Valpo at Drake Game Thread, Wednesday, Feb. 19 – 7 p.m. CT (ESPN+)

[vok22]

While i share the optimism for next year, that assumes there is no impact transfers, which is unrealistic in today's game. We're already guaranteed to lose our best three point shooter and the heart and soul of the team. Nothing is guaranteed year to year anymore.

I would say the only person besides Freeman that would be a huge hit and has a realistic chance is Clay. His stock has risen so much even since before he stepped on campus.

[GoldenCrusader87]

Funny because when the call in the end of the game went our way the last time out I didn't hear a word about it ... all about which side you're on.

[nkvu]

Could someone who has more X's and O's experience explain something to me?  Against ISU we ran the "motion" offense in the first half which gave us a 17 point deficit.  In the second half we ran a lot of high on the ball screens for JFL which helped us get back in and win the game. Against Drake tonight, we ran the "motion" offense in the first half resulting in an even bigger deficit. It seemed to my untrained eye that in the second half that we again ran more high on the ball screens that resulted in drives to the rim by JFL and open threes by Mileek.  Now it seems to me the high on the ball screen works, and the motion offense, well, not so much. So why do we keep with the motion offense during our regular long scoring droughts in the first half, when high on the ball screens seem to work so well?  Is this a strategy, sucking in the first half, then switching up in the second half, or is it a simply coaches who refuse to make changes to their desired offensive scheme until they are so far behind they are desperate to get back in the game? 

Please, someone educate me.

[GoldenCrusader87]

Live and die by the 3 pointer. Plain and simple. It masks the flaws when we're on - first part of the game and the second half.

It exposes flaws when we're off. There's no point to a motion offense (as we see in these scoring droughts) when you're not making the defenders MOVE.

Sooo when you chuck an ill-advised 3 pointer up early in a possession (especially in the motion offense) you're negating the intended effect of the offense. And, you're eradicating the power of back door cuts.

Take Mileek last night. Couldn't buy a bucket in the first half from outside the arc. Gets hot down the stretch in the second half.

Interestingly enough, Mileek makes 8 - 3 pointers and our 3 point percentage is off the charts in the second half. But then with the game on the line he can't make 2 easy bunnies inside the paint.

It once again shows me - which I've thought all along - Mileek is not a good post player. It's not natural to him. His physique is deceiving as he has the build for a great post player ... but .... that's just not his game. He's maybe a 4 .... but still prefers open looks from outside the arc. If I'm not mistaken - he's like Clay in the sense if he hit a growth spurt and I don't think he has a lot of experience in the post. Not his fault.

Which is why Krikke is our best natural post player (potential-wise). But he doesn't ***look*** like it, physically.  Granted, he's got some learning to do as we saw down the stretch yesterday.

Robbins was a beast last night. Best 7 footer I've seen in the valley in some time. Rim protector. What we would've liked our twin towers to be, which they were sparingly.

[Just Sayin]

Could someone who has more X's and O's experience explain something to me?  Against ISU we ran the "motion" offense in the first half which gave us a 17 point deficit.  In the second half we ran a lot of high on the ball screens for JFL which helped us get back in and win the game. Against Drake tonight, we ran the "motion" offense in the first half resulting in an even bigger deficit. It seemed to my untrained eye that in the second half that we again ran more high on the ball screens that resulted in drives to the rim by JFL and open threes by Mileek.  Now it seems to me the high on the ball screen works, and the motion offense, well, not so much. So why do we keep with the motion offense during our regular long scoring droughts in the first half, when high on the ball screens seem to work so well?  Is this a strategy, sucking in the first half, then switching up in the second half, or is it a simply coaches who refuse to make changes to their desired offensive scheme until they are so far behind they are desperate to get back in the game? 

Please, someone educate me.

At the beginning of each game, Matt should approach the scorer's table and ask them to put 19 points on the board for our opponent.  Only way to get them to play hard the entire game and do what works to win. 

[SanityLost17]

Free Throw attempts. 34-9.

Good point. We didn't drive to the basket nearly enough.

Here is the point of this one.   We only deserved 9 free throw attempts because we shot a lot of jumpers. 

However, they did NOT deserve 34 attempts... 26 maybe?  I am ok with a 26-9 disparity based on the way the game was played.  I think that is the complaint here.   We got called for a lot of fouls on great aggressive defense. 

That said... Like others have said..   When you play on the road that kind of thing is going to happen.   The last 8 minutes of the 1st half is what really killed us because it is too much of a deficit to come back from. 

Oh well.   I like what I have seen the last 4 games.  We are the best 14-14 team in the country.      haha

[valpo84]

Funny how we don't discuss how the other coaches and teams blow 17 and 19 point leads at their homes? We should have no business coming back in these games.  Interesting, that we chastise Matt for not making changes in first half, but when he does make half-time adjustments, then it's not he has potential as a coach, but he should have made them sooner.  Other coaches make no adjustments to what's happening and watch 17 and 19 point leads dissipate by the 3-5 minute mark -- that takes some coaching skill.

I won't recap first half, but college basketball is always going to be about runs.  Valpo started well and has been better at this the past few games.  However, we had a drought, compounded by ill-advised jacking up 3s when we panicked during the drought.  He did burn a TO.  To compare, Bryce would have probably burned through 3 TOs and only had 1 for the 2d half. And, droughts occurred quite often from after first TV TO to about 8-9 minutes even back in the Horizon.  But, competition wasn't as good and we wouldn't fall as far behind, and then we played much better than this team to close the half. Matt still had 3 for the 2d half and was able to use them judiciously at the end of the game and then OT.  By the way, he got a good look at the end of OT.  If he burns them all early (and they're still not effective), then there would have been criticism that he didn't save any.  This was a tough game to lose, granted, on the road, home-cooking reffing, etc, and they come back from 19 and go to OT and had chances in regulation and OT to win.  We continue to try to compare this team to successful teams in a way easier conference, and with a different set of players.

I'm frustrated, but the past 4 games show that this team has more talent and heart than last year.  They are still gritty without Kiser so that fear is being alleviated for next year, although could have used his fouls tonight. 

To a couple points raised by someone -- you are given 4 TOs at the beginning of the game for the whole game.  You have a use it or lose it TO before the half.  So you may only start with 3 or fewer for 2d half.  They don't reset. You get 2 TOs for OT.  Clay continues to improve, Krikke keeps improving (he was much more aggressive offensively on the road last night (although the 3 attempt after sitting for 20 minutes was not helpful, but he's a frosh), McMillan is like Jay Cutler -- good Mileek in 2d half, bad Mileek in 1st half.  I keep hoping for more from Nick and Eron.  They have that ability to settle folks down and provide more leadership, but their limitations in scoring and Gordon on D have been recently disappointing.  Gordon did look a little better shooting last night.  Robinson was 0/8 and many ill-advised 3s when the deficit was growing.  They have also been able to get over the hump on the road starting with Loyola when coming back from the inevitable double-digit deficit (the dreaded 3 Ds, not the good 3 Ds (drive, dish, dunk/da basket), and make it 50/50 games on the road.

This teams still needs to: (i) rebound better, (ii) value the basketball -- quit the sloppy passes, quit the rushed passes, hold on to rebounds, and (iii) value possessions, particularly when breaks may be available -- we want to run, which is fine, but they must be more discerning about pulling back if numbers aren't there.  One question that struck about this year while driving to work this morning was "if this was what actually happened last year, as opposed to whatever that was last year, would you feel better about the retooling post-Horizon and feel better about Matt as a coach?" 

[usc4valpo]

Being at the game, the fifth foul call on JFL (and possibly McMillan for that matter) was terrible. He did not mkae contact in any way and I could not understand how that was viewed. Valpo should have won that game last night and they were the better team. Poor offensive motion in the first half and lackadaiscal passing leading to turnovers led to the deficit - I see where "consistently inconsistent" remark applies.

I will say this - JFL and others do need to reduce the facial expressions and whining with the officials. It does not help their cause. I also think Lottich needs to be more assertive in these matters.

Despite the loss, Fun evening at the Knapp. They had Bulldog races at halftime which was cute, and they keep the fans pretty engaged throughout the game. I think Valpo has talent and will get better - I think Lottich can be a really good coach but there is still learning to do.

[valpopal]

Being at the game, the fifth foul call on JFL (and possibly McMillan for that matter) was terrible. He did not mkae contact in any way and I could not understand how that was viewed. Valpo should have won that game last night and they were the better team. Poor offensive motion in the first half and lackadaiscal passing leading to turnovers led to the deficit - I see where "consistently inconsistent" remark applies.

I will say this - JFL and others do need to reduce the facial expressions and whining with the officials. It does not help their cause. I also think Lottich needs to be more assertive in these matters.

Despite the loss, Fun evening at the Knapp. They had Bulldog races at halftime which was cute, and they keep the fans pretty engaged throughout the game. I think Valpo has talent and will get better - I think Lottich can be a really good coach but there is still learning to do.

As I have noted a number of times in the past, the frustration and reactions of the players toward officials is understandable and directly related to observing their coach not having their backs in those instances. At the end of the game and into overtime, JFL had a phantom foul call to knock him out of the game, McMillen had a dubious foul call to knock him out of the game, and an out of bounds clearly off an opponent was judged off Gordon. In all three instances that certainly could have influenced the outcome of the game, the players were justified in expressing their frustration, particularly when Lottich did not offer forceful objections of his own to the officials. If they could depend on Lottich, they wouldn't feel a need to be as demonstrative themselves. Repeatedly, I have noted Lottich's habit of merely raising his hands in frustration as if surrendering but not being more adamant in confrontations with officials. Officials know they can make 50/50 calls against VU and they will not receive any real push-back pressure from the Valpo sideline.

[usc4valpo]

As stated before, I wish Valpo would have a facility like the Knapp Center instead of a HS gym and more attention on athletics, particularly now as a MVC member. Drake and Valpo are in a similar situation.

[vok22]

I do not understand where people get this lottich doesn't work the refs notion. I sit behind the bench and he is talking to the refs the whole time down the court, pleading them to explain. They showed him on the tv multiple times yesterday talking to the officials after bad calls. Would you rather have him yelling in their faces and get a tech and give them 2 free throws and the ball in a tie overtime game?

[valpopal]

I do not understand where people get this lottich doesn't work the refs notion. I sit behind the bench and he is talking to the refs the whole time down the court, pleading them to explain. They showed him on the tv multiple times yesterday talking to the officials after bad calls. Would you rather have him yelling in their faces and get a tech and give them 2 free throws and the ball in a tie overtime game?

False polarization here. There is a middle ground between requesting an explanation and shouting in their faces to get a tech. In the three most grievous examples of bad calls I cited that happened near the end of the game, I saw no strong objections by Lottich to the bad calls even after JFL, Mileek, and Eron expressed their displeasure to the officials.

[Just Sayin]

Being at the game, the fifth foul call on JFL (and possibly McMillan for that matter) was terrible. He did not mkae contact in any way and I could not understand how that was viewed. Valpo should have won that game last night and they were the better team. Poor offensive motion in the first half and lackadaiscal passing leading to turnovers led to the deficit - I see where "consistently inconsistent" remark applies. I will say this - JFL and others do need to reduce the facial expressions and whining with the officials. It does not help their cause. I also think Lottich needs to be more assertive in these matters. Despite the loss, Fun evening at the Knapp. They had Bulldog races at halftime which was cute, and they keep the fans pretty engaged throughout the game. I think Valpo has talent and will get better - I think Lottich can be a really good coach but there is still learning to do.

I can't stand it when players whine about ref calls. Didn't many Valpo fans hate that when Smits did it incessantly? And other players now gone?


Just Stop It!

[oklahomamick]

Our center attempted 8 threes?  I guess trying to draw the 7 footer out? 

[VUGrad1314]

And he hit 6 of them but it still didn't work. Robbins still threw a one man block party in the paint. It really wasn't our night at all.

[JD24]

As I have noted a number of times in the past, the frustration and reactions of the players toward officials is understandable and directly related to observing their coach not having their backs in those instances.

You know this how?

[valpopal]

As I have noted a number of times in the past, the frustration and reactions of the players toward officials is understandable and directly related to observing their coach not having their backs in those instances.

You know this how?

In all three instances I cited from late in the Drake game and you cut out of your reply, I watched the players look at the coach with facial expressions and body language as if imploring for stronger support toward the officials for their cause, but that forceful back up did not materialize. I even replayed the three times the players complained to the refs about the bad calls, and their frustration was evident in each case. After other games when Lottich was questioned about bad calls on his players, he sympathized with the officials who are "only doing their job," even one time in the press conference when JFL had just stated the call clearly was wrong and Lottich could have said something as simple and mild as "that's the way I saw it as well" in a gesture of support for his star player. Lottich doesn't need to rage and get a technical foul, but he could at least be as expressive as his players on those occasions when there are blatantly bad calls so they don't have to do it, and he could voice general agreement with their concerns about the calls as a sign of solidarity.

[VUGrad1314]

Add another reason why we're afraid JFL might be looking elsewhere... I really hope he's not but I totally understand if he is...

[valpotx]

Add another reason why we're afraid JFL might be looking elsewhere... I really hope he's not but I totally understand if he is...

Seriously guys, think about this aspect.  Does JFL want to sit out a year in a transfer, heading into his JR season?  The guy has professional ambitions, and if he does leave, it would probably be an early graduation type of scenario, where he can use the grad transfer rule.  I am more worried about Clay leaving after his FR year, than I am with JFL leaving after a SO season, where he has to sit a year.  Now, if NCAA rules change in the offseason, to allow a 1 time transfer without sitting out, I would be very worried.

[VUGrad1314]

Add another reason why we're afraid JFL might be looking elsewhere... I really hope he's not but I totally understand if he is...

Seriously guys, think about this aspect.  Does JFL want to sit out a year in a transfer, heading into his JR season?  The guy has professional ambitions, and if he does leave, it would probably be an early graduation type of scenario, where he can use the grad transfer rule.  I am more worried about Clay leaving after his FR year, than I am with JFL leaving after a SO season, where he has to sit a year.  Now, if NCAA rules change in the offseason, to allow a 1 time transfer without sitting out, I would be very worried.

No less than the Big 10 and the ACC are pushing for that rule to be in place BY THE START OF NEXT SEASON. We should be very concerned. Because conferences of that size and influence get what they want no questions asked because they own the NCAA not the other way around. In spite of that  I really hope and I pray to whatever Gods may be and may be listening that we are allowed to keep this core together and realize the benefits of their growth in the MVC to establish ourselves and our program in the post Drew era. I don't know if we've exhausted all of our karma for being screwed out of a tournament bid by our conference collapsing (thank you most of the current HL) but if we have a little bit left I would really like a deep tournament run to establish our program and boost enrollment to solve whatever financial issues we may have and spur further development of the basketball program and the athletic department. Please Please Please. Amen.

[Just Sayin]

Add another reason why we're afraid JFL might be looking elsewhere... I really hope he's not but I totally understand if he is...

You should pin this post as your standard comment when we lose.

[GoldenCrusader87]

Things are progressing nicely as we're all rowing in the same boat. One boat. One team!

[JD24]

As I have noted a number of times in the past, the frustration and reactions of the players toward officials is understandable and directly related to observing their coach not having their backs in those instances.

You know this how?

In all three instances I cited from late in the Drake game and you cut out of your reply, I watched the players look at the coach with facial expressions and body language as if imploring for stronger support toward the officials for their cause, but that forceful back up did not materialize. I even replayed the three times the players complained to the refs about the bad calls, and their frustration was evident in each case. After other games when Lottich was questioned about bad calls on his players, he sympathized with the officials who are "only doing their job," even one time in the press conference when JFL had just stated the call clearly was wrong and Lottich could have said something as simple and mild as "that's the way I saw it as well" in a gesture of support for his star player. Lottich doesn't need to rage and get a technical foul, but he could at least be as expressive as his players on those occasions when there are blatantly bad calls so they don't have to do it, and he could voice general agreement with their concerns about the calls as a sign of solidarity.

So you have no idea and it is your opinion and speculation on whether Lottich's perceived indifference to calls and the players reaction is related. In other words there is no "is"

[valpopal]

So you have no idea and it is your opinion and speculation on whether Lottich's perceived indifference to calls and the players reaction is related. In other words there is no "is"

You are free to disagree, but "opinion" and "speculation" suggest no evidence. However, I offered a number of specific instances that establish a pattern, and in the past I have cited others. Therefore, unless you think they were all just coincidental and not consequential, the conclusion I presented would be regarded as logically deduced from evidence. In law this is labeled as "credible evidence," something that can't be proven beyond a reasonable doubt but which is "worthy of belief and consideration."   

[JD24]

So you have no idea and it is your opinion and speculation on whether Lottich's perceived indifference to calls and the players reaction is related. In other words there is no "is"

You are free to disagree, but "opinion" and "speculation" suggest no evidence. However, I offered a number of specific instances that establish a pattern, and in the past I have cited others. Therefore, unless you think they were all just coincidental and not consequential, the conclusion I presented would be regarded as logically deduced from evidence. In law this is labeled as "credible evidence," something that can't be proven beyond a reasonable doubt but which is "worthy of belief and consideration."

You've invented a "fact" to support a supposition on your part which backs a narrative on your part. You're free to have that opinion but at least express it as so instead of concluding it is so. Had your opinion been expressed as such, I wouldn't have said anything. However you didn't present it as opinion.