Non-Conference games 2019-2020 season

[vu72]

This may be the Bourbon talking, (Angel's Envy)

Nice! 

[valpopal]

It's not much of a change from previous home non-conference schedules, to be honest.

If true, that is a damning statement about VU's pattern of home non-conference scheduling overall. Also, it negates the excuse that this season was different because of the buyouts. However, I see this non-con as worse than others in the past, not just because of the competition and low number of home games but as much due to the scheduling—no non-exhibition games on a Friday or Saturday (the exhibition at 5 p.m. on a Saturday in mid-October). Games played when students are off campus or on the eve of final exams after classes end. Plus, one of the D-1s scheduled on Sunday afternoon during NFL games. This schedule builds in all the excuses students use for not attending games. On the bright side, we won't have to debate much on the board this fall about a necessity for facility upgrades since fewer people will be attending games to notice the need!

[EddieCabot]

Season ticket prices should be cheaper this year. 3 non-con D1 home games + 9 MVC home games. Plus the non-D1. 12 total D1 home games. Would of been nice to get 1 non-con D1 Sat night game. Not possible I guess at last minute. Oh well. Best enjoy the 3 non-con D1's we got in Nov/Dec. [emoji17]

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

I haven't received my season ticket brochure yet, but Valpo has traditionally adjusted prices based on the number of home games scheduled.  Here's my SWAG on the prices for this year:

Courtside - $475
Chairback - $350
Bleacher - $150

[SanityLost17]

Sure... The home schedule sucks...  But the overall strength of the schedule is very solid, especially for a team with lots of new parts. 

[justducky]

As for Clay, his friends and family will get 2 regular season short drive trips to see him play and then the MVC tourney!   Too bad we couldn't have done the same for Alec Peters! If I remember correctly there are a couple of mid majors just a bit up and down the road from his home town! 

[FieldGoodie05]

Great Podcast with Coach Gore on Union Street Hoops!  Thanks for bringing us great topics and great guests Paul.

Solid insights on what goes into scheduling by the man responsible for scheduling.  Even gives us a look at 10 games for next years non-conference schedule.  Must listen.

[Valpo Joe]

Let's celebrate the fact that we finally have a schedule. Now let's get real. Valpo has a lot of makeup work to do in the next few years to gain the respect in NCAA Mens Basketball which it had not to many years ago. Once that happens perhaps the home schedule will look better. What do you expect when you don't deserve top notch Div 1 teams.

[FieldGoodie05]

Let's celebrate the fact that we finally have a schedule. Now let's get real. Valpo has a lot of makeup work to do in the next few years to gain the respect in NCAA Mens Basketball which it had not to many years ago. Once that happens perhaps the home schedule will look better. What do you expect when you don't deserve top notch Div 1 teams.

Can't disagree here.  Though I welcome the journey ahead.

[EddieCabot]

Great Podcast with Coach Gore on Union Street Hoops!  Thanks for bringing us great topics and great guests Paul.

Solid insights on what goes into scheduling by the man responsible for scheduling.  Even gives us a look at 10 games for next years non-conference schedule.  Must listen.

Totally agree.  Between this pod and PO's discussion with the AD, I feel like I have a much better understanding of the scheduling process and the challenges that go with it.  I'm also optimistic about next year's schedule based on what Coach Gore shared.

[M]

I've enjoyed this one too. I still have a few more minutes to go...but would like to hear Paul ask about getting games with former Horizon League foes.

[valpo95]

I've enjoyed this one too. I still have a few more minutes to go...but would like to hear Paul ask about getting games with former Horizon League foes.

Agreed. One would think a home and home with say Oakland and Wright State (one on the road and one home each year) would be in the best interest of all of the schools. These would be competitive games that would help teams get ready for the conference season, and be of interest to all fans.

[Pgmado]

I've enjoyed this one too. I still have a few more minutes to go...but would like to hear Paul ask about getting games with former Horizon League foes.

The best things come to those who wait.

[govalpogo]

I've enjoyed this one too. I still have a few more minutes to go...but would like to hear Paul ask about getting games with former Horizon League foes.

I've enjoyed this one too. I still have a few more minutes to go...but would like to hear Paul ask about getting games with former Horizon League foes.

Agreed. One would think a home and home with say Oakland and Wright State (one on the road and one home each year) would be in the best interest of all of the schools. These would be competitive games that would help teams get ready for the conference season, and be of interest to all fans.

In the interview, Does Gore not say without hesitation "We're going to play some horizon teams," then lists off UIC and Oakland immediately as teams on his list (and then most other HL teams as possibilities as well)?   

[VUGrad1314]

Glad to hear that we're able to put the nastiness of our departure from the HL behind us and do what is most beneficial to the flagship sport of both parties and play each other. For all of the badmouthing we do and however fortunate we are to be where we are now the HL still has teams we would benefit from playing and who would be a draw for fans due to the recency of the rivalry. I honestly think they're a better bet to draw fans than our old mid-con rivals like Western Illinois UMKC and Oral Roberts. Even if the numbers don't always bear it out, the HL has far more name cache and prestige with midwestern fans than does the SL and I believe that is because it has become such a  plains region league, no disrespect to the programs in the SL(especially NDSU and SDSU). For those who may object because of how bad some of the HL teams have been recently, wouldn't you rather--if we're going to play a bad team anyway--it be a team we have some history with rather than teams like SIUE or UC-Riverside?

[MarchArchPod]

Does anyone know how the pre-season tournament work with Valpo and Illinois State?

[EddieCabot]

Does anyone know how the pre-season tournament work with Valpo and Illinois State?

https://gobearcats.com/documents/2019/5/13//2019_paradise_jam_mens_brackets.pdf

[VALPO LI]

Glad to hear that we're able to put the nastiness of our departure from the HL behind us and do what is most beneficial to the flagship sport of both parties and play each other. For all of the badmouthing we do and however fortunate we are to be where we are now the HL still has teams we would benefit from playing and who would be a draw for fans due to the recency of the rivalry. I honestly think they're a better bet to draw fans than our old mid-con rivals like Western Illinois UMKC and Oral Roberts. Even if the numbers don't always bear it out, the HL has far more name cache and prestige with midwestern fans than does the SL and I believe that is because it has become such a  plains region league, no disrespect to the programs in the SL(especially NDSU and SDSU). For those who may object because of how bad some of the HL teams have been recently, wouldn't you rather--if we're going to play a bad team anyway--it be a team we have some history with rather than teams like SIUE or UC-Riverside?

While the Horizon was memorable and it would be fun to start a series with Oakland, I'm not sure filling our schedule with Horizon league games is beneficial.  I am ready to move on just like I moved on from the Mid Con.  I'll take games against a #9 ranked conference over a #22 ranked conference anyday.  The past is behind us, on to playing a conference with a ranked team like "Buffalo".  Btw...on our schedule are the top 3 teams from the MAC West.  And when it comes time to play rivals..... how about 10 games in the last 13 seasons with a 5/5 split "Ball State".  While the Horizon games had history and were fun to watch, I like the direction our program is going by writing a new chapter in our books with the MAC.

[VUGrad1314]

Glad to hear that we're able to put the nastiness of our departure from the HL behind us and do what is most beneficial to the flagship sport of both parties and play each other. For all of the badmouthing we do and however fortunate we are to be where we are now the HL still has teams we would benefit from playing and who would be a draw for fans due to the recency of the rivalry. I honestly think they're a better bet to draw fans than our old mid-con rivals like Western Illinois UMKC and Oral Roberts. Even if the numbers don't always bear it out, the HL has far more name cache and prestige with midwestern fans than does the SL and I believe that is because it has become such a  plains region league, no disrespect to the programs in the SL(especially NDSU and SDSU). For those who may object because of how bad some of the HL teams have been recently, wouldn't you rather--if we're going to play a bad team anyway--it be a team we have some history with rather than teams like SIUE or UC-Riverside?

While the Horizon was memorable and it would be fun to start a series with Oakland, I'm not sure filling our schedule with Horizon league games is beneficial.  I am ready to move on just like I moved on from the Mid Con.  I'll take games against a #9 ranked conference over a #22 ranked conference anyday.  The past is behind us, on to playing a conference with a ranked team like "Buffalo".  Btw...on our schedule are the top 3 teams from the MAC West.  And when it comes time to play rivals..... how about 10 games in the last 13 seasons with a 5/5 split "Ball State".  While the Horizon games had history and were fun to watch, I like the direction our program is going by writing a new chapter in our books with the MAC.

I don't mind that we're playing more MAC teams. I wanted to see more MAC teams on the schedule and I've said that repeatedly. I'm saying maybe play some HL teams instead of the non D1s or the North Dakotas or UC-Riversides or SIUE's of the world. They're equivalent or better games and more interesting to the fanbase. It would be a total win for the schedule and for attendance.

[nkvu]

For personal reasons I would love to see more games scheduled in Southwest Ohio/Northern KY. You have Dayton, Wright State, Xavier, Cincinnati, and Northern Ky all in an easy travel area. Yes I know X and UC will never play at Valpo. So arrange a buy game where we get payed to play X, UC or Dayton at their place and a home/home with Wright State and NKU. So one year we play Wright and X on the road. The next we play Wright at home and UC and NKU on the road.  Then the next we play NKU at home and X or Dayton and Wright St. on the road.  The program will make money on the buy games and we'll have decent D 1 opponents at home. Of course since this makes sense (at least to me ) it will never happen.

[FieldGoodie05]

Glad to hear that we're able to put the nastiness of our departure from the HL behind us and do what is most beneficial to the flagship sport of both parties and play each other. For all of the badmouthing we do and however fortunate we are to be where we are now the HL still has teams we would benefit from playing and who would be a draw for fans due to the recency of the rivalry. I honestly think they're a better bet to draw fans than our old mid-con rivals like Western Illinois UMKC and Oral Roberts. Even if the numbers don't always bear it out, the HL has far more name cache and prestige with midwestern fans than does the SL and I believe that is because it has become such a  plains region league, no disrespect to the programs in the SL(especially NDSU and SDSU). For those who may object because of how bad some of the HL teams have been recently, wouldn't you rather--if we're going to play a bad team anyway--it be a team we have some history with rather than teams like SIUE or UC-Riverside?

While the Horizon was memorable and it would be fun to start a series with Oakland, I'm not sure filling our schedule with Horizon league games is beneficial.  I am ready to move on just like I moved on from the Mid Con.  I'll take games against a #9 ranked conference over a #22 ranked conference anyday.  The past is behind us, on to playing a conference with a ranked team like "Buffalo".  Btw...on our schedule are the top 3 teams from the MAC West.  And when it comes time to play rivals..... how about 10 games in the last 13 seasons with a 5/5 split "Ball State".  While the Horizon games had history and were fun to watch, I like the direction our program is going by writing a new chapter in our books with the MAC.

I don't mind that we're playing more MAC teams. I wanted to see more MAC teams on the schedule and I've said that repeatedly. I'm saying maybe play some HL teams instead of the non D1s or the North Dakotas or UC-Riversides or SIUE's of the world. They're equivalent or better games and more interesting to the fanbase. It would be a total win for the schedule and for attendance.

100% agree I would look forward to Wright State, Oakland or NKU on the schedule next year and forward.  That being said, I see that many of us are still complaining about non Division 1 competition.  Maybe I am missing something but the last Podcast did an excellent job filling in the blanks on how things work.

1) We will forever play a non Division 1 in exhibition, if you complain about this then I don't know what to tell you (Cedarville this year)
2) Valpo has always been a University that kept strong ties with its own, Coach Gore said it repeatedly that Jason Hawkins is the HC at Trinity Christian and I applaud him playing him.  Trinity exists on this schedule as a non D1 because it's one of our own.  This is more than just basketball guys, this is community for Valpo and that is a huge part on why players stay connected with the program.  We are a mid-major with zero chance to become Gonzaga.  I applaud Valpo for doing this with guys like Jason Hawkins . . . keep it up.

We all have opinions, and this is just mine, but it's clear that Coach Gore is not going into each year saying "how can I schedule 3 non D1s per season.  As you heard in the podcast, there are a myriad of reasons that games are taken.  It's clear that the dates are purposefully picked to coincide with STUDENT athletes first and foremost, and it should be.  Even more so now that the academic success is monetized by the NCAA.  Also, you heard coach mention that we play more games AFTER FINALS for this same reason.  By necessity we normally have to get a non D1 in this time slot because of the scarcity of D1 opponents Dec 18 - 31st.  This also truly doesn't effect attendance because I've never seen the Arc packed (consistently) for a home game over the break.  I just think that we are overthinking this guys, there are clear and obvious hurdles to some of your desires to have Purdue and Xavier type teams come to the Arc with consistency.  One thing is for certain, MVC play is the real gem here for season ticket holders.  Even if we continue to have difficulty with scheduling high majors at the Arc, consider that you get 9 high quality games that was only 1-3 during the HL and Summit league days.

Last years final NET Rankings
Valpo (net #198) . . . we aren't that attractive to schedule.

Closed Scrimmage:  opponent unknown
Exhibition: Cedarville
Toledo (net #67)
@ Saint Louis (net #107)
@ SIUE (net #329) Note, should this NOT benefit our NET in 2019/20?
North Dakota (net #224)
Grand Canyon (net #104)
Tournament:  opponent unknown
Tournament:  opponent unknown
Tournament:  opponent unknown
@ EMU (net #162)
CMU (net #122)
@ Charlotte (net #266)
@ High Point (net #231)
@ Arkansas neutral site (net #60)

Where is the 3rd non D1 that I've seen mentioned . . . I only see two?

[VU2014]

https://twitter.com/MrMattCraig/status/1168262707692261377?s=20

[VULB#62]

Powerful arguments.

My conclusion:  Mid Majors are merely required to exist in order to fatten P5/6 justifications for dance inclusion. The Mid Major designation is a code word for cannon fodder. 

[4throwfan]

pgmado,

I finally got to listen to the podcast with Coach Gore, and had a couple of questions, and hopefully you already know the answer without having to go back to the staff.

By the way, I really do enjoy the podcasts.

1.  Coach Gore mentioned a couple of times something about posting for games.  I assume that non-conference scheduling is a combination of MTE's, conference match-ups (e.g., ACC BG10 challenge), networking, and some sort of board posting.  My question is on the last item.  Is there some sort of community board that the coaches interact on?  If so, what does that look like?  Seems like this is a no-brainer that there would be such a thing.

2.  When two teams agree on a home-and-home, are both dates set when the contract is signed?  Seems like it would be more of a range.  Seems like they would use a standard form contract of some sort where the teams simply fill in the blanks for dates and buyout amount - is that right?

Thanks,

[VUGrad1314]

I have heard about the existence of such a scheduling board but I'm not sure if those rumors are actually true. I've seen it mentioned by Happening Hoops on Twitter a few times.

[IrishDawg]

I have heard about the existence of such a scheduling board but I'm not sure if those rumors are actually true. I've seen it mentioned by Happening Hoops on Twitter a few times.

Believe this is what you might be looking for: http://www.btischeduling.com/?e_type=1

That's the foreign tour scheduling, but I know there's something similar for regular season scheduling that coaches post on to set up games.