Drake in town 2/4 6 pm

[tjjvalpo]

What is sad about this outcome is that actually we never trailed in regulation and there was three ties. We lead for over 38 minutes before they tied us on the three free throws.

As far attendance, I think the 6 pm starts have affected the attendance, as well. I have missed several games this year because of that start time and I have difficult time getting others to go with me.

[VULB#62]

As far attendance, I think the 6 pm starts have affected the attendance, as well. I have missed several games this year because of that start time and I have difficult time getting others to go with me.

^^This^^

CAVEAT:  I'm too far away to physically attend games in the ARC, but............ The typical work day is 9-5. Usually there is a commute of some length. Usually families need some time together to organize before going somewhere.  Usually there's gotta be some dinner or maybe just a quick snack?  Then ya gotta get out the door and do this casually all in under an hour from quitting time to make the tip off. Hell, I'm in the same time zone and have seldom been able to click into the start of any game. I also assume some on-campus classes stretch to 5 or 6 as well.  This is brainless and counterproductive to fostering increases in attendance. 

Out of curiosity, I checked just  the Bradley and Drake schedules. They appear to have evening tip offs at 7pm. And their evening  away games, except for Valpo, also seem to be 7pm.  WHY???

[usc4valpo]

I have been wondering about the 6pm starts. Maybe it's for travel?

[oklahomamick]

Enjoyed watching the Drake game.  Wished for a different outcome, but you can see tremendous improvements from earlier in the year.  Loved seeing more people in the stands and the student section. 

Also loved the Phillips66 and sonic commercials.  Does everyone get those who is it because I was watching from Oklahoma I get local commercials???

Hated the shot selection on our very last procession. 

Felt kind of bad for the guys.  They played hard and I wished they got the outcome they wanted. 

One thing that stays pretty accurate.  Bet Valpo 1st half and fade in the second half. 

[JD24]

[tweet]1622284197695029251[/tweet]Yet, when Valpo needed a three to tie the game at the end of the second overtime, Nelson wasn't even an option. Edwards dribbled the ball across half court to the sideline in front of the VU bench, where he was stuck by himself while Nelson was clear across the court standing on the opposite sideline completely out of the play. Result: a low percentage 3-point shooter hoists an almost impossible off-balance shot at the buzzer instead of giving the team's hottest shooter during the night a chance.

I wouldn't be surprised to find out the ball was supposed to go to Nelson. He and King ran a scissors with Nelson running for the corner and King coming out up top where he could receive a pass and move it to the corner. Edwards just ran the ball out of the play...or frankly...any play.

[historyman]

I wouldn't be surprised to find out the ball was supposed to go to Nelson. He and King ran a scissors with Nelson running for the corner and King coming out up top where he could receive a pass and move it to the corner. Edwards just ran the ball out of the play...or frankly...any play.

And this is where the head coach has to OVER EMPHASIZE to the athlete what must happen and the reasons why. Edwards has been on the team all year. It isn't getting better in these areas.

It was great to see Maximus hit so many threes!!!!

[valpopal]

I wouldn't be surprised to find out the ball was supposed to go to Nelson. He and King ran a scissors with Nelson running for the corner and King coming out up top where he could receive a pass and move it to the corner. Edwards just ran the ball out of the play...or frankly...any play.

And this is where the head coach has to OVER EMPHASIZE to the athlete what must happen and the reasons why. Edwards has been on the team all year. It isn't getting better in these areas.

It was great to see Maximus hit so many threes!!!!

Thanks to Paul, here is a link to the "play" (a word I use loosely).
[tweet]1622061880125673472[/tweet]

[usc4valpo]

What the ... we gotta do better than that.

[JD24]

I wouldn't be surprised to find out the ball was supposed to go to Nelson. He and King ran a scissors with Nelson running for the corner and King coming out up top where he could receive a pass and move it to the corner. Edwards just ran the ball out of the play...or frankly...any play.

And this is where the head coach has to OVER EMPHASIZE to the athlete what must happen and the reasons why. Edwards has been on the team all year. It isn't getting better in these areas. It was great to see Maximus hit so many threes!!!!

Thanks to Paul, here is a link to the "play" (a word I use loosely). [tweet]1622061880125673472[/tweet]

From that angle it looks like Nelson didn't move quick enough. King was signalling to him to switch so King could go up top and (likely) give it to Nelson in the corner. At least I think that's what was supposed to happen. Fairly standard reverse scissors.

[Dr. T]

Yes - I watched the game + 2 OTs.
Later, I watched the press conference. Personally, I did not care for the way Matt said to Ben, "Be careful," when asked about the officiating. I would get it if Ben were a rookie, new-to-Valpo transfer player, or known for letting his emotions get the best of him. But, not Ben.

Am I pulling at straws with this critique? Yes. But, that's similar to what we're doing concerning this possession or that possession. Beyond thankful - as a VU alum & fan - Ben stuck it out here at VU. What an incredible young man - what a role model for kids. What a testament to his upbringing and approach to life. I've been a fan of his since he stepped on the court. But he will surely be missed based on his on-the-court AND off-the-court reputation.

[wh]

[tweet]1622284197695029251[/tweet]

Watching Maximus grow in confidence over the course of the season has been a joy. I think he has a great future ahead.

[vu84v2]

I agree about Maximus and it was nice to see. However, a lot of his open looks were due to insufficient attention from Drake's defenders (not criticizing Max...he made the shots!). I have posted about the lack of a system under Matt Lottich and I don't feel he is going to get many open looks in the current offensive system.

[David81]

At times, VU shows tantalizing signs of being able to score a surprise or two in Arch Madness, if it can just execute a tiny bit better. Maybe it can still happen.

In any event, a look at the Drake roster (https://godrakebulldogs.com/sports/mens-basketball/roster) reminds us of how a mid-major can be competitive amidst the musical chairs of the transfer portal. Among other things, it appears this current team snagged many of its top transfers earlier in their college careers, which means they got them for 2-4 seasons (esp. with the COVID year) rather than 1-2 seasons. Roman Penn, their excellent point guard and Hammond Bishop Noll grad, is in his 6th year of college ball and 4th year with Drake.

Of course, they also somehow managed to get Tucker DeVries, Iowa's Mr. Basketball and a 6-7 wing, who (if he stays) could turn out to be Drake's Bryce Drew in terms of program impact. It goes back to the reality of needing a true star quality player to lead the way.

Ben Krikke has grown into an MVC standout, and maybe we'd be singing his praises even more if he wasn't so exhausted at the end of close games and had a better supporting cast. I wonder if improvements by current players and other changes could make a potential 5th year something memorable.

[VULB#62]

Ben Krikke has grown into an MVC standout, and maybe we'd be singing his praises even more if he wasn't so exhausted at the end of close games and had a better supporting cast. I wonder if improvements by current players and other changes could make a potential 5th year something memorable.

Great question David. My basketball-ignorant input to this scenario goes something like this...

1 - Since he got to Valpo, Ben has been forced, through a lack of a full-time, legit 5, to play out of position.  Last year, he got to play his real position at times, but as soon as Kithier went to the bench or couldn't suit up, Ben was banging down low against opponent's 5s. That can wear a guy out. This year, I thought that maybe Paul would take over the Defensive Big role and give Ben a breather. But Paul has disappeared since the beginning of the year and the other bigs just can't play at this level it appears. Ben is a natural talent, but he is not Superman and not built to take a pounding all game down low.

2 - To your other thought, even given the current personnel, Ben has some raw talent to support him (emphasis on raw) right now. Maybe we don't have the greatest shooters, but we have a good collection of athletes. It's not that these athletes are subpar, it's that these athletes, each with their own individual talents, have not been meshed into a system that optimizes those talents in a disciplined, coordinated and consistent manner. Even with Ben out with fouls, the replay of the final play of the Drake game glaringly illustrates the lack of a disciplined effort to get someone open for a good shot.  I saw three guys just standing at one point and what looked to me as wondering "I wonder what do I do now?"  There was no determined, assertive set of aggressive moves/screens, etc. resembling a planned attack. That's coaching, man.

3 - Ben has demonstrated an incredible sense of loyalty to this team. But I think he knows under current circumstances 2023-24 will be just more of the same frustrations. You mention "other changes."  My guess is that Ben knows a fifth year is important to his development and possibly going pro. He's certainly demonstrated the talent that would be attractive to the right P5 team looking to immediately fill that last slot that would make the difference in an NCAA run. But that still would be a crap shoot for him. OTOH, if a coaching change is made at Valpo, the new coach could use Ben's familiarity with current teammates as leverage to keep him in a known, kinda comfortable environment.  BUT, that new coach has to be one whose record, philosophy/approach and coaching chops generate Ben's respect and buy-in.

In conclusion your honor 😉, I submit for your consideration the following four interrelated final arguements:

Ben will not immediately turn pro. There's more work to be done.
Ben will not return to Valpo under the current circumstances - he wants to finish his college career as a winner.
Ben will seek the challenge of playing a 5th year somewhere to further develop his skill portfolio.
Ben will consider a 5th year at somewhere (even Valpo) if his new coach is someone he respects and believes in for his coaching chops - he wants to finish his college career as a winner.

[historyman]

Of course, they also somehow managed to get Tucker DeVries, Iowa's Mr. Basketball and a 6-7 wing, who (if he stays) could turn out to be Drake's Bryce Drew in terms of program impact.

I'm detecting a bit of facetiousness in your comments but just in case someone may not know, Tucker is the son of Drake's head coach, Darian DeVries, and is very likely to stay 4/5 years (his whole eligibility).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darian_DeVries

[valpotx]

Someone mentioned that Ben's girlfriend is a current VU volleyball player with one more year left.  If Ben doesn't go pro, and his gf stays at Valpo, he might be back.  It wouldn't be the wisest decision on his part, but he's in his 20s, and we know what drives decision-making at that age

[AlaskaCrusader19]

Ben Krikke has grown into an MVC standout, and maybe we'd be singing his praises even more if he wasn't so exhausted at the end of close games and had a better supporting cast. I wonder if improvements by current players and other changes could make a potential 5th year something memorable.

Ben will not immediately turn pro. There's more work to be done.
Ben will not return to Valpo under the current circumstances - he wants to finish his college career as a winner.
Ben will seek the challenge of playing a 5th year somewhere to further develop his skill portfolio.
Ben will consider a 5th year at somewhere (even Valpo) if his new coach is someone he respects and believes in for his coaching chops - he wants to finish his college career as a winner.

I would have to be really surprised if he came back to VU for another season. I'd imagine he could get the chance to play at the P5 level, and it would be hard to fault someone for chasing that.

[David81]

So...part of the speculation on whether Krikke returns for a 5th season should include an assessment of his pro potential.

With Alec Peters as the most obvious point of comparison, does Krikke have NBA potential? I'd say it's quite a reach, because he doesn't have a 3-pt shot and rebounds more like a 3-4 tweener than a genuine 4, whereas Peters was very strong both on the boards and on the 3s. But Krikke should have some attractive international opportunities.

If the NBA is unrealistic, then the case for finding a P5 school for a 5th collegiate year starts to dissolve a bit. And if he's got any personal reason to stay at VU (like a relationship), then he can be assured that plenty of VU players have had successful international pro careers. Maybe if other things start looking more optimistic, he stays.

[valpotx]

So...part of the speculation on whether Krikke returns for a 5th season should include an assessment of his pro potential.

With Alec Peters as the most obvious point of comparison, does Krikke have NBA potential? I'd say it's quite a reach, because he doesn't have a 3-pt shot and rebounds more like a 3-4 tweener than a genuine 4, whereas Peters was very strong both on the boards and on the 3s. But Krikke should have some attractive international opportunities.

If the NBA is unrealistic, then the case for finding a P5 school for a 5th collegiate year starts to dissolve a bit. And if he's got any personal reason to stay at VU (like a relationship), then he can be assured that plenty of VU players have had successful international pro careers. Maybe if other things start looking more optimistic, he stays.

Exactly, there is no reason for him to consider P5.  He is going to have plenty of European offers from top leagues, as he fits their mold of a big man.  He is good, but not NBA good.

[AlaskaCrusader19]

So...part of the speculation on whether Krikke returns for a 5th season should include an assessment of his pro potential.

With Alec Peters as the most obvious point of comparison, does Krikke have NBA potential? I'd say it's quite a reach, because he doesn't have a 3-pt shot and rebounds more like a 3-4 tweener than a genuine 4, whereas Peters was very strong both on the boards and on the 3s. But Krikke should have some attractive international opportunities.

If the NBA is unrealistic, then the case for finding a P5 school for a 5th collegiate year starts to dissolve a bit. And if he's got any personal reason to stay at VU (like a relationship), then he can be assured that plenty of VU players have had successful international pro careers. Maybe if other things start looking more optimistic, he stays.

Exactly, there is no reason for him to consider P5.  He is going to have plenty of European offers from top leagues, as he fits their mold of a big man.  He is good, but not NBA good.

There are certainly reasons to consider P5 programs. The chance to play on a bigger stage in better environments. Depending on where he would go, the much more likely chance to play in the NCAA Tournament. I would presume that NIL opportunities at P5 programs are much more substantial than what would be available at Valparaiso.

[vu72]

There are certainly reasons to consider P5 programs. The chance to play on a bigger stage in better environments. Depending on where he would go, the much more likely chance to play in the NCAA Tournament. I would presume that NIL opportunities at P5 programs are much more substantial than what would be available at Valparaiso.

Probably true, but consider the case of one Isaiah Mosley.  Mosley was perhaps the best player in the Valley last year (we should know as he averaged over 25 ppg over three games against us) and certainly would have been in the running for POY this year.  He opted to take his game from Missouri State to Missouri where, hw seems to be in trouble with their coach and was benched for their most recent game.  He has only started a few games and now is averaging 9.6 ppg for the Tigers.  This is not the stuff that gets you noticed by the NBA, and he has NBA talent.  The grass is not always greener...

[usc4valpo]

the last few post were varying in opinion and excellent information. Ben is not NBA material, but sometimes you get better with better competition or where there is a gap for a higher conference team. I guess you have to analyze accordingly.

At his age, I hope not and doubt he is making a decision strictly because of his girlfriend. At his young age, you gotta expand your horizons.

[JD24]

Krikke's game is not only more suited to overseas than it is the NBA but it's also suited more to overseas than most P5 programs. Unless he can find a program which is willing to run things as for instance, Loyola did with Krutwig, he's a tough fit. He's too small, slow afoot, not a great defender nor is he a great shooter from deep. He works for Valpo because they don't have anything much else...or know how to use it depending on your point of view.

Re girlfriend. Girlfriends can transfer as well. However the gf may keep in in the US. I think that is likely a fairly small factor at this point.   

[Dr. T]

While it's understandable to speculate on this young man's future, I would not hypothesize how his personal life impacts his decisions. Unless you know Ben personally, such thoughts are mere conjecture. He's a human being with a real life on & off the court. The only "wrong" decision does not align with what he & his family / significant others deem best.

[usc4valpo]

Dr. T - just sharing my pearls of wisdom regarding life.