Facilities

[VU2014]

The same Indiana State beat writer just excoriated the ARC in his article. https://twitter.com/tribstarsports/status/959049968060215296 "I said it last year when ISU visited Valparaiso, when the addition of the Crusaders to the MVC was just speculation and not reality, but the Activities and Recreation Center needs some upgrades as it just isn't MVC-worthy. The stands there look past their prime, from the seats themselves to the shop-worn wooden floors they sit on. There's no seats in one of the end zones and Valpo does it best by putting vendors and tables in there, but it doesn't look right. It didn't help that the crowd just barely cracked 2,000. The bleachers on the second level on the south side of the ARC are massive and I can see where the atmosphere would be tough there if it was full, but the amenities are spartan even by MVC standards. Hopefully, Valpo invests in the facility for some upgrades."

Couldn't agree more with the assessment on the ARC... I've said it before, but there are some easy "relatively" inexpensive fixes that could be put in place to make the ARC better. How about replace all bleachers: make the North, West and South all chair-backs in a horseshoe, put bleachers on the open east end for the Student section and replace the bleachers in the upper level with chair-backs. With wider aisles/seats, you will likely lower the overall capacity, but that will result in a fuller house and a much more comfortable environment to see a game. That will vastly improve game day experience for all and it wont (shouldn't) cost so much that it can't be done in a years time.

I want a brand new ARC as much as others, but that's a 10-20 year project it seems. No reason to not improve what you can now while you plan for the future.

I didn't see anything untrue in his article. When the standard back-handed compliment for your facility is that it is "cozy like a high school gym" that's a sign that it's not up to current D-1 standards. At some point, you need to quit getting bent out of shape at the people who point this out as if they're some sort of outliers and do something about it.

I don't disagree with anything but I'm just hoping the higher-ups take notice... *action*

[wh]

Gee, the ARC needs major upgrades.  No kidding.  We've only been talking about this ad nauseam for what - the past 10 years now?  We don't need some Tier 4 state school yokel from Terre Haute, Indiana with a nice facility/terrible basketball program dichotomy lecturing us about it.

Effective communication = the right message, delivered at the right time, by the right person. This guy ain't it. 

[VULB#62]

But OTOH, the more external criticism the ARC gets, perhaps that will move the needle more with the Valpo administration than obviously we've been able to do in those 10 years. 

[VU2014]

I doubt President Heckler and most of the Board members have ever seen this message board or even care.

If President Heckler ever did see it this would be his reaction:

[EddieCabot]

Gee, the ARC needs major upgrades.  No kidding.  We've only been talking about this ad nauseam for what - the past 10 years now?  We don't need some Tier 4 state school yokel from Terre Haute, Indiana with a nice facility/terrible basketball program dichotomy lecturing us about it.

Effective communication = the right message, delivered at the right time, by the right person. This guy ain't it.

[wh]

Gee, the ARC needs major upgrades.  No kidding.  We've only been talking about this ad nauseam for what - the past 10 years now?  We don't need some Tier 4 state school yokel from Terre Haute, Indiana with a nice facility/terrible basketball program dichotomy lecturing us about it.

Effective communication = the right message, delivered at the right time, by the right person. This guy ain't it.

Exactly.

[NativeCheesehead]

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[bigmosmithfan1]

But OTOH, the more external criticism the ARC gets, perhaps that will move the needle more with the Valpo administration than obviously we've been able to do in those 10 years.

Exactly this. The lack of more than a handful of full-time visiting media in the HL or Mid-Con made it very easy to paper over this issue as the VU narrative of "homey home-court advantage" wasn't really challenged aside from a couple of offhand comments here and there when VU hosted the HL tourney.

By contrast *every* team in the Valley has their own media contingent. All of them are used to working in - and the teams on their beat playing in - much nicer facilities across the board. To expect them to pipe down to spare VU's feelings seems unreasonable, when again, VU has given ten years of lip service on this issue but taken no discernible action. Fix it so people can shut up about it, or learn to deal with the (accurate) criticism.

[wh]

But OTOH, the more external criticism the ARC gets, perhaps that will move the needle more with the Valpo administration than obviously we've been able to do in those 10 years.

Exactly this. The lack of more than a handful of full-time visiting media in the HL or Mid-Con made it very easy to paper over this issue as the VU narrative of "homey home-court advantage" wasn't really challenged aside from a couple of offhand comments here and there when VU hosted the HL tourney.

By contrast *every* team in the Valley has their own media contingent. All of them are used to working in - and the teams on their beat playing in - much nicer facilities across the board. To expect them to pipe down to spare VU's feelings seems unreasonable, when again, VU has given ten years of lip service on this issue but taken no discernible action. Fix it so people can shut up about it, or learn to deal with the (accurate) criticism.

Hmm, I never stopped to consider that this guy could be a useful idiot.

[VU2014]

I doubt the University higher-ups will cave to any sort of public pressure. Maybe if a large enough portion of the alumni base supplied pressure but even then I don't think they'd take notice until wealth donors want to see action taken

[vu72]

I doubt the University higher-ups will cave to any sort of public pressure. Maybe if a large enough portion of the alumni base supplied pressure but even then I don't think they'd take notice until wealth donors want to see action taken

An interesting point. Given the nature of Valpo as a high end academic institution, I doubt a majority of alumni would ever be in favor of building a new ARC versus a new science building or a new library.  Our alumni base (about 50,000) finds basketball success interesting but not a requirement to support the value of their degree.  I think this is short sited but is a fact nonetheless.

[VU2014]

Academics always comes first as it should but I don't think the University realizes how important the basketball teams is or beneficial it could be. My college buddies and I make a couple trips to the ARC a year. It's not too far of a trip for me but I have friends that fly into Chicago to hang out and catch a game. We feel a sense of connection to our alma mater through the Basketball team. Alums generally aren't flying in for anything else other then Homecoming or maybe a huge Football game like the Butler game. At least this is my experience.

The Basketball Team is an asset to this University and it's well worth the investment because of the intangible benefits it brings. This is a little off topic but I really want to see the Athletic Department get the student body more engaged and invested in the Basketball program. Build that strong connection to the basketball team while they are on campus.

[vu72]

Academics always comes first as it should but I don't think the University realizes how important the basketball teams is or beneficial it could be. My college buddies and I make a couple trips to the ARC a year. It's not too far of a trip for me but I have friends that fly into Chicago to hang out and catch a game. We feel a sense of connection to our alma mater through the Basketball team. Alums generally aren't flying in for anything else other then Homecoming or maybe a huge Football game like the Butler game. At least this is my experience.

The Basketball Team is an asset to this University and it's well worth the investment because of the intangible benefits it brings. This is a little off topic but I really want to see the Athletic Department get the student body more engaged and invested in the Basketball program. Build that strong connection to the basketball team while they are on campus.

Well said. Couldn't agree more.

[vuny98]

Academics always comes first as it should but I don't think the University realizes how important the basketball teams is or beneficial it could be. My college buddies and I make a couple trips to the ARC a year. It's not too far of a trip for me but I have friends that fly into Chicago to hang out and catch a game. We feel a sense of connection to our alma mater through the Basketball team. Alums generally aren't flying in for anything else other then Homecoming or maybe a huge Football game like the Butler game. At least this is my experience. The Basketball Team is an asset to this University and it's well worth the investment because of the intangible benefits it brings. This is a little off topic but I really want to see the Athletic Department get the student body more engaged and invested in the Basketball program. Build that strong connection to the basketball team while they are on campus.

Well said. Couldn't agree more.

And with more and more games on ESPN in the MVC, plus our history of success, it is the best marketing tool possible for a small school like Valpo. Only a matter of time as the ARC continues to age that this marketing tool starts to work against us and people see the less than modern facilities at the ARC. It's not a far leap for potential students to watch a game on TV and think "well their arena is kind of a dump, I bet the rest of the school is like that too". It's what gets shown to the national stage more than anything and we are not putting our best foot forward.

[FWalum]

On my way to the Concordia vs Angola high school game last night, I was invited by a friend to see the new MIT Center at Trine University.  We have talked on this board about Trine building an ice arena and starting a hockey program, so I wanted to see how this sleepy D3 university had grown to 3,400 undergrad and 5,000 total students while building a new 5,000 seat football stadium, 3500 seat basketball center and an ice arena all in the last 7 years.  I had not been on campus since coaching at Indiana Tech and my how things have changed.  I know that these types of facilities would not meet VU's needs, but for a similar sized university with a much smaller endowment to sink this kind of money into athletic facilities it does make me wonder why we have invested so little in these areas.  Don't get me wrong, I am extremely proud of VU's Lutheran heritage, academic achievements and reputation. I believe that academics should take priority over athletics, but I also believe that our athletic programs, in particular our Men's basketball program, has become our main marketing tool and the only reason why many people know the name of Valpo.
MTI Center basketball, bowling and E-sports facility
Trine Thunder Ice Arena
Zollner Athletic Stadium for Football, Soccer and Lacrosse
Zollner Golf Course Located on campus and known as one of Northeast Indiana's premier golf courses, site of the 2012 NCAA Women′s Golf National Championships.

My picture of the MTI Center from yesterday afternoon.

[VU2014]

And with more and more games on ESPN in the MVC, plus our history of success, it is the best marketing tool possible for a small school like Valpo. Only a matter of time as the ARC continues to age that this marketing tool starts to work against us and people see the less than modern facilities at the ARC. It's not a far leap for potential students to watch a game on TV and think "well their arena is kind of a dump, I bet the rest of the school is like that too". It's what gets shown to the national stage more than anything and we are not putting our best foot forward.

Not only that but it's an eye sore see student section empty. I can not stress enough how important it is to get the students to rally around the team. Instead of giving away free towels and foam fingers build the culture where it become an expectation to show up in the student section. Make it an event. Something needs to happen. Get a bus at every dorm to drop kids off at the ARC if need be. Build traditions and a culture.

[VU2014]

That is a really nice little arena. It kind of reminds me of the Knapp Center and O'rena in one without the eye sore black court. I love how they have the big window to let in the natural light.

If we ever renovated the ARC it would be cool to have some natural light and window shine into the arena. What would be really cool is having one of the "endzones" walls of the arena pay homage to the Chapel of Resurrection with similar stain glass dimension for the wall letting in the natural light. It would look iconic and unique to just Valparaiso University if done correctly.

Is it just me or would that look really cool? That would definitely be impressive and would sell recruits.




The steps could be like the bleachers and over overlooking the bleachers would be stained glass windows like the chapels. That would be really cool.

[ValpoHoops]

If we ever renovated the ARC it would be cool to have some natural light and window shine into the arena. What would be really cool is we could have one the "endzones" of the arena walls pay homage to the Chapel of Resurrection how a  similar stain glass dimension for the wall letting in the natural light. It would also look iconic and unique to just Valparaiso University if done correctly.

Is it just me or would that look really cool? That would definitely be impressive and would sell recruits.

Glass on the end of an arena is never a good idea.

Think volleyball in the evening in September. Or a 3:00 basketball tip in January. Especially an arena that sits east/west.

The idea is cool, but not practical.

[VU2014]

I'd move the Volleyball games to the Hilltop gym if I were in charge. Also I'd imagine the walls would be far enough and high enough back that a ball wouldn't hit it. If we had a complete reno we could flip the direction of the court maybe.

[VULB#62]

On my way to the Concordia vs Angola high school game last night, I was invited by a friend to see the new MIT Center at Trine University.  We have talked on this board about Trine building an ice arena and starting a hockey program, so I wanted to see how this sleepy D3 university had grown to 3,400 undergrad and 5,000 total students while building a new 5,000 seat football stadium, 3500 seat basketball center and an ice arena all in the last 7 years.  I had not been on campus since coaching at Indiana Tech and my how things have changed.  I know that these types of facilities would not meet VU's needs, but for a similar sized university with a much smaller endowment to sink this kind of money into athletic facilities it does make me wonder why we have invested so little in these areas.  Don't get me wrong, I am extremely proud of VU's Lutheran heritage, academic achievements and reputation. I believe that academics should take priority over athletics, but I also believe that our athletic programs, in particular our Men's basketball program, has become our main marketing tool and the only reason why many people know the name of Valpo.
MTI Center basketball, bowling and E-sports facility
Trine Thunder Ice Arena
Zollner Athletic Stadium for Football, Soccer and Lacrosse
Zollner Golf Course Located on campus and known as one of Northeast Indiana's premier golf courses, site of the 2012 NCAA Women′s Golf National Championships.

The posted pic did not come across on my iMac, but in looking through the Trine facility links, I, like you FW, was blown away by what was accomplished in a short 7 years.  The BB arena is scaled for 3,500, but more importantly, it is CONFIGURED as an arena (note the press box and alumni suite overlooking the court), not a gym.  A Valpo version would probably just need  added seating along the sidelines to bring it up to 5K-6K.  The lower bowl is all retractable seating so it still provides 3 courts transverse to the game court.  I won't even go into the FB stadium and it's amenities (seating 5,000) or the 700 seat ice arena with more amenities than just an ice surface and locker room.  They really invested more than $$$.  They invested great forward thinking and strategic planning into the designs.  Even if I was not an athlete, as a HS student visiting the campus and taking a campus tour, my proabable reaction would be -- "wow, first class stuff that looks like a real university; so, this whole place must be good."

It's a great outward-facing representation of the university.  All this with an endowment of ........ wait for this..........$25 million (source: Wikipedia: about 10.6% of Valpo's) and a tuition of #31K vs. Valpo's $36,280.  As FW noted, the enrollment is approximately equal. They also sponsor 28 varsity sports for men and women -- we do 19.   It's worth spending the time going to the links and reading the descriptions.

ONE OTHER IMPORTANT NOTE TO ADD:  This was first embarked upon 7 years ago and that was at the point where our first great recession of the century was still a nightmare.  Doing this then was a BIG gamble, but they had the forethought and courage to make it work.

[VULB#62]

I'd move the Volleyball games to the Hilltop gym if I were in charge. Also I'd imagine the walls would be far enough and high enough back that a ball wouldn't hit it. If we had a complete reno we could flip the direction of the court maybe.

This already has been addressed -- the ceiling does not meet NCAA height requirements.

[VU2014]

I'd move the Volleyball games to the Hilltop gym if I were in charge. Also I'd imagine the walls would be far enough and high enough back that a ball wouldn't hit it. If we had a complete reno we could flip the direction of the court maybe.

This already has been addressed -- the ceiling does not meet NCAA height requirements.

I thought the same thing but someone mentioned they can play games in there.

[vu72]

I'd move the Volleyball games to the Hilltop gym if I were in charge. Also I'd imagine the walls would be far enough and high enough back that a ball wouldn't hit it. If we had a complete reno we could flip the direction of the court maybe.

This already has been addressed -- the ceiling does not meet NCAA height requirements.

I thought the same thing but someone mentioned they can play games in there.

I was told by a staff member that it could be done.  Maybe he was wrong.

[vu72]

It's a great outward-facing representation of the university.  All this with an endowment of ........ wait for this..........$25 million (source: Wikipedia: about 10.6% of Valpo's) and a tuition of #31K vs. Valpo's $36,280.  As FW noted, the enrollment is approximately equal. They also sponsor 28 varsity sports for men and women -- we do 19.   It's worth spending the time going to the links and reading the descriptions.

This difference in endowment really shows in net tuition costs to students.  All based on US News rankings from last year, Trine's tuition is 31,540 with an average financial aid package of 5,433 for a net cost of 26,107.  At the same time Valpo's tuition is 38,760 with an average financial aid package of 26,300 for a net cost of 12,460.

Add in  the fact that they are ranked No. 23 in the Midwest versus #4 for Valpo and that their engineer school is ranked #103 versus Valpo's #14 and the fact that no one has ever heard of Trine and I am not sure why the memory of a shiny new arena would cause a student to pick such a place.  They do have really nice athletic facilities as well as a very precarious financial position.

[VULB#62]

I'd move the Volleyball games to the Hilltop gym if I were in charge. Also I'd imagine the walls would be far enough and high enough back that a ball wouldn't hit it. If we had a complete reno we could flip the direction of the court maybe.

This already has been addressed -- the ceiling does not meet NCAA height requirements.

I thought the same thing but someone mentioned they can play games in there.

I was told by a staff member that it could be done.  Maybe he was wrong.

From the 2017 NCAA Volleyball Rule Book.

1.1.2 Overhead Clearance
1.1.2.1 The playing space includes the playing area and the space above it. The recommended clearance over the playing area is 12.4 meters (41 feet), measured from the playing surface. For facilities constructed after 2006, the space above the playing area must be free of obstruction to a minimum height of 7.62 meters (25 feet) measured from the playing surface.

So it appears that 41' is recommended, but 25' is required?