Again, we strongly disagree about the art - but I do appreciate your perspective.

A few things to consider:
-The "problem" for Valpo is not how to get $10M for the dorms. The problem is getting $50M+ for the dorms, nursing building and other necessary infrastructure improvements. Thus, it is a fallacy to say "we found a way to raise $10M and thus it is an alternative solution to selling the art."
-(a point that I have previously raised) Look at the issue in a different way. Assume Valpo has $8M and needs to make a choice how to spend the money, and assume that Valpo does not currently own the art (but has an opportunity to buy the art). It is faced with two options: use the money to finance infrastructure needs or use the money to buy the art. Which option, based on the university's current situation, should the university pursue?

As to the first point, would you also say that it is a fallacy when money is found to fund other projects—athletics, chapel improvements, engineering equipment—through alternative solutions to selling art? The real fallacy that has been introduced surrounding this ongoing discussion is that there is a binary decision: art or dorms.


The second point is based upon a misconception. The university does not purchase art. The art—including those the university wants to sell— has been bought through private funds donated by individuals or a group of patrons known as Friends of Art for exhibit at the university museum, which is the crux of the claim of an unethical sale. If you read the citation notes accompanying artworks at the museum or online, the donors who purchased the art for the museum are specifically recognized for each. I just clicked on all 39 permanent collection works available at the following link. Not one was bought with unspecified university funds. You can click on the arts displayed at the following page and check for yourself: https://www.valpo.edu/brauer-museum-of-art/collection/

[crusadermoe]

Is the Art Museum separately incorporated as a non-profit apart from the university?  This seems really complicated. That seems like the crux of the legal issue.

[crusadermoe]

This thread needs to get back on track.  The topic is enrollment count.  Today is the milestone day of May 1 so in a few days the estiamtes for 2023-2024 should start to sharped a bit. I can't remember why May 1 is a milestone but some on the board has said so.

[78crusader]

I was reminded of something a couple days ago while reading yet another post about the art sale.

I was a member of the VU Alumni Board in the early 1990s. I knew even less then than I do now, which is saying something. But one night I got to sit next to President Harre at dinner. He had been president for maybe 3-4 years but was already feeling pressure to replace inadequate facilities.

President Harre (I admit I am a big fan, I think next to OP our best president) talked about the need/desire for a new library and a new union (the ARC was less than 10 years old at the time but even then there were murmurs of discontent).  He acknowledged the library and union clearly needed to be replaced - but his top priority was a new art/music facility. His rationale: it was best for the university.

He made this happen and the building came to pass in, I think, 1993 - complete with an art museum that allowed folks to see and appreciate the university's substantial art collection.

It would be another 10 years for the library to come on line and 6 more years after that for the new union to open its doors. Think about what a tough decision that had to be for President Harre and the BOD.

Of course, we are still waiting for a new sports facility.

Maybe this little story doesn't mean anything, especially to those who strongly oppose the art sale. But to me it means the university supported the arts at a difficult time, even though it meant making a sacrifice by waiting many more years for other, badly-needed facilities to get built. Perhaps now it is time for those opposed to the art sale to make a similar sacrifice for the good of the university.

For those who think the current and, in today's culture anyway, inevitable legal struggle playing out in the courts will certainly be over in the coming year, a word of caution. I haven't followed this at all, but after the hearing the court will have to prepare a written decision. That could take months for the  judge assigned to the case.  After that there could be an appeal. If that happens, tack on at least 1 more year and probably two.

Paul

[crusader05]

I have heard that the May 1st decision day isn't as big as it once was but still matters because there are some more elite universities who wait pretty late in the year to send out all their official acceptance/rejection letters. I think it might have something to do with locking in potential scholarship money but I'm not sure if that's true.

I also read an article, I can't remember where, that talked about the increased tendency for students to put down multiple deposits to hold aid and then not make their final decision until the summer. It means a whole lot more recruitment probably needs to continue for students up to the point they probably register for classes and then to make sure the actually show up in August

[vu84v2]

crusadermoe is correct. The first salient issue ultimately is who owns the art - and if the university owns the museum, then it owns the art. The second salient issue is whether there are terms that the university agreed to in writing that limit what can be done with the art. If you donate an asset to the university and have no contractually agreed terms for how that asset is used, then it is at the university's discretion what to do with the asset. 78crusader is also probably right that this could take a long time in the courts.

For enrollment decisions, May 1 is "a" big day - but in today's world June 1 is also a big day. It really comes down to commitment via deposits and then paying for the first semester.

[valpopal]

crusadermoe is correct. The first salient issue ultimately is who owns the art - and if the university owns the museum, then it owns the art. The second salient issue is whether there are terms that the university agreed to in writing that limit what can be done with the art. If you donate an asset to the university and have no contractually agreed terms for how that asset is used, then it is at the university's discretion what to do with the asset. 78crusader is also probably right that this could take a long time in the courts.

Excellent summary, VU84v2, which reveals exactly where this situation stands. As I have conceded all along, Pres. Padilla's strategy to thwart academic ethical objections to the art sale was to bring a legal argument into play, which the university lawyers could most likely win on technical matters since past donors could not imagine the university violating their trust and using the art as revenue for dorm renovations, so almost assuredly did not have airtight restrictive language to prevent it. Padilla told this to the faculty at their meeting with him.


However, as 78crusader correctly indicates, the sticking point now ironically arises that a most vehement opponent of the art sale is a major university donor who also happens to be a former VU law professor. He basically said I will see your legal argument and raise it with my own that includes the state Attorney General as a defendant. This suit could thwart the university's legal action merely by its own legal tactic possibly causing an intolerably lengthy delay in any decision. A further irony is that the delay could be increased a little more by the presiding judge having to recuse himself because he is a VU law grad.   

[FWalum]

It would be another 10 years for the library to come on line and 6 more years after that for the new union to open its doors. Think about what a tough decision that had to be for President Harre and the BOD.

Many have donated to VU over the years. 78crusader's post got me thinking about the Moellering family, whom I know, and the large donation they gave in 1956. Here is what O.P. said about their gift.

The finest gift has come from Mrs. Henry F. Moellering of Fort Wayne, Indiana, who gave us $375,000 for the building of the Henry F. Moellering Memorial Library. I must say that this particular gift was the most moving and inspiring in our entire Lutheran history. The Moellering family has always been very close to the University, and this expression of confidence in our future meant even more to us than the intrinsic value of the gift and its importance for our academic development.

Moellering Library was less than 50 years old when it was razed. I will have to ask Michael how he felt when the building named after his Grandfather was bulldozed.

[usc4valpo]

Will keeping the art bring in students, or will upgrading dorms?

The school needs students and the school really needs cash - now.

[crusader05]

The idea that anyone who has worked on the campus in the last few years doesn't have any idea of where we are is baffling. This message board seems to understand the situation pretty well.

Also, you bring someone in at night because you're trying to figure out if it's even worth it to pursue while doing your due diligence. I think they knew this would be a tough decision which is why they wanted all their ducks in a row before they even made it: ie board approve, finding out how much renovations would cost, how much the paintings could get, etc etc. The idea that tough/unpopular decisions could have been done without blow back is wishful thinking. The reality is this would not have gone well if they had told people they were brining them in ahead of time because they protest to the sale of art in general.

[crusader05]

Is there outward messages that everything is hunky dory though? A big part of what Padilla said when he came on campus was he was here to help Valpo get on it's feet. His whol "not here to oversee a wake" comment. Heckler was known for blowing smoke but it seems like Padilla hasn't been hiding from the fact that things are tough. A lot of articles about the university talked about demographic cliff and declining enrollment. To expect me to believe that a large portion of faculty and staff have no clue what is going on seems a stretch. I've been a company going through a tough time, even if your department didn't face cuts you know about other departments. It's hard to miss.

[NotBryceDrew]

This is the Enrollment Numbers thread.

[wh]

Based on a cursory look at annual headcounts over the past 10 years, budget deficits, debt load, etc., I think there is a strong case to be made that Valpo is in far more serious financial jeopardy than public perception would have us believe. After 4 consecutive years above 4000 students (excluding law), present enrollment has nosedived to 2950, a decline of nearly 30%. At this point, Valpo would need to increase enrollment by 800 to even balance an annual budget, not to mention start paying down debt, investing in new facilities, etc. Then consider that it's too soon to know whether enrollment decline has bottomed out. It could actually get worse. What reason is there to think otherwise? Where are the new attractive facilities and creature comforts that will turn some eyes? How about new, cutting edge, high value-add programs to promote? Or, expansive on-line learning options at reduced prices? You can't market a "new Valpo," when everything inside the pamphlet is the "old Valpo."

I don't envision a ghost town future of empty buildings with a faded Valpo sign identifying what once was, but I do envision different ownership. Mergers, acquisitions, consolidations, bankruptcies, etc. are all necessary for economic growth. It happened to automotive, banking, manufacturing, retail, healthcare, and myriad other verticals. It is going to happen to education.

[crusadermoe]

Who actually owns the university and who would receive its sale proceeds?  Just saying out loud the implication WH is raising.

[valpopal]

Anything can happen in enrollment during the next few months; however, when considering total number of students—combining all colleges, undergraduate and graduate, freshmen and transfers—my best guess is that we should not expect any appreciable difference from last year when fall semester rolls around.