MVC Hoops: 2017-18

[valpo95]

I wonder how many teams who finished in the bottom half of their league yet earned an at large bid have made the elite 8, final four, been a champion.

I don't know the complete answer to that. The one example that might fit best UCONN in 2010-11, who finished 9-9 in the Big East regular season, won the Big East tournament, and won the national championship. Still, they would have been eligible under the criteria I outlined above.

[vu72]

So with one game left I thought I would take a look at the predicted finish of teams versus the current status.

Predicted versus Current:

1. Missouri State       1. Loyola

2. UNI                      2. SIU

3. Loyola                  3. Illinois State

4. Illinois State         4. Drake

5. SIU                      5. Bradley

6. Valpo                   6. Missouri State

7. Bradley                7. Indiana State

8. Indiana State       8. Evansville

9. Evansville            9. UNI

10. Drake                10. Valpo

So the best performer is clearly Drake and my guess is Medved will be COY.  The worst performer is UNI followed by Missouri State and then Valpo.  My guess is Lusk is gone, Jacobsen is safe just because he is Jacobsen and Simmons should be gone but he did slightly better than predicted so may survive but the Aces fans are restless.

[VU2014]

The eye test says Loyola is a tourney team but in this current era we're in, they'll be snubbed. Yes the MVC is better (the league is much deeper) this season but I don't think they'll be able to make it as a at-large. I hope I'm wrong. I'm hoping Loyola loses in the finals, so we could see what the Committee would do.

https://twitter.com/FanSided/status/966662648103342080

[VUGrad1314]

We are getting absolutely trashed on MVCFans right now. Fans are pining after Murray State and wishing they were added instead of us. They think the MVC has buyer's remorse right now. We deserve some criticism but some of this feels like too much.

[SanityLost17]

The last place team in the MVC has an RPI under 190.    A simple thank you would suffice.   You are welcome MVC, you got 2 very winnable games against a team that was not an RPI drag.   

[vu72]

We are getting absolutely trashed on MVCFans right now. Fans are pining after Murray State and wishing they were added instead of us. They think the MVC has buyer's remorse right now. We deserve some criticism but some of this feels like too much.

I imagine the same thing happened the first year Loyola was in the Valley but instead of Murray State they were pining for us!!  We'll be on top quicker then Loyola.  Then we'll see...

[VU2014]

We are getting absolutely trashed on MVCFans right now. Fans are pining after Murray State and wishing they were added instead of us. They think the MVC has buyer's remorse right now. We deserve some criticism but some of this feels like too much.

There are some intelligent people on the MVCFans board and there are also some very lazy hot take people on there. Loyola was getting trashed for literally 5 years till the beginning of this season. There will be skeptics till we finish near the top. It's just the way it's going to go. We aren't great this season but we aren't a drag on the Conference either. It's not like we're getting completely run out of the gym other then that ISUr game and the MSU game early in conference play. It is what it is. We'll have our chance to silence critics the next few seasons.

[FieldGoodie05]

We are getting absolutely trashed on MVCFans right now. Fans are pining after Murray State and wishing they were added instead of us. They think the MVC has buyer's remorse right now. We deserve some criticism but some of this feels like too much.

I enjoy your posts, but who cares what ppl think about VU based on one season.  That's mighty short sighted of them.

We sucked ___ this year.  Based on a sample size of nearly 1 season, can we argue?  Sure, we can argue for a larger sample size.....that's about it though.

[VUGrad1314]

I have to admit this is personal to me. I grew up here I was educated here all the way through graduate school. I don't see myself ever leaving here.  Seeing this town and this school do well is a huge part of my identity. I love Valpo. I want others to love and respect Valpo as much as I do. I'm a vocal person and I vociferously defend the people and things I love. Admittedly it was a lazy take from that UNI fan and I feel like I got a good factual rebuttal in and even brought up some information about his program and their performance the past couple years that I'm sure he's not proud of. They've really stunk since they lost in the 2016 tournament yet it seems so many in that fanbase still strut around like none of that has happened and they're still dominating. 

[talksalot]

There will be skeptics till we finish near the top.

...This league will never amount to anything as long as Valpo is in it...

That's a quote from the head coach... at Cleveland State following their departure from the AMCU to the Mid-Western Cities League...

Always fun to think back on THAT comment.

[VUGrad1314]

Interestingly I wouldn't be surprised if a team like NKU were to say that about Cleveland State these days when the Norse leave for a better conference

[FieldGoodie05]

I have to admit this is personal to me. I grew up here I was educated here all the way through graduate school. I don't see myself ever leaving here.  Seeing this town and this school do well is a huge part of my identity. I love Valpo. I want others to love and respect Valpo as much as I do. I'm a vocal person and I vociferously defend the people and things I love. Admittedly it was a lazy take from that UNI fan and I feel like I got a good factual rebuttal in and even brought up some information about his program and their performance the past couple years that I'm sure he's not proud of. They've really stunk since they lost in the 2016 tournament yet it seems so many in that fanbase still strut around like none of that has happened and they're still dominating.

I appreciate your passion, keep it up!

[a3uge]

Having your last place team lose only 4 non conference games is a blessing for the entire league. Usually the last team in a mid major conference is a big RPI drag. Do MVC fans really want the entire league to be 8-8? Not sure why they'd be complaining about that.

[justducky]

The eye test says Loyola is a tourney team but in this current era we're in, they'll be snubbed.

Loyola (32 RPI) at home today against ISU-red. They still sit with only 5 losses. Boise St now has 6.

I do not think Loyola will win at St. Louis so this could get interesting.

[oklahomamick]

Would be awesome to see 2 mvc bids.  That's what we thought we were getting when joining the HL. During our 10 years did we ever experience multiple bids?

[bbtds]

I wonder how many teams who finished in the bottom half of their league yet earned an at large bid have made the elite 8, final four, been a champion.

UCLA did well that year many thought they should have been left out of the Big Dance. I'm thinking it was two years ago but maybe I'm wrong. That doesn't mean that the mid-major that would have replaced them would not have done just as well.

[VUGrad1314]

We are getting absolutely trashed on MVCFans right now. Fans are pining after Murray State and wishing they were added instead of us. They think the MVC has buyer's remorse right now. We deserve some criticism but some of this feels like too much.

We got a ton of support from other fanbases. It was great to see. I didn't see a single post agreeing with that UNI fan. Also for all the crap VU gets RE: athletic facilities, and all the praise I've seen UIC get, I encourage you all to read about the gameday experience the poster called "MissouriValleyUnite" had when he visited the Pavilion last night to take in NKU @UIC. It's amazing. And you thought our gameday experience was bad. Here's his post:


Went to NKU/UIC last night. First thing was parking. Short, but slow line. Once it got to my turn, it took a couple minutes. Cashier was using dimes to match singles because he was running out of change. Next step was walk-up's. Waited 15 minutes outside behind just 7 people until the line moved. Computers broke and no Plan B. Next order was finding my seat. I walked to my 200 section only for it to be roped off and the usher tell me "they're not supposed to be selling those seats". I was sold seats that were closed off! Then I went for food. Only 1 food stand open and there were 40+ people in line. Checked again in 2nd half, 30+ people in line. Checked again 2 minutes left, 10 people in line so I waited only for them to be out of the 2 things I wanted. Darkest arena. Scoreboard 80 ft behind basket. Rafters maze of thick dust. Still had fun (what D1 game isn't?!). Decent team (McClain's really improved the Flames since I watched them trail 43-10 @NKU 2 months ago). Good crowd. Great music (90s night). Excellent school. But of 19 venues I've attended this year, their gameday ops were an umitigated trainwreck.

[wh]

I wonder how many teams who finished in the bottom half of their league yet earned an at large bid have made the elite 8, final four, been a champion.

UCLA did well that year many thought they should have been left out of the Big Dance. I'm thinking it was two years ago but maybe I'm wrong. That doesn't mean that the mid-major that would have replaced them would not have done just as well.

Iowa 2004-05

"The Hawkeyes finished 21–12 with a 7–9 conference record in the 2004–05 regular season, but they won their first two Big Ten Tournament games against Purdue and Michigan State before losing the third game to Wisconsin, 59–56. They earned an at-large invitation to the 2005 NCAA Tournament as a #10 seed, where they lost 76–64 to Cincinnati in the first round. During the season, leading scorer Pierre Pierce was dismissed from the team amid charges of sexual abuse; Pierce ultimately served one year in prison."

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iowa_Hawkeyes_men%27s_basketball

[valpotx]

Depending on what the NCAA does regarding this FBI investigation, there may be many spots opened up for mid-majors this season.

[VU2014]

Depending on what the NCAA does regarding this FBI investigation, there may be many spots opened up for mid-majors this season.

They won't start looking to dealing out punishments till after April 2nd. They'll come out with whatever excuse they need to not get the powerhouses in the tourney.

[VU2014]

Loyola is in Seth Davis' top 25. I want to believe Loyola could make it as a at-large but my gut says no.
https://twitter.com/ValleyHoops/status/967970211197485056

[VUGrad1314]

Illinois State ending up 3rd hurt. It means they lost another chance at a top 100 win. The best path they can hope for resume wiseis Evansville\Bradley\ISUr or SIU. They need strong showings in the conference tournament from Wright State and Florida to make those wins look better and Milwaukee needs a decent showing to make that loss look better. They would also benefit from Boise State playing their way onto the right side of the bubble. I think they have to get to the finals lose close and get some help as I mentioned before.

[a3uge]

Illinois State ending up 3rd hurt. It means they lost another chance at a top 100 win. The best path they can hope for resume wiseis Evansville\Bradley\ISUr or SIU. They need strong showings in the conference tournament from Wright State and Florida to make those wins look better and Milwaukee needs a decent showing to make that loss look better. They would also benefit from Boise State playing their way onto the right side of the bubble. I think they have to get to the finals lose close and get some help as I mentioned before.

It's dumb. Say Valpo and Indiana State split their games vs each other and lost the rest. Overall conference RPI would be identical. Loyola's RPI would be unchanged. The only thing that would change is that Bradley becomes a "top 100" win for Loyola, and SIU and Illinois State become top 75 wins. Wins over Indiana State and Valpo go from 170/175 to 200+ RPI wins, which are perceived the same anyway.

It's almost more impressive that Loyola finished with only 3 conference losses without any easy 200+ RPI cupcakes on the schedule, but since the league played each other relatively equally, they don't get any of these "quadrant" wins.

The solution to RPI being a flawed metric isn't to use it in a more illogical way.

[VU2014]

Podcast with MVC Commish Doug Elgin.

https://twitter.com/pjstarsports/status/968223277196877824

[VU2014]

Podcast with MVC Commish Doug Elgin.

https://twitter.com/pjstarsports/status/968223277196877824

Some very interesting conversations conversation in here about Non-Conference scheduling. The commish pretty much explicitly says teams need to schedule better. Also puts an emphasis on the need to get in early season Tournaments. Remember we got screwed by the Great Alaskan Shootout being canceled.

He says no one can schedule bottom 100 programs: Chicago State, SIUE, UC Riverside...

I think the Conference should introduce scheduling standards and hold each other accountable. Including ourself. We weren't in a position to benefit from scheduling a really tough non-conf.

Also interesting to hear that fellow Valley schools have shied away from playing in CITs and CBIs in recent history. I wonder if we'd pay to be in one this season. Is it even worth it at this point? Maybe it's worth the extra practice time and it teaches them how to prep for a Tournament.

They also talk about MVC expansion.