A national must see....

[LaPorteAveApostle]

yeah, both startups:

http://www.valpoathletics.com/football/coaches/

and

http://ohiodominicanpanthers.com/sports/fball/archive

so, yeah, maybe the guy you want running a new tech corp, rather than a FB team.

Hey, Jeff Jagodzinski (ex-BC) is down here just helping out with the Ave Maria FB team.  Maybe he'd be willing

[VULB#62]

I have also been very patient with the situation.  I was extremely enthused by this hire and his past experiences and having been in his shoes as a coach I still have to believe that his record of program startup and turnaround gives his "system" some credibility.  This kind of program change just does not happen by accident.  He has done a very good job in the past.  I will admit that the bloom is coming off the rose a little bit for me making me wonder what is so different at VU versus his other programs.

IF I understand correctly, I think his other two programs were startups vs. bringing back from the dead. I know that Tri State was a startup, I can't verify Ohio Dominican. I think it's easier to build from nothing in this case, than it is to change a culture of losing. Take a look at Marian University in Indianapolis. They have a completely new program, with new facilities, and great coaches (who might I add is a Northern Indiana native). I think this has been a much bigger challenge than even Coach Carlson anticipated.

It is.  The paint on the locker room walls is new, the pads and uniforms smell new - there are no sweat stains.  No scuffs on the helmets.  First year, it's usually just scrimmages (follow both Mercer and Stetson's FB site). The field and stands are new (check out the building programs that predated the first recruit at Mercer and Stetson as well).  An investment is readily apparent and there is no baggage.  Any little progress increases campus enthusiasm.  And when the first few games result in losses it's to be expected.  Even a winless season does not dampen enthusiasm much -- it kinda was expected too.

Contrast that with turning around a losing program with a long history of failure    ....and little in the way of additional visible investment to mark a distinct break between the past and the future.  The honeymoon is short.  The first season is a pass but after that ...   the program has to once again carry all that past baggage in addition to improving and winning games.  So when Lou Saban goes into Alabama, the money flows into buildings, training facilities and other things that tangibly mark the difference between the past and the future (except they kept the uniforms the same).  This is not Alabama, but the principle is still proportionally valid.

[LaPorteAveApostle]

So when Lou Saban goes into Alabama

Careful...your age is clouding your otherwise great analysis

[90]

By year three there must be improvement, something we are not seeing here.  True that this challenge was/is a big one, but enough is enough.  Carlson does not seem flexible enough to abandon or modify his "system" for the good of his athletes or the university.  He has driven the program further into the ground.  In retrospect, the excitement over his hiring was probably optimistic considering starting a program and turning one around are obviously different things.  This next recruiting class will be a disaster if he is given another year.  I, as a parent, would not be on board with my son committing to play for Valpo.  Can't imagine that his promises will continue to yield "better athletes."  Start the search now so we don't hear the excuse that the new HC gets a pass because he came in late in the recruiting process! Also, give the current underclassmen hope for the future!  The system is not working!

[jetz]

As ever, if you build it (and change the dry campus thing), they will come.

[vu72]

As ever, if you build it (and change the dry campus thing), they will come.

Yeah!  Look at what that policy has done to the basketball, soccer, baseball, softball, volleyball, bowling and golf teams!! 

[usc4valpo]

FWIW Valpo is the only FCS school, I believe, in northern Indiana and is 118 miles away from the closest FCS school, NIU, in the midwest. Butler is 154 miles south and Indiana State is 168 miles south as well. There are no FCS programs to the east and none into lower Michigan. That we are in the middle of Northwestern, Purdue and ND (FBS schools) is not an issue -- the kids we want could maybe walk on (a few of them) but wouldn't be offered scholarships. We want kids who are FCS caliber kids who fell through the MVFC cracks or kids who would warrant a D-II FB scholarship, but would rather attend and play for a national D-I university. They are out there. Valpo just has to get them to enroll. But a pathetic W-L record since 2007 (10-52) and only 2 wins in the last 4 seasons with most losses of the epic scale does not inspire players to risk it. A high school senior didn't even check college FB scores until just a year or two ago. Maybe as junior he might even check college athletic web sites to research what schools (and their records and facilities) he might consider. Either way, he has only one memory of VU football -- lopsided losses. In his mind Valpo and winning do not compute. Past PFL titles are ancient history. It comes down to winning some games, sure, but that is not enough. If I was a young man considering attending a university like Valpo purely for academics and campus life (OK, Milan maybe not the party life ), it would certainly be in the mix and has much to draw my attention. However, if I were that same young man, but also loved football and wanted to continue to play football as an undergraduate, right now I wouldn't sign up. That's because no matter what people tell me on my visit on a recruiting trip, the physical evidence I would see around me would cause me to question the university's commitment to the one athletic program that I want to be a part of. Then I go to Butler and see the new Butler Bowl. I visit a D-III school like Franklin or DePauw and note how nice the football surroundings are. I want to feel good about my decision and my 4 year experience. I conclude that I don't want to lose most of my games over 4 years at a school that hasn't made the same commitment to football that I did.

Northern Illinois plays in the MAC in the FBS (or something but used to be Div. 1), not FCS.

[usc4valpo]

BTW, how did the subject change on this topic?  We are trying to promote Gameday!

I feel bad for the coach but the university is not committing the way they need to.  Either do it right or get rid of football.

[VULB#62]

So when Lou Saban goes into Alabama

Careful...your age is clouding your otherwise great analysis

Waddaya mean?  Lou of course dropped in on the Bear many times to trade Buffalo Bills / Crimson Tide philosophies.   

ARGHHHH!  You spotted that just in the nick of time!

[LaPorteAveApostle]

You spotted that just in the

Nick of time?


I am the only one who would catch that, as I am a Bills fan who lived in T-town for a few months 3 years ago.  Always got them mixed up--to the amusement of Alabamians...

[usc4valpo]

At Buies Creek, NC where Sagarin ranked 244 Valpo and 245 Campbell slug it out for the worst team in Division I.  How often in college football history have the two worst Divsion I teams in America faced each other?   We have heard about #1 vs. #2 battles and the battles of the century, but to see the 2 worst teams battle in a multiple false start-offside, inconsistent excuse mindaching contest is one for the ages.

The heck with the Tide's dominating defense, the Ducks's TD in a minute offense, K-State multiple draw plays, and Brian Kelly looking constpated on the sidelines - who wants that? 

[VULB#62]

Eloquently articulated!   

[usc4valpo]

thanks, I am actually suprised this has not gotten any national exposure - I mean, someone has to see this coming up.

[VULB#62]

Probably because Campbell has been fairly competitive lately.  They don't bring a three year 1 - 29 record into the game. They are 10-20 and coming off a 6-5 season in 2011.

[LaPorteAveApostle]

So we are #245, sandwiched between Davidson and Campbell.

The good news is the ELO-CHESS, which the BCS uses, has us ahead of both of them!

...

Unfortunately, the PREDICTOR (which does wot it says on the tin) says we will lose to both of them!


I do have to add, though, as a Tigers fan, that it was actually kind of perversely fun in 2003.  And the same is true about VU football.  Call it a rubbernecking, gapers' delay, whatever, but it's beyond train wreck bad and now we're all talking about it perhaps more than we would otherwise...

[usc4valpo]

245  Valparaiso           AA =  18.45    0   8   44.47( 204)    0   0  |    0   0  |   20.25  244 |   17.81  246
246  Campbell             AA =  17.64    1   7   43.06( 221)    0   0  |    0   0  |   13.09  246 |   18.02  245

we will need to do a serious breakdown on this game. We should get Lou Holtz to evaluate how many "outstanding" players are on both sides.

[historyman]

thanks, I am actually suprised this has not gotten any national exposure - I mean, someone has to see this coming up.

I believe it is not mentioned because most people come to realize that in the end it only serves to hurt the humans and their psyche who are behind the teams that represent their schools.

[VULB#62]

245  Valparaiso           AA =  18.45    0   8   44.47( 204)    0   0  |    0   0  |   20.25  244 |   17.81  246
246  Campbell             AA =  17.64    1   7   43.06( 221)    0   0  |    0   0  |   13.09  246 |   18.02  245

we will need to do a serious breakdown on this game. We should get Lou Holtz to evaluate how many "outstanding" players are on both sides.

At 0-8 (vs. 1-7) can't understand why we are not #246.  Must be because we got thrashed by more respectable opponents (YSU and Duquesne)?

[vu72]

I'm afraid Coach Carlson's enthusiasm is waning as well.  His last blog post was Dayton Pregame.  Let's hope they can pull it together and finish out strong(er).

[VULB#62]

Noticed the same thing.  I usually monitor his Twitter and Facebook accounts too -- very few postings, most are retweets.

[milanmiracle]

I'm afraid Coach Carlson's enthusiasm is waning as well.  His last blog post was Dayton Pregame.  Let's hope they can pull it together and finish out strong(er).

Noticed the same thing.  I usually monitor his Twitter and Facebook accounts too -- very few postings, most are retweets.

Maybe the writing's on the wall? I do have to wonder about somebody who preaches enthusiasm, commitment, and all the other motivational speaking terms he uses quitting on something like the football blog. Maybe there's a good reason, or to quote my wife...maybe he can't swallow his own kool aid anymore.

[usc4valpo]

a

thanks, I am actually suprised this has not gotten any national exposure - I mean, someone has to see this coming up.

I believe it is not mentioned because most people come to realize that in the end it only serves to hurt the humans and their psyche who are behind the teams that represent their schools.

I have to wonder if the sensitometer is a bit high.  We are talking football, bad football , and football is part of the toy department of life (quoting Howard Cosell to an extent) . No one is getting hurt.  If you want people bumming out, check out Hurricane Sandy and the politicians from both parties lying away while we have a $16T deficit.  The players from both teams will be fine, hopefully taking advantage of a quality education (if they have their priorities set) and learning to persevere from this.  The upcoming game is an interesting story which does not happen often by probability.

[90]

I'm afraid Coach Carlson's enthusiasm is waning as well.  His last blog post was Dayton Pregame.  Let's hope they can pull it together and finish out strong(er).

Noticed the same thing.  I usually monitor his Twitter and Facebook accounts too -- very few postings, most are retweets.

Maybe the writing's on the wall? I do have to wonder about somebody who preaches enthusiasm, commitment, and all the other motivational speaking terms he uses quitting on something like the football blog. Maybe there's a good reason, or to quote my wife...maybe he can't swallow his own kool aid anymore.

I certainly can't swallow his kool aid anymore and obviously the team can't either.  You can blog and tweet all the motivational inspiration you want, but after awhile you have to show results.  That's not happening so I prefer no news from him.  He needs to speak through dramatic improvement on the field. Sadly, I think there is no way he can dig himself out of the gigantic hole he has put this team in.  Time to move on!

[VULB#62]

I'm afraid Coach Carlson's enthusiasm is waning as well.  His last blog post was Dayton Pregame.  Let's hope they can pull it together and finish out strong(er).

Noticed the same thing.  I usually monitor his Twitter and Facebook accounts too -- very few postings, most are retweets.

Maybe the writing's on the wall? I do have to wonder about somebody who preaches enthusiasm, commitment, and all the other motivational speaking terms he uses quitting on something like the football blog. Maybe there's a good reason, or to quote my wife...maybe he can't swallow his own kool aid anymore.

Checked Facebook.  Pictures of the 5 players of the game for Marist were posted.  As is previous postings there were no names attached to them.  That was OK in the past when there was a post game blog post that told us what each kid did special.  Without the blog (now missing:  Dayton wrap-up, Marist preview, Marist wrap-up and possibly Campbell preview....) it's really hard to identify te kids.  That does a disservice to those of us who care and to the kids themselves.

[milanmiracle]

I'm afraid Coach Carlson's enthusiasm is waning as well.  His last blog post was Dayton Pregame.  Let's hope they can pull it together and finish out strong(er).

Noticed the same thing.  I usually monitor his Twitter and Facebook accounts too -- very few postings, most are retweets.

Maybe the writing's on the wall? I do have to wonder about somebody who preaches enthusiasm, commitment, and all the other motivational speaking terms he uses quitting on something like the football blog. Maybe there's a good reason, or to quote my wife...maybe he can't swallow his own kool aid anymore.

Checked Facebook.  Pictures of the 5 players of the game for Marist were posted.  As is previous postings there were no names attached to them.  That was OK in the past when there was a post game blog post that told us what each kid did special.  Without the blog (now missing:  Dayton wrap-up, Marist preview, Marist wrap-up and possibly Campbell preview....) it's really hard to identify te kids.  That does a disservice to those of us who care and to the kids themselves.

I don't mind if he decided to stop the blog, for whatever reason, but it would have been nice to release a statement saying as much.