Butler to move to the A-10?

[valpopal]

This comment by Andy Katz fits with a rumor I recently had heard as well:

"Butler has expressed interest in joining the Atlantic 10 and replacing Temple, according to multiple sources. The Bulldogs are intrigued by the major media markets and, of course, the increase in competition with Xavier, Saint Louis and Dayton among others. The A-10 will lose Temple in the fall of 2013 and must add a quality basketball program."

http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/53114/3-point-shot-3

[historyman]

Also mentioned in that same ESPN piece is that Rex Walters, currently head coach at San Francisco and former Valpo assistant, could be in line for Barry Collier's and Doc Sadler's former position as head coach at Nebraska, coaching in the Big Ten.

2. The Nebraska pool to replace the fired Doc Sadler will get interesting with Ohio's John Groce, a former Ohio State assistant in the Big Ten, now a major player, according to sources. San Francisco's Rex Walters would also be an intriguing choice after playing in the region at Kansas and being born in Nebraska. 

[valpotx]

Much more realistic than their desire of being in the Big East.  I could see this happening, unless someone from the MVC decides to make such a switch, in which case Butler would be considered for the MVC.

[milanmiracle]

The move to the A-10 would be a good fit for them long term. I wouldnt be surprised if they jumped.

[wh]

Several media sources are now reporting this.  I don't fault them for trying to better themselves.  We did the same thing.  If it happens, I wish them the best.

[valpotx]

Say that this happens, which is actually a high likelihood.  What school does the HL replace them with?  I actually like Oakland as a possibility.  Not sure if Detroit will nix this as I have heard that they would, but they bring some solid overall sports teams to the league.  Solid basketball teams traditionally on M&W side, good soccer, competitive baseball, consistent champions in M&W swimming/diving, etc.  Say no to IUPUI and IPFW, who would undoubtedly put in for the conference on a moment's notice.

[valpopal]

The stories in the media accompanied by an absence of denial by Butler seems to confirm the validity of this rumor I had heard in a recent conversation. I would hate to lose Butler, which has proven itself as a first-class program with a large devoted fan base. However, if they do leave the Horizon League, I hope VU does everything it can to continue an annual game with the Bulldogs.

Also, you have to wonder who would be invited to take Butler's spot in the league. There seems to be no strong candidate. IUPUI and IPFW would fit as travel partners for Valpo, though I think most here would prefer Oakland be invited instead since the rivalry between VU and Oakland already exists and their coach is well-liked among Valpo fans. On the other hand, I have heard Detroit would object to Oakland. Other suggestions?

Honestly though, no likely school comes to mind as a choice that would come close to filling the gap left by Butler.

[vu72]

And all along I thought they were moving to the Big 10!!! 

Seriously, not withstanding their great performance in men's basketball (other than a 5th seed this year), can they really compete in the A-10?

Let's look at their recent record in the Horizon in revenue sports:

Men's basketball:          5th seed
Women's basketball:     5th
Men's soccer:               8th
Women's soocer:          6th
Baseball:                     5th
Softball:                      3rd

Valpo's record is better in all of these sports other than women's basketball.

Now throw on the added travel and time away from the classroom to travel to St. Bonnie, or U Mass or Charlotte, plus long bus rides ro Duquene and others? Ask Rick Mejurus at St. Louis how he feels about the travel in the A-10.

Their egos may say GO, but does it really make sense?  What about the exit fee from the Horizon? 

We all know they don't have a football team  but of course they have a really good cross country traditon.  Makes all the sense in the world to fly kids from tennis and swimming all over the place.  Huh?   

[valpotx]

I assume Butler would go back to their 'we are too good to schedule you' mentality, even though we have beaten them 4 times in a row now.  The 'smug' in Indianapolis is getting even thicker...

[vuweathernerd]

The 'smug' in Indianapolis is getting even thicker...

just don't let it collide with george clooney's oscar acceptance speech

*man, i hope somebody gets this reference, or i'm gonna feel real stupid*

[BigDWSU]

And all along I thought they were moving to the Big 10!!! 

Seriously, not withstanding their great performance in men's basketball (other than a 5th seed this year), can they really compete in the A-10?

Let's look at their recent record in the Horizon in revenue sports:

Men's basketball:          5th seed
Women's basketball:     5th
Men's soccer:               8th
Women's soocer:          6th
Baseball:                     5th
Softball:                      3rd

Valpo's record is better in all of these sports other than women's basketball.

Now throw on the added travel and time away from the classroom to travel to St. Bonnie, or U Mass or Charlotte, plus long bus rides ro Duquene and others? Ask Rick Mejurus at St. Louis how he feels about the travel in the A-10.

Their egos may say GO, but does it really make sense?  What about the exit fee from the Horizon? 

We all know they don't have a football team  but of course they have a really good cross country traditon.  Makes all the sense in the world to fly kids from tennis and swimming all over the place.  Huh?   

The A-10 doesn't play everyone home and home.  They divide their league into divisions and play schools in their division home and home and schools in the other division either at home or on the road each year.  So travel isn't as bad as you would think.

I doubt Butler really cares if it finishes in last place in all sports as long as their basketball team is competitive. 

The HL doesn't have a huge exit fee, but Butler would give up their rights to all past earned NCAA money.  The rest of the HL teams would divide up their share.

In the past Detroit has blocked Oakland from joining the HL.  All HL decisions need to be made by a 3/4 vote by HL schools.  Detroit was able to get Loyola and Butler to go along with them to keep Oakland out.  If Butler leaves, I think the HL could now add Oakland since Detroit wouldn't have enough votes to keep them out. 

I don't think IUPUI or IPFW would get enough votes to get invited to the HL.  I think we would be better served to stay at 9 teams than to add either one of them. 

[dylanrocks]

And all along I thought they were moving to the Big 10!!! 

Seriously, not withstanding their great performance in men's basketball (other than a 5th seed this year), can they really compete in the A-10?

Let's look at their recent record in the Horizon in revenue sports:

Men's basketball:          5th seed
Women's basketball:     5th
Men's soccer:               8th
Women's soocer:          6th
Baseball:                     5th
Softball:                      3rd

Valpo's record is better in all of these sports other than women's basketball.

Now throw on the added travel and time away from the classroom to travel to St. Bonnie, or U Mass or Charlotte, plus long bus rides to Duquesne and others? Ask Rick Majerus at St. Louis how he feels about the travel in the A-10.

Their egos may say GO, but does it really make sense?  What about the exit fee from the Horizon? 

We all know they don't have a football team  but of course they have a really good cross country tradition.  Makes all the sense in the world to fly kids from tennis and swimming all over the place.  Huh?   

The A-10 doesn't play everyone home and home.  They divide their league into divisions and play schools in their division home and home and schools in the other division either at home or on the road each year.  So travel isn't as bad as you would think.

I doubt Butler really cares if it finishes in last place in all sports as long as their basketball team is competitive. 

The HL doesn't have a huge exit fee, but Butler would give up their rights to all past earned NCAA money.  The rest of the HL teams would divide up their share.

In the past Detroit has blocked Oakland from joining the HL.  All HL decisions need to be made by a 3/4 vote by HL schools.  Detroit was able to get Loyola and Butler to go along with them to keep Oakland out.  If Butler leaves, I think the HL could now add Oakland since Detroit wouldn't have enough votes to keep them out. 

I don't think IUPUI or IPFW would get enough votes to get invited to the HL. I think we would be better served to stay at 9 teams than to add either one of them.

In the future, please refer to this post when considering the feasibility of Butler's prospective jump to the A-10 or the additions of any Summit League member to the H League.

This is the authoritative take.

[milanmiracle]

And all along I thought they were moving to the Big 10!!! 

Seriously, not withstanding their great performance in men's basketball (other than a 5th seed this year), can they really compete in the A-10?

Let's look at their recent record in the Horizon in revenue sports:

Men's basketball:          5th seed
Women's basketball:     5th
Men's soccer:               8th
Women's soocer:          6th
Baseball:                     5th
Softball:                      3rd

Valpo's record is better in all of these sports other than women's basketball.

Now throw on the added travel and time away from the classroom to travel to St. Bonnie, or U Mass or Charlotte, plus long bus rides ro Duquene and others? Ask Rick Mejurus at St. Louis how he feels about the travel in the A-10.

Their egos may say GO, but does it really make sense?  What about the exit fee from the Horizon? 

We all know they don't have a football team  but of course they have a really good cross country traditon.  Makes all the sense in the world to fly kids from tennis and swimming all over the place.  Huh?   

The A-10 doesn't play everyone home and home.  They divide their league into divisions and play schools in their division home and home and schools in the other division either at home or on the road each year.  So travel isn't as bad as you would think.

I doubt Butler really cares if it finishes in last place in all sports as long as their basketball team is competitive. 

The HL doesn't have a huge exit fee, but Butler would give up their rights to all past earned NCAA money.  The rest of the HL teams would divide up their share.

In the past Detroit has blocked Oakland from joining the HL.  All HL decisions need to be made by a 3/4 vote by HL schools.  Detroit was able to get Loyola and Butler to go along with them to keep Oakland out.  If Butler leaves, I think the HL could now add Oakland since Detroit wouldn't have enough votes to keep them out. 

I don't think IUPUI or IPFW would get enough votes to get invited to the HL.  I think we would be better served to stay at 9 teams than to add either one of them. 

That point pretty much sums up the whole thought process and I can't say that I blame them. They have a chance to improve their brand in basketball and joining the A10 would certainly do that.  Their ability to raise money for the University has taken off like a rocket here in Indy since back to back national championship game appearances so trying to capitalize on that only makes sense.

[milanmiracle]

I assume Butler would go back to their 'we are too good to schedule you' mentality, even though we have beaten them 4 times in a row now.  The 'smug' in Indianapolis is getting even thicker...

If Butler moves onto the A-10, why would they continue the Valpo series? What would they gain? It's possible they do continue the series, as they play Evansville most years but I don't see it. It's not a lock for a win (see multiple losses) and it's not going to help the RPI. Why continue?

[valpotx]

I would say that you continue it because it is a team that is usually in the RPI range of 80-130 or so, and still provides good competition.  I believe Valpo should only schedule teams that have this type of RPI potential, instead of the low 200s/300s.

[milanmiracle]

I would say that you continue it because it is a team that is usually in the RPI range of 80-130 or so, and still provides good competition.  I believe Valpo should only schedule teams that have this type of RPI potential, instead of the low 200s/300s.

I'd agree with you but there's a problem. That games doesn't have the potential to be a good win, but it does have the possibility to be a bad loss. Don't get me wrong I would love for it to continue, but I don't see it happening.

[valporun]

I agree... if Butler does go to the A-10, then the "rivalry" games will end again. Butler fans will insist that the Bulldogs only schedule teams that they will want to see Butler play, and have good games with. Our winning the last four games against them wouldn't help our cause of staying on their schedule.

[setshot]

If Butler leaves (hope so) it will be because we drove them out. 4 in a row in MBB, and 2-0 in WBB this year. Now, a win in the PFL would be the icing on the cake,or the slobber on the Bulldog. GO VALPO!

[valpo95]

It strikes me that some of the fan anger against Butler is misdirected.  Valpo would miss out on a fine in-state rival on many levels.  The league would be weaker with their departure.

It is far better just to regularly beat Butler and have them as a rival. 

[VUfan]

Maybe as Butler's travel partner we will go to the A10 also... the Butler effect? right!!

[Gametime]

If Butler leaves (hope so) it will be because we drove them out. 4 in a row in MBB, and 2-0 in WBB this year. Now, a win in the PFL would be the icing on the cake,or the slobber on the Bulldog. GO VALPO!

One bad season for Butler Men's Basketball (Which has dominated the league the past few years) wouldn't mean that Valpo drove them out.

[StlVUFan]

I assume this opened up because of Temple.  Otherwise I would consider this to be a bit pathetic (finally shut out of ncaa tourney, gonna take our marbles and go play elsewhere).  I trust it is because of Temple, which still reminds us they have been waiting for such an opportunity.  Food for thought...

[crusaderjoe]

Maybe as Butler's travel partner we will go to the A10 also... the Butler effect? right!!

Very clever post. 

That would be something though if Butler left and took someone else from the HL along.  Anyone up for the A-16, a la the WAC of the mid 90's?

   

[78crusader]

A Butler move -- which seems possible if not probable -- would hurt the HL, academically as well as athletically.  Conferences need good academic schools like Butler.  And the move would hurt VU with the loss of an in-state rival. 

I can't blame them, though, if they feel it's the right move.  VU (correctly) determined the Horizon was a better league, for a number of reasons, than the Mid-Con. 

Sometimes I wish the old Indiana Collegiate Conference was still around.  Life was simpler then.  And less expensive.
]
Paul

[staxawax]

If Butler leaves (hope so) it will be because we drove them out. 4 in a row in MBB, and 2-0 in WBB this year. Now, a win in the PFL would be the icing on the cake,or the slobber on the Bulldog. GO VALPO!

One bad season for Butler Men's Basketball (Which has dominated the league the past few years) wouldn't mean that Valpo drove them out.

One sensible post in this entire thread.

Big East?  Really?  No mature poster on the Butler Board EVER proposed such a thing.  The only thought about Big East schools were the basketball only schools around the midwest forming a BBL only league........ Dayton, X, Marquette, Butler, St. Louis, Depaul among others.  It makes too much sense so it will never happen.  I'm not even going to acknowledge the rest of the self-serving ignorant posts on this thread.  You guys are embarrassing yourselves.

As far as the A-10, if it happens then fine.  Barry Collier has been the orchestrator of many positive changes for Butler's athletic program.  I'm sure if this happens it's been in the plans for awhile.  If not, I'm fine with staying in the Horizon.  And, I enjoy playing Valpo every year, even when you guys win. 

Please don't turn in to most of the other schools message boards in this league and declare supremacy just because you have recent success against the benchmark team.  Finish the deal first and win the dang tournament........ or else you'll end up in the NIT seeded BEHIND Cleveland State.  Yeah, that just happened.

OK, my rant is done.  Most of you know I'm usually pretty even keeled and complimentary of Valpo's program, coaches, team and most of these posters.......... not this time!