Heckler to Retire: New President Search

[Just Sayin]

Yes those people should be accepted. Kind've a silly question, this is 2020.

Seems to me it's the university's call as to who will and will not be accepted in accordance with its mission and unique identity as a Lutheran University.

True. And the university will need to answer to its alumni and donors, who are not likely to support any practices associated with discriminating against gays, people from other Christian faiths, non-Christians, etc.

Who said anything about discriminating against them?

[Valpo2013]

72 needs to get out from under the shroud
The school needs financial influx more than appeasing you grads who are holier than thou
Gays
Muslims
aliens.
Who cares as long as they pay
Too many old white guys on here
Seems familiar to another area

[M]

I don't think 72 is the target of your response...the rest of your post is right on though.

[vu72]

Who cares as long as they pay

I'll take the bait.  OP Kretzmann once said..."without the cross, we are nothing but another Princeton"  Or, perhaps, another Indiana State.  Those of you under 65 won't relate to OP, but he is why Valpo is such a special place.  We need to have a broad net but also need to stand up for our faith, inclusion,and  focus of what we can agree on but also understanding why we disagree and willing to understand and debate honestly, why we share values, for the good of society as it exists.  That is a LONG way from "who cares as long as they pay".

[78crusader]

THIS is the best argument you have?Wow.

Paul

72 needs to get out from under the shroud
The school needs financial influx more than appeasing you grads who are holier than thou
Gays
Muslims
aliens.
Who cares as long as they pay
Too many old white guys on here
Seems familiar to another area

[NotBryceDrew]

I reread the entire thread, 72's statements do not seem to be at odds with you.

Anyone hear or attend the panel today for Kirk? Interested on how it went.

[vu84v2]

Who cares as long as they pay

I'll take the bait.  OP Kretzmann once said..."without the cross, we are nothing but another Princeton"  Or, perhaps, another Indiana State.  Those of you under 65 won't relate to OP, but he is why Valpo is such a special place.  We need to have a broad net but also need to stand up for our faith, inclusion,and  focus of what we can agree on but also understanding why we disagree and willing to understand and debate honestly, why we share values, for the good of society as it exists.  That is a LONG way from "who cares as long as they pay".

I really have no idea regarding Valpo2013's frame of reference, but do not like the tone.

The only problem that I have with VU72's comment is that people under 65 cannot relate to OP Kretzmann. His vision resonated to those who came along well after his time.

[valpotx]

Hey now, I am a middle-aged white man of 38 .  Also, I don't care what people do in the privacy of their home, I am not religious, and would have failed Wheaton's requirements regarding women.  Nowadays, the folks that adhere to the no premarital sex guideline has to be less than 10% of youths.  I would hope that we don't eventually go down that route, as it would severely restrict who would want to attend Valpo. 

[VUGrad1314]

Yes becoming more Christian if that means that we adopt socially repressive policies would be a death sentence for our enrollment and not  solve our financial issues such as they may be. Furthermore we would take decades to undo the hit to Valpo's image we would take nationally if we did decide to change our minds later. We would have to  extend the endowment drive in perpetuity to survive and amid ever shrinking enrollment that would be a losing proposition.

Before you talk up Wheaton again for its academic reputation and huge endowment remember that nobody outside of religious fundamentalists  and some people in the midwest care about Wheaton. It can do whatever it wants as a D3 school with no national exposure. We are in a different place as a D1 program that is on national and regional TV frequently in a top athletic conference. It could work  for a school in the Big East or the WCC or even the A10 but that is not and never will be Valpo and most of those institutions aren't as hard line as Wheaton is. Let's look at some D1 super religious institutions:

Grand Canyon: Seen as a for profit diploma mill Can't rise above the WAC because of this

Liberty: May be non profit but has a lot of the same issues as Grand Canyon while being way more religious. Consequently they cannot find a football conference and would have trouble peddling themselves any higher than say the SOCON and even then I'm not sure if they would get in.

BYU: Will NEVER get into a Power 5 Conference despite their football and basketball pedigree and nice facilities because they have scheduling restrictions and are just seen as a pain in the butt to work with in general because of that and their hubris and their repressive policies

Oral Roberts: You're not going to find very much support for them being in the MVC no matter how good they get because they are seen as a school with repressive policies out of step with how most colleges operate.

Notre Dame: They are the most sought after of any on this list but that is because of the tradition of their football program. Wheaton lacks this. They are also probably the least hard line of anybody on this list.

Conferences want Belmont and Gonzaga but that is solely because of their basketball programs. If they didn't have those nobody would care about them. Furthermore I understand that they have both chilled out a bit on the hardline stuff in recent years much like Valpo has.

If your goal is to become a hardline seminary churning out fire and brimstone pastors with small enrollment and completely tank athletics down to D3 or the NAIA level. If you want to do away with a lot of the vibrance of student life we all enjoyed and students now continue to enjoy then by all means let's be like Wheaton. If you want us to continue to grow nationally and become more respected on and off the field then we need to take a more moderate approach. I'm sorry. These are facts. We can be Christian. Obviously Unashamedly and Unabashedly Christian. We can have the chapel figure prominently in student life and be our tallest most beautiful building. We can mandate the study of Theology classes. We can continue to call our honors college Christ College. We can maintain the Crusader name and mascot. We can continue to foster Christian groups on campus and openly advocate that people attend Bible study offered on campus. We can make service and service learning a prominent part of the curriculum for Valpo Students and offer many opportunities locally nationally and internationally for students to engage in God's work and feel like they are making a difference in the world. We can honor our Lutheran tradition by offering traditional services and a traditional choir and mark Reformation Day and all of the significant holy days. We can even be a dry campus and pass out Bibles on campus to students who want them. These are all fantastic significant and important things that show that we are Christian and proud of it. What we cannot do is start regulating important aspects of the identity social life and self expression of ADULTS who have and have earned the full right to do as they wish within the confines of the law. That is when you start to hurt yourself and your Christian tradition starts to work against you when you're in a position as prominent as Valpo. 

We are making a lot of good progress as a university on the social front. And in so doing yes we are advancing the Work and the Word of God and His Kingdom because more people are exposed to the Word and exposed to the good that Christianity and Christians can do for and in the world. We still present the Bible in its unredacted true form. They get the True and Real word and there are discussions about the Word on campus all the time especially if you are inclined to seek them out. We can be a strong Christian Bible believing God fearing university without telling people "Believe in this and follow it to the letter or F off." Interfaith dialogue and diverse perspectives are good for the world. Ask Thomas Merton for example how engaging with other faiths affected his Christianity. Remember that church isn't a museum exhibit for the perfect it's a hospital for the broken. We need to meet people and accept people where and as they are and show and set a good example for the Christian life and what Christians do. We don't do that with a sanctimonious holier than thou attitude and a legalistic scroll of rules. You do it with love compassion acceptance and action. After all, works do not save but saving faith is active faith. We have overcome a lot perception wise that was okay when we were in the mid con and nobody cared about us but we're in a conference people care about now and pay attention to. We need to act accordingly and we cannot and should not do away with a lot of the progress we are making.

[valpo95]

I realize this is a fan forum with most of the participants keenly interested in Valpo athletics. That said, the thread is about the presidential search, and VU is so much more than athletics. We would do well to dial back theoretical outrage on social issues unless they are statements or decisions made by a particular candidate for the position.

As I see it, there are two main things that the next president has to do: First, effectively manage the finances of the university. We can talk all day about lack of support for athletics, the drain of the law school closure, declining enrollments and the like, yet the fact remains that all of these come back to money. The university has to have someone who has experience with managing complex budgets. Second, the university has to have someone who can help articulate a compelling vision for a Christian university during challenging times in higher education, and empower others to act on that vision.

I have no idea if Kirk Farney is the right person for the job, or how his visit is proceeding. Yet someone with 25 years experience at JP Morgan, a Masters from Northwestern and a PhD from Notre Dame, and significant administrative experience at a selective national university like Wheaton (in Chicagoland no less) would check quite a few boxes. Beyond this, Farney's background as a board member at Thrivent and Concordia RF are also benefits: For reference, as near as I can tell, the percentage of Lutheran undergrads at VU has gone from 39% in 2006 to 17% in 2019, so someone who is aware of trends and has connections within Lutheran circles would be a plus.

[loschwitz]

Here is how Wheaton addresses the issues under discussion:

https://www.wheaton.edu/life-at-wheaton/kingdom-diversity/diversity-commitment/


FWIW - Wheaton's athletic teams are called the Thunder.  They used to known as the Crusaders.  The name was changed 20 years ago after Crusader was deemed offensive and inappropriate.

[valpo95]

I have no idea if Kirk Farney is the right person for the job, or how his visit is proceeding.

Beyond that, if the other candidates are in fact Kraig Olejniczak and John Nunes, these also seem like good choices and have prior ties to VU.  Olejniczak served as Dean of the VU College of Engineering for ten years, ran his own firm, and has a PhD from Purdue. Nunes is an ordained LCMS pastor and was the Jochum Chair at VU prior to becoming president at Concordia NY and has PhD from LSTC.

[crusadermoe]

I like the extensive business background and the Notre Dame thesis.  This shows intellectual depth in the founding mission arena of church and state.  Note also that KF appears to have been in a role that advocated for Wheaton.  He didn't write the mission or shape it. It is quite possible that Wheaton opened its mind to a Lutheran.  One wonders if Valpo would do the same and hire an evangelical as a VP.   I doubt it.  I suspect Valpo activists wuuld shout it down or protest it.

We need a leader who gets the money side of things and doesn't put liberal platitudes above the need for a distinctive purpose, market niche, and focus.  There are hundreds of schools competing for the niche of a watered-down generic liberal education.   Liberal arts used to mean breadth of study. Now it means energetic shut down of any non-conforming speaker or opinion.   Don't try to spook everyone with exaggerated claims of how discriminatory non-leftist leaders are. All that is asked is that a college actually give a platform for differing opinions without being shouted down by left-wing activist faculty and students. 

The list of national schools with un-apologetic Chrisitan identity is much shorter including only Baylor and Notre Dame unless I am missing others. And I think it is demonstrable that many opinions are invited to be heard in these universities even if not encouraged.

[vu72]

I like the extensive business background and the Notre Dame thesis.  This shows intellectual depth in the founding mission arena of church and state.  Note also that KF appears to have been in a role that advocated for Wheaton.  He didn't write the mission or shape it. It is quite possible that Wheaton opened its mind to a Lutheran.  One wonders if Valpo would do the same and hire an evangelical as a VP.   I doubt it.  I suspect Valpo activists wuuld shout it down or protest it.

We need a leader who gets the money side of things and doesn't put liberal platitudes above the need for a distinctive purpose, market niche, and focus.  There are hundreds of schools competing for the niche of a watered-down generic liberal education.   Liberal arts used to mean breadth of study. Now it means energetic shut down of any non-conforming speaker or opinion.   Don't try to spook everyone with exaggerated claims of how discriminatory non-leftist leaders are. All that is asked is that a college actually give a platform for differing opinions without being shouted down by left-wing activist faculty and students. 

The list of national schools with un-apologetic Chrisitan identity is much shorter including only Baylor and Notre Dame unless I am missing others. And I think it is demonstrable that many opinions are invited to be heard in these universities even if not encouraged.

A well thought out dissertation, though I would think any number of other Catholic universities would want to be included in this category as would Lutheran or Baptist schools.  I have found an interesting fact which might give Mr. Farney an "inside edge" of sorts.  In looking at the Thrivent  Board of Directors members, I note that the Chair is Bonnie Requet, who is still on the Valpo Board as are fellow Thrivent Board members N. Cornell Boggs and Fred Kraegel ,Valpo's Board Chair.  This would mean that three voting members of our Board are very well informed as to Mr. Farney's abilities, at least as they have been shown in a Board setting.

[Valpo2013]

OP Kretzman over valued Valpo-and was blinded by religion-which is much of the issue we have had trying to keep up with the times
Without the cross we are just Princeton?
Please
We aren't close to Princeton
I love Valpo and always will but that is a ridiculous statement
Alum from all schools believe that their school is "special"
Kinda like everyone thinks that their grandkids are the greatest

[elephtheria47]

Do we know if these are his own views, or the views of Wheaton College? Just because he's VP doesnt mean he has the same viewpoints at the core. Is Pence guilty by association for what President Trump does? Lord knows I dont agree with everything the people in charge of my company do. (Certainly worthy of discussion however.) Anyone have insight to yesterdays meeting?

[VUGrad1314]

Do we know if these are his own views, or the views of Wheaton College? Just because he's VP doesnt mean he has the same viewpoints at the core. Is Pence guilty by association for what President Trump does? Lord knows I dont agree with everything the people in charge of my company do. (Certainly worthy of discussion however.) Anyone have insight to yesterdays meeting?

The Trump\Pence example isn't the best one because Pence has plenty of issues that should give people pause but point taken.

[crusader05]

I think those are fair questions to ask. The next president of the university may make changes and staff/student/faculty should have the right to now which direction he may take them and then react accordingly.

That said, some people could argue that what you are willing to tolerate should say something about you even if you are not making the decisions. He's not a random employee, he's a VP at Wheaton.

[crusadermoe]

Perhaps OPK was misquoted and meant to say, "without the cross we are just Brown."   Doesn't have the same ring so probably not. 

[usc4valpo]

Academically, it would be wonderful to be just Princeton or Brown.

[vu72]

OP Kretzman over valued Valpo-and was blinded by religion-which is much of the issue we have had trying to keep up with the times
Without the cross we are just Princeton?
Please
We aren't close to Princeton
I love Valpo and always will but that is a ridiculous statement
Alum from all schools believe that their school is "special"
Kinda like everyone thinks that their grandkids are the greatest

Funny stuff, if you actually meant it to be so. 

[sfnmman]

Does anyone know who the second and third candidates are?  The second candidate should be interviewing today and tomorrow.  Inquiring minds want to know!

[loschwitz]

Another website says that candidate number two is Andrew Finstuen, Dean of the Honors College and interim Vice-Provost at Boise State University in Idaho.

[vu84v2]

OP Kretzman over valued Valpo-and was blinded by religion-which is much of the issue we have had trying to keep up with the times
Without the cross we are just Princeton?
Please
We aren't close to Princeton
I love Valpo and always will but that is a ridiculous statement
Alum from all schools believe that their school is "special"
Kinda like everyone thinks that their grandkids are the greatest

When I read comments like this, I can't help but think that people who make these arguments confuse "unique" and "special". For decades, Valpo has been a place that has enabled tens of thousands of young people to lead successful lives in their chosen profession and personal lives. This is true regardless of their religious convictions (I personally never aligned with Valpo's religious ideologies, but I am fully aligned with its mission). That makes Valpo special. It is not unique, as many universities are special in this way (Butler, Creighton, Marquette, Drake to name a few) - but that makes Valpo no less special.

In regards to Farney, I had the same initial reaction about him being from Wheaton that others seem to have had. But then I went and read his biographies and some of his academic work. He has the credentials and could be a good university President. As long as he was not going to try to implement an environment like Wheaton (though, of course, he is entitled to his own personal beliefs), he could bring excellent financial and organizational leadership. And keep in mind that implementing any of the arcane restrictive policies like Wheaton would require support from the Board (and, subsequently, from alums, donors, faculty, etc.).

[loschwitz]

 The Torch has this article on Farney's meeting with students.

http://www.valpotorch.com/news/article_4921194e-52ae-11ea-aa3c-73047c88c457.html