Indiana moving to Stage-5 on Saturday, 9/26/20

[vuny98]

I don't believe anyone should take their guard down (not practice the 3 items above) in March because some of the public will have received the coronavirus vaccine. It will be summer or fall before anything like that happens at public events.

What I'm hinting at is some kind of "Proof of Vaccination Card". A section of restaurants might phase to elbow to elbow "vaccinated only" seating. Maybe Tuesdays and Thursdays at your hair dresser are scheduled only for the vaccinated. Something like this might be tried at the ARC also. Maybe upper vs lower bowl alternating isolations of the vaccinated from the great unwashed  . Just throwing around ideas so you can add any reopening thoughts that cross your minds.

Maybe those that don't have vaccines can sit at the back of the bus and we will reserve the good seats for those good members of society. I don't think anything like that has been tried before, lets see how that plays out...

If a vaccine is available, those that get it can feel comfortable knowing they are protected. Those that don't understand the risk they are taking by not having the vaccine. We don't need government to force people to get a drug put into their body or make their lives miserable if they don't.

[vu84v2]

If a vaccine is available, those that get it can feel comfortable knowing they are protected. Those that don't understand the risk they are taking by not having the vaccine. We don't need government to force people to get a drug put into their body or make their lives miserable if they don't.

[/quote]

You seem to be missing how vaccines work. Let's say the vaccine is 95% effective (which would be truly amazing for a first pass vaccine). While the symptoms from getting sick may be less (we'll need to know this), you still have a 1 in 20 chance of getting sick (compared to before the vaccine). Furthermore, how long do the effects of the vaccine last? 6 months? a year? The point here is that solving the COVID-19 pandemic problem requires a combination of high efficacy, high duration and a lot of people taking the vaccine (plus safety, of course). Not sure what percentage of people need to take the vaccine if it has a 95% efficacy, but my guess is that it is around 70%. A big 2021 dilemma is going to be to get people to take the vaccine (you can't force them to), because if not enough take it we'll be continuously battling this for many years.

[crusader05]

a choice to take a vaccine or not is not the same as racial segregation.

[vu72]

Not sure they can't be forced.  Doesn't the state require certain vaccinations for kids going to school?  Doesn't the state require seatbelts be worn?  Doesn't the state require auto insurance?  Seems like the state can enforce whatever policy it wants if a law is passed.

Perhaps the answer is for the state to not require the vaccination but if you are caught being in public spaces without same, then hefty fines occur. This is why I'm not in politics!

[justducky]

Can insurance companies raise rates for individuals or families who refuse any or all vaccinations?

[vuny98]

If a vaccine is available, those that get it can feel comfortable knowing they are protected. Those that don't understand the risk they are taking by not having the vaccine. We don't need government to force people to get a drug put into their body or make their lives miserable if they don't.

You seem to be missing how vaccines work. Let's say the vaccine is 95% effective (which would be truly amazing for a first pass vaccine). While the symptoms from getting sick may be less (we'll need to know this), you still have a 1 in 20 chance of getting sick (compared to before the vaccine). Furthermore, how long do the effects of the vaccine last? 6 months? a year? The point here is that solving the COVID-19 pandemic problem requires a combination of high efficacy, high duration and a lot of people taking the vaccine (plus safety, of course). Not sure what percentage of people need to take the vaccine if it has a 95% efficacy, but my guess is that it is around 70%. A big 2021 dilemma is going to be to get people to take the vaccine (you can't force them to), because if not enough take it we'll be continuously battling this for many years.
I am aware of how vaccines work. Understand you still have a chance to get sick even with the vaccine. my whole point is forcing people to take a vaccine is a slippery slope. The comments after I posted that further my point.. insurance rates up, fines for being in public without a vaccine, not allowing someone to take part in society or to essentially wear the scarlet letter if they don't... Especially for a disease that lets be honest, the majority of society has very little severe effects from. The vaccine will greatly help protect those that want it (no it cure it but it greatly reduces risk). Everyone else should be allowed to live their lives. If you took a vaccine and you are still scared to be out in public or you are in high risk group, don't be then.

[bbtds]

Can insurance companies raise rates for individuals or families who refuse any or all vaccinations?

Of course they can set their own rules for policy holders but if the other insurance companies don't agree with raising rates on people that refuse the vaccinations then those insurance companies that choose to enforce their rules will lose business and hurt their profitability.

[justducky]

I seem to have missed an important detail on the new vaccines. Many of you may have missed it as well. Apparently the lag between the 1'st and 2'nd doses is 30 days which should be followed by another week of caution before the immunity completely sets in. 

Sorry! This significantly changes my assumptions for reopening as per 2021 winter (plus spring?) basketball .

My thinking on speeding the rollout for "normalization" of economic activities by prioritizing say restaurant space or baseball seating for the proven vaccinated is still a relevant topic for discussion. The entire economy is in desperate need for a rapid return to as normal of a behavior as we can manage. The profitability or survival of many businesses depend upon it.

[vu84v2]

Very good point about the two does required for the vaccine. Getting people to complete both doses will be a further challenge that will impact loosening restrictions on large gatherings (sports and otherwise).

One other point here (which really goes to the Fall 2021 semester). It seems highly likely that universities will require all of their students to be vaccinated against COVID-19 unless there is some serious availability/logistics problem through the summer. Universities already require other vaccines, so this will just be an extension of that. There will be no "opt out" allowed unless the student provides detailed medical records that say they cannot take the vaccine. Many employers will do the same thing.

[bbtds]

Very good point about the two does required for the vaccine. Getting people to complete both doses will be a further challenge that will impact loosening restrictions on large gatherings (sports and otherwise).

I assume you meant to say "two doses required for the vaccine" Or possibly you meant "two dosey doe's"

[JD24]

I don't believe anyone should take their guard down (not practice the 3 items above) in March because some of the public will have received the coronavirus vaccine. It will be summer or fall before anything like that happens at public events.

What I'm hinting at is some kind of "Proof of Vaccination Card". A section of restaurants might phase to elbow to elbow "vaccinated only" seating. Maybe Tuesdays and Thursdays at your hair dresser are scheduled only for the vaccinated. Something like this might be tried at the ARC also. Maybe upper vs lower bowl alternating isolations of the vaccinated from the great unwashed  . Just throwing around ideas so you can add any reopening thoughts that cross your minds.

Ticketmaster has already mentioned that proof of vaccination or negative test within a short period prior to any event they ticket is likely when events first startup.  How long this is continued is anyone's guess. All electronic ticket and entry. There will be a place on the website where you can upload your vax/test results. Absent these.....no entry even if you bought the ticket.

Don't think this can happen? When was the last time anyone walked onto a plane without making a stop or two beforehand?

[wh]

Doctors fear COVID-19 worst for college basketball: 'Horrible idea'
By Zach Braziller
November 21, 2020 | 6:19pm

https://www.google.com/amp/s/nypost.com/2020/11/21/doctors-fear-covid-19-worst-for-college-basketball-season/amp/

[wh]

Over the weekend Florida State called off their game with Clemson 3 hours before kickoff because 1 backup player tested COVID positive. Clemson's coach called it ridiculous, saying they should forfeit for refusing to play. If 1 infected player can shut down a major college FB game, imagine how many BB games are going to be cancelled. Moreover, MVC conference games are going to be played back-to-back/same teams/same location, so we're talking about 2 games cancelled by a single incident. Add to that the same government officials who have been demanding since last spring that everything remain shut down until a vaccine is developed are now calling the safety of the new vaccines into question and scaring the American public away from getting vaccinated. Bottom line - I will be surprised if this year's college bb season lasts past January before it collapses. Obviously and sincerely, I hope I'm completely wrong and it all goes fine.

[JD24]

Despite Dabo's complaining, the postponement of that game was entirely on Clemson. They had a positive test on an OLman the day they left and let the player make the trip to Tallahassee. Incredibly stupid which, of course, Dabo blames on FSU.

[valporun]

Despite Dabo's complaining, the postponement of that game was entirely on Clemson. They had a positive test on an OLman the day they left and let the player make the trip to Tallahassee. Incredibly stupid which, of course, Dabo blames on FSU.

Has Cleveland St. been banned from the postseason because of this Dabo situation?

[JD24]

Despite Dabo's complaining, the postponement of that game was entirely on Clemson. They had a positive test on an OLman the day they left and let the player make the trip to Tallahassee. Incredibly stupid which, of course, Dabo blames on FSU.

Has Cleveland St. been banned from the postseason because of this Dabo situation?

It would be well deserved don't you think?