Valpo Strategic Plan

[David81]

While acknowledging the reality of the student-as-consumer mentality that now dominates U.S. higher education, the social media dynamics that are driving this particular brand of it are very unfortunate. It's mainly about superficial comparisons and which school has the best and most creature comforts.

By contrast, it's hard to capture on TikTok a semester-long learning experience in a fascinating course taught by a stimulating teacher. How do you convey on Instagram the stimulation of a great conversation with friends over an ordinary dorm meal? And what about the impossibility of showing on FaceTime the process of intellectual or creative growth in working through an absorbing project? Guess what? Attending a college that remains committed to quality undergraduate education, smaller classes, and full-time faculty who care about teaching...really, really matters, comparatively speaking, on measures such as these. VU isn't the only school that holds such a commitment, but if someone is passing up VU for a school with more plush dorms and less personalized education so they can brag about their dorm room in a text message, that's kinda sad.

Don't get me wrong: As is obvious here, I use social media all the time in my work and personal life. But when the substance of comparing one's college experience to others boils down to such superficial measures, the priorities have become very screwed up.

[NotBryceDrew]

"Most don't know Valpo is D1" is just grossly inaccurate.

[valpofb16]

David it's not just a TikTok.

These kids go to Illinois , Wisconsin , Indiana for the weekend and say. "Wow , I don't want to go back"

And it's different if Valpo is a prestigious school that guarantees a job on wall street or Silicon Valley. But they don't and  it's the reality of the situation.

not being 240k in debt is not a superficial argument, also enjoying your collegiate experience as it's a once in a lifetime deal, also not superficial.

These are not World renounced professors walking the halls. Reality is you are probably getting same/better experience at a lot of other higher paying Universities.

[valpofb16]

Instead of more griping. I am trying to build a network of Valpo football contacts to help alumni secure jobs post graduation ( think Wabash)

If anyone is a football alum would like to talk

[VULB#62]

Instead of more griping. I am trying to build a network of Valpo football contacts to help alumni secure jobs post graduation ( think Wabash)

If anyone is a football alum would like to talk

This effort is value-added for a particular program. It can draw in prospects. 👍

[David81]

David it's not just a TikTok.

These kids go to Illinois , Wisconsin , Indiana for the weekend and say. "Wow , I don't want to go back"

And it's different if Valpo is a prestigious school that guarantees a job on wall street or Silicon Valley. But they don't and  it's the reality of the situation.

not being 240k in debt is not a superficial argument, also enjoying your collegiate experience as it's a once in a lifetime deal, also not superficial.

These are not World renounced professors walking the halls. Reality is you are probably getting same/better experience at a lot of other higher paying Universities.

valpofb16, I was replying more specifically to posts talking about the instant impact of social media, but I understand your overall points. I do offer some responses, however.

On the quality of the VU faculty and educational program, let me share a little insight that I didn't fully appreciate way back when: Despite my issues with VU as a student generally, I nevertheless knew that I was getting a quality classroom education, at a school where you actually knew your professors and vice versa. However, after graduating from VU and finding myself at NYU Law, a nationally ranked law school where at least a quarter of my classmates came from Ivy League schools and most of the rest from other prestigious colleges, I assumed that (1) the NYU profs must leave VU's in the dust; and (2) I was surrounded by peers who had received a superior undergraduate education. Well, I was quickly disabused of #1, when I soon discovered that a sterling reputation as a scholar did not necessarily equate into outstanding classroom teaching. But not until I returned to NYU six years after graduation as an entry-level instructor in its first-year legal writing/legal skills program and closely evaluated and graded the work of all of these Ivy League graduates did I realize that VU had prepared me well for the rigors of legal writing & analysis.

Many years later, I can't imagine that the quality of instruction at VU isn't at least comparable to what it was back then. The only problem, well documented here over the past few days, is the punishing teaching load still heaped upon its dedicated faculty.

As for the 240k in debt, that must be an extreme outlier figure. The last time I looked, the average total debt service for those in the 3 VU schools who took out loans was around 35-40k. That's still way too high than it should be, in my view, but 240k cannot be typical.

Now, as to VU kids doing road trips to IU or Illinois or Madison and wishing they could stay, of course that doesn't surprise me. Valparaiso -- the university and the town -- can't match the energy and variety of a Big 10 campus and its surroundings. But I'm betting that it's less about the dorms and more about the parties, hoopla, revelry and all the rest that goes with those big school settings. And, of course, a Big 10 school will have its share of famous faculty, big name speakers, concerts, entertainers, and all the rest.

So I understand why some students get a taste of other schools and find Valpo rather constricted by comparison. Indeed, while I was never a big partying guy, I was so ready to leave VU that I spent my final semester at its Cambridge program (where I did have the experience of a lifetime). And I was so excited to leave NW Indiana that, when NYU sent me an acceptance letter, I enthusiastically mailed in a deposit even though I'd never been to New York City.

But with the gift of hindsight, I understand that I received a very good education at VU, participated in rewarding extracurricular activities, spent a life-changing semester studying abroad, and made a significant cadre of lifelong friends. Against those measures, the dilapidated buildings, pull-out dorm beds, limited on-campus dining options, and sleepy surrounding town (Valparaiso has picked up since then) don't seem like big deals. So maybe it's with that ability to look back at what has endured about my education at VU that causes some sadness over what many students deem important in a college experience, to the point where those factors are sometimes determinative on college choice.

[ValpoDiaspora]

Instead of more griping. I am trying to build a network of Valpo football contacts to help alumni secure jobs post graduation ( think Wabash)

If anyone is a football alum would like to talk

If you haven't already, you might want to try getting contacts & resources from the athletics office or VU Alumni Association and from the Career Center. I know at least the Career person is a new interim this year as they were trying to rehire, but I'm guessing somebody somewhere at Valpo should have a list of past football students or maybe possible job networks that athletics students have found helpful? Maybe if you have energy around this and can make friends with one of these offices, they can help you get data from the other offices..

[historyman]

Must be nice to get some of the donations that Wash U StL got in this example.


https://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/news/2023/03/24/enterprise-holdings-chairman-gift-washington-u.html

Enterprise Holdings chairman, wife gift $15M to Washington U to boost student success

Andrew Taylor, executive chairman of car rental giant Enterprise Holdings, and his wife, Barbara, continued their family's support of Washington University with a $15 million gift to establish a center to support student success.

[ValpoDiaspora]

Probably apples and oranges, just different kinds of institutions.

I know I originally raised the comparison earlier in this thread since back in the day Wustl had been a local commuter school in the mid 20th century and then got a lot more financially stable. But this comparison is probably a red herring in the big picture they are just different type of universities. They're still both comprehensive universities, but WashU is only Division III for sports and isn't really known for any of the teams, though it is #1 in the US for investment metrics like "instructional wages per full time student" ($68,315). Valpo has Division I sports and a more lofty sports profile, though is #282 for instructional wages per full time student ($7,911).

So they are just engaging different kinds of priorities from student and alumni populations, which shows up in who applies for which kind of place and also what sort of donations come back on the other end.

[historyman]

Probably apples and oranges, just different kinds of institutions.

I know I originally raised the comparison earlier in this thread since back in the day Wustl had been a local commuter school in the mid 20th century and then got a lot more financially stable. But this comparison is probably a red herring in the big picture they are just different type of universities. They're still both comprehensive universities, but WashU is only Division III for sports and isn't really known for any of the teams, though it is #1 in the US for investment metrics like "instructional wages per full time student" ($68,315). Valpo has Division I sports and a more lofty sports profile, though is #282 for instructional wages per full time student ($7,911).

So they are just engaging different kinds of priorities from student and alumni populations, which shows up in who applies for which kind of place and also what sort of donations come back on the other end.

I totally understand what you are saying about the differences between Wash U & Valpo but $15M is $15M and I just wish Valpo had someone wanting to give to Valpo that kind of money from a place like Enterprise Rent-A-Car.

BTW, Enterprise is a company that advertises or at least used to advertise that they employed many former Div I athletes and a member of the Enterprise family bought the St Louis soccer entry in the MLS, who just won their 4th match in a row, an MLS expansion team record. The Enterprise Holdings group certainly has tied themselves to sports in general and St Louis sports in particular. They have the arena where Arch Madness & the St Louis Blues play, the Enterprise Center, named for them.

[vu72]

I totally understand what you are saying about the differences between Wash U & Valpo but $15M is $15M and I just wish Valpo had someone wanting to give to Valpo that kind of money from a place like Enterprise Rent-A-Car.

There was a $15 million dollar pledge near the end of the Forever Valpo campaign.

https://www.valpo.edu/forevervalpo/2020/02/06/historic-gift/

[wh]

Cost of Living in Valparaiso, Indiana

Our cost of living indices are based on a US average of 100. An amount below 100 means Valparaiso is cheaper than the US average. A cost of living index above 100 means Valparaiso, Indiana is more expensive.

Valparaiso cost of living is 100.8

https://www.bestplaces.net/cost_of_living/city/indiana/valparaiso

Faculty salaries at the midpoint nationally = Equity

Cost of living Valparaiso IN at the midpoint nationally = Equity

Combination of equitable factors = Symmetrical Equity

[usc4valpo]

Can we now conclude that the faculty salaries are not that out of line as  stated earlier that it was 30% below normal.

Anywhere you work, there is going to be issues, especially regarding compensation.

[David81]

Cost of Living in Valparaiso, Indiana

Our cost of living indices are based on a US average of 100. An amount below 100 means Valparaiso is cheaper than the US average. A cost of living index above 100 means Valparaiso, Indiana is more expensive.

Valparaiso cost of living is 100.8

https://www.bestplaces.net/cost_of_living/city/indiana/valparaiso

Faculty salaries at the midpoint nationally = Equity

Cost of living Valparaiso IN at the midpoint nationally = Equity

Combination of equitable factors = Symmetrical Equity

I'm not sure where this discussion concluded that VU faculty salaries were at a point of national equity, especially when considering teaching load. Anyway, a key statistic from the "best places" site is that Valparaiso housing prices (averaging ~$301k) are about 35% over the state average. Practically speaking, saving to buy a home in Valparaiso on a $50k salary for new faculty -- as Diaspora has explained -- is very difficult, especially in view of what appears to be a low ceiling on what one can expect to earn even as a tenured professor.

vufb16 noted that the average entry-level salary for a VU grad is $55,000, in the context of his point that someone going to a state school could do just as well at a much lower cost. What does it say when VU is paying entry-level, full-time, tenure-track faculty, most of whom have a Ph.D. in hand, less than the average VU graduate with a bachelor's degree?

[usc4valpo]

David81 - in this discussion there needs to be comparable metrics and evaluate the responsibilities. Working as a professor at Valpo to primarily educate is much different than a position in industry. In my career and experiences I saw coworkers leaving industry to go to academia because they were tired and frustrated with the politics and stress. However, I have seen the opposite of people employed in academia goin to industry for different political reasons and in cases more pay or a new challenge.

Back to employment as a professor, not in industry - are Valparaiso professors compensation way below the norm?

[David81]

David81 - in this discussion there needs to be comparable metrics and evaluate the responsibilities. Working as a professor at Valpo to primarily educate is much different than a position in industry. In my career and experiences I saw coworkers leaving industry to go to academia because they were tired and frustrated with the politics and stress. However, I have seen the opposite of people employed in academia goin to industry for different political reasons and in cases more pay or a new challenge.

Back to employment as a professor, not in industry - are Valparaiso professors compensation way below the norm?

usc4valpo, no one is suggesting a corporate-type salary for full-time academics. Nor is the $55k average salary for new VU grads limited to those in high-paying vocations. It includes both the entry-level engineering graduate and the entry-level theatre major. The juxtaposition is a fair one.

In any event, wouldn't you agree that VU, as a Christian university embracing values and ethics, should pay entering full-time faculty a salary that anticipates at least a serviceable middle-class lifestyle, assuming satisfactory performance and accompanying raises? Or is this where suddenly the "market" supplants values and ethics as the only factor considered? If so, VU professors on that market in both the liberal arts and the professional disciplines have found better salaries and lighter teaching loads elsewhere. Thus, unless Valpo wants to be a proverbial "starter school" or "farm system," giving up on the idea of a base of dedicated, tenured faculty, maybe it should think about paying better salaries to its faculty.

Keep in mind that we're not talking about Wall Street raises & bonuses here. A whopping 20% salary adjustment for profs earning $50k translates into a $60k salary the next year, hardly the stuff of lives of luxury.

[usc4valpo]

I guess I am lost, which is nothing new. Are Valpo professors, based on their specialty, significantly (30%) underpaid compared to the national average? I also believe compensation should be primarily market based for that position. 
Perhaps we should compare salaries to those at Drake, Bradley, Evansville and Creighton.

Regarding cost of living factors, I understand, and this challenge is present everywhere. Valparaiso is in the middle of the road for cost of living.

[crusadermoe]

The personnel expenses for faculty is an interesting one (sort of....) and yes, those schools seem like good peers for faculty. But from non-university business world I don't have much to say.

It seems like that issue size (maybe a $5k-10k variance per faculty member for maybe an estimate of 70-80 non-professional relevant faculty affected?) might pale next to the freshman dorm, the paintings sale, and the coach buyout.  I agree with WH that the approximate $1m cost of the coach buyout seems out of line with the severity of those other issues if it was NOT donor funded.  Most of the revenue gains from a coaching change could be gradual over 3-4 years even though our fellow board members live and breathe VU basketball sometimes. In terms of benchmarking the dorm commitment it seems we should compare ourselves to the same peer schools as competitors in academics and assess their realistic enrollment forecasts.

[DejaVU]

I guess I am lost, which is nothing new. Are Valpo professors, based on their specialty, significantly (30%) underpaid compared to the national average? I also believe compensation should be primarily market based for that position.

I am not sure who mentioned this 30% underpay first but I know I did in an earlier post. And again, to clarify it one more time, the figure 30% is correct, I can vouch for that BUT in comparison not to the national average but with the average of our peer institutions. There is a list of peer institutions which our administration uses as a benchmark for many things  such as: teaching load, student/faculty ratio, percentage of tenured professors versus adjuncts, research expectations etc...A national average is not really fair because you will have in that basket completely different type of institutions. By that metric a full prof pulling 150K at Purdue University is criminally overpaid when in comparison to Big Ten schools (which is the correct comparison given what is expected of him) he earns close to the average.


This peer list exists for a reason. I am sick and tired to look at the best and brightest on that list when it comes to demands and then look at the bottom when it comes to compensation. In fact, I know of a colleague who said something along the lines "you can't pay more then how about ask us to do less".


Also the cost of living adjustment is taken into account and we are still around 30% under. Several years ago they did use the cost of living adjustment to show that the underpay is not that bad. Now even with that correction we are still that much under, again, compared to peers.


In any case, the reality is that this is not Padilla fault. This is a problem neglected for decades which now with the bad economy (inflation, etc) on top of that it shows now a very ugly face. If they had addressed this issue gradually over the last decades maybe we would have been now say 10% below the mean and people would have accepted that these are just bad economic times.


Whoever wants this university to NOT fail must understand that we already have stuff (I don't know how many) that qualifies for food stamps. If we continue this lousy approach (come up with a plan in a year, implemented in 3 years and maybe we see some uptick in 5 years, etc...) I would not be surprised to hear  about even junior faculty qualifying for assistance...Who knows...Would there be people still working at VU then? Sure. Would you send your kid to that kind of school?


As I mentioned in earlier posts, it's not about me here. I am not in the worst position. What riles me up is the embarrassing aspect of the whole thing for many years now. This is what I hate. I even refused long time ago to participate in search committees. We cater and lure the best possible, we snatch them for an interview and then we embarrass ourselves when the conversation gets to the compensation part.


Put it differently, if 15 or so of our peer are 30% above us, it is us doing something fundamentally wrong not them and not nature.

[DejaVU]

Dejavu, do you think there is still time to change tack? I agree with you on all of this but where it gets discouraging is that the university ought to have put some effort into catching up in the 90s and early 2000s when there was still applicant energy bolstering from below and some good PR wind from the Drews etc. That was the time to invest in bringing the university up to par with peer institutions and to press into hiring and keeping the best ... But  now after so many years, it will be much harder to do since the effects of all the mediocrity have set in so much and everything feels to be in a tailspin. So I worry the window has closed or is nearly closed — since is it really possible for a university to bring itself up to par when the enrollment is already in such steep decline? Now everything is contracting, and even if the university had a lightbulb moment about how to be a functional institution that incentivizes excellence and commitment, unfortunately the speed of everything swirling round the drain has a gravity to it that makes it harder to pop free of . Do you think it can still be done?

I really don't know but I lost completely my trust in those leading this institution. If they will prove me wrong I will be the first to knock on their doors, give thanks and raise money for their statues. My status, my seniority and many other factors converge into me probably  staying here and, hopefully, the time horizon is in such a way that I will retire before the ship sinks. But that is a bet like any other.   


There are still solutions but I don't think there are people determined and capable to implement them. What needs to be done is an emergency one time across the board raise to bring it above the embarrassing level. Something substantial that restores some faith in this place. Even if it means increasing the debt, selling more stuff, I don't know. See, if those in power really believe the place is in danger to be closed they may have a different sense of urgency...




I don't see this sense of urgency...Instead is the same old thing: let's have a committee look at the issue, in 3-4 months that committee reports something on a bunch of slides, then we propose some plan and discuss that plan some more, then we have target to start that plan 5 years from now. That's what they do right now. 


I also believe the faculty as a whole are to blame. In this place I don't see many holding the higher ups feet on the fire. Except maybe to painting issue. But ask yourself this: if an entire department (a critical one) comes at the president door and says: give us 10% raise now or we all resign today. Something tells me solutions will be found at least partial ones. Now, if only 1-2 resign in the middle of year (that happened) they don't care as long as the remaining suckers pick up the slack.


But, see, professors, by the nature of their profession, are not the kind of people who are comfortable having this type of blackmail negotiations. Instead they are good at dialogue, arguments, making committees and lots and lots of discussions.

[David81]

I really don't know but I lost completely my trust in those leading this institution. If they will prove me wrong I will be the first to knock on their doors, give thanks and raise money for their statues. My status, my seniority and many other factors converge into me probably  staying here and, hopefully, the time horizon is in such a way that I will retire before the ship sinks. But that is a bet like any other.   

There are still solutions but I don't think there are people determined and capable to implement them. What needs to be done is an emergency one time across the board raise to bring it above the embarrassing level. Something substantial that restores some faith in this place. Even if it means increasing the debt, selling more stuff, I don't know. See, if those in power really believe the place is in danger to be closed they may have a different sense of urgency...

I don't see this sense of urgency...Instead is the same old thing: let's have a committee look at the issue, in 3-4 months that committee reports something on a bunch of slides, then we propose some plan and discuss that plan some more, then we have target to start that plan 5 years from now. That's what they do right now. 

I also believe the faculty as a whole are to blame. In this place I don't see many holding the higher ups feet on the fire. Except maybe to painting issue. But ask yourself this: if an entire department (a critical one) comes at the president door and says: give us 10% raise now or we all resign today. Something tells me solutions will be found at least partial ones. Now, if only 1-2 resign in the middle of year (that happened) they don't care as long as the remaining suckers pick up the slack.

But, see, professors, by the nature of their profession, are not the kind of people who are comfortable having this type of blackmail negotiations. Instead they are good at dialogue, arguments, making committees and lots and lots of discussions.

Outside of a circle of prestigious schools where, basically, faculty entitlement tends to run high, higher ed faculty are often not great advocates. The skills that make them dedicated, effective educators and scholars are not the skills that translate into being effective at institutional boxing when it's called for. In such settings, the ones who stand up, often stand out.

[usc4valpo]

22 - I understand your frustration and I would not want to be in Padilla's position right now. However, don't make conclusions on the coaching buyout on how it was conducted. The coaching change was imperative, and it not, Valpo's perspective makes us look very weak regarding a commitment to success. listen to Small's video on YouTube to understand the importance.   

[usc4valpo]

Dude, that's cold.

Here's my point regarding the basketball program - if you want to be a successful D1 program, you need to operate it as such. Padilla and Small are taking the necessary actions to improve the program, which is required for success. If not, then do not have a D1 program. Historically, the basketball program has done much in name and recognition to Valparaiso University, and the commitment from the university to the program has not been mutual.

Second - regarding declining enrollment at mid size private universities and Valpo in particular, it's a big problem, and monetarily far, far more than any payout to ML. The payout is crumbs compared to the big picture.

Fourth, there's a $250M endowment so Valpo is going to stay afloat for awhile.

How do you keep the university or a business sustainable? Determine your identity and focus and build on your strengths.

[David81]

Also, as a point of comparison, a new Valparaiso public school educator now earns $51,000, which is more than many entering VU full-time professors. A 22-year old with a bachelors degree earns more than a 30-year old with doctorate in tow.

There's no plausible defense for the faculty pay scale at VU, especially with the super heavy teaching loads. It's basically the same attitude that has prevailed for decades: The privilege of teaching (and more teaching) is compensation in and of itself, and if you don't agree, there's the door. That may have been defensible during the days of a ramshackle physical plant and dirt-cheap tuition and a fundraising operation so inadequate that engineering students had to raise $$$ for their own building. Genteel academic poverty is more acceptable when it's the norm across the board. But it's a shinier campus with hefty tuition, and somehow the latter isn't translating into more respectable salaries.

[usc4valpo]

what is a ballpark salary for a 30-year old with doctorate in tow? and what is tow?